rubber horseshoes...

[NINA WANTSA COB]

Do rubber horseshoes prevent a horse from damaging another horse more so than if the horse were unshod?:confused:

I own a misunderstood kicker who likes to be with other horses, but kicks out at them half the time if they get in her space...

Thanks
xxx Nina xxx

[Bronya]

Kickers should never have back shoes unless they're stabled 24/7 or in individual turnout paddocks. Most horses are absolutely fine without back shoes and many don't have them because they have been known to kick. That would be far cheaper than any type of plastic shoe you'd be able to get.

I know you're looking for a new yard. I doubt any yard would take a kicker with back shoes still on. She may not mean to hurt, but with shoes on, she could very easily break another horse's leg, and that type of injury is far too frequent anyway. As far as grass livery goes, I doubt any yard would take a known kicker, even with shoes off. Look for somewhere with individual turnout paddocks, that's your best bet.

The bottom line is that your horse, with shoes on, could kill someone else's, by accident. Can you blame them for not wanting her in the same field as their horse?

[Maddison's girl]

I have a kicker, although we keep her in a livery yard we have our own field to turn her out in. I do keep her in a field with my other two though. She is fine with my gelding and youngster mare. Her only problem is when another dominent horse comes in, or if the herd is too big. We just keep her barefoot at the back. Its taken us a while to find the right herd situation for her but does seem to be working now.

its a frustrating problem isnt it!

[NINA WANTSA COB]

Melia - She hates being in a field by herself, which is the only reason we might move her.

Maddison's girl - It is frustrating!:o


Thank you both for your help, but I still don't know if a horse does less damage with rubber shoes on than with none on at all. I can't stop imagining her with cushions stuck to feet - problem solved! :rolleyes:

xxx Nina xxx

P.S. This is what I mean (i.e. not the rubber shoes that have steel inside them): http://www.giltspurscientific.com/page7.htm

[Bay Mare]

I'd want a kicker to be barefoot behind. Not only is the impact less but, apparently, they 'know' where the ends of their feet are so 'warning' kicks tend to miss their mark whereas they'd impact if they had shoes on whether rubber or not.

It's easier for horses to go unshod behind and you could always use hoof boots if they weren't coping with the work that you wanted them to do.

[carthorse]

Rubber shoes are still going to give more of a blow than no shoes IMO. Also they can shorten the horses gait, mask lameness & don't give very good grip on muddy ground so I'd think very carefully about using them. I used them for a few years on my old semi-retired pony who couldn't cope without shoes and they made his arthritus comfier but that was after long discussions with my vet & farrier. I think you'd be better unshod behind & maybe using boots to ride or getting her a companion (maybe even a sheep or something?) & keeping her turned out seperately from other peoples horses.

[Trio]

i think no shoes are a safer bet- as has already been said- she knows where the end of her hoof is then. But - surely it's better if she kicks that she is on her own- you can get nice individual paddocks which have paddocks adjoining so she's have company nearby but wouldn't have the problem of other horses invading her space.

[Poppy Langdon]

I would leave unshod if you intend to turn out with other horses, but even unshod there can still be damage. How do other people feel about your horse being turned out with theirs? I would not want my horse in the same field as a known kicker, misunderstood or not! I have seen the devestating caused by a 'kicker' which resulted in an elderly mare having to be put down with a shattered leg.....

[Jessey]

I doubt the rubber shoes would make any real difference :o I would just stick to barefoot.
I note you say your mare likes to be with others but still kicks them and is misunderstood - I just wondered what makes you make these statements?
I have a mare who kicks, yet she never once kicked out at our old boy but will at my younger and boss gelding Bo, my mare is independant and dominant, she does want company but not if they will challange her in any way :rolleyes: typical mare :D She has now settled with Bo and doesn't tend to kick him, but he has also learnt not to push his luck and to get out of the way. I just have the 2 of them together as she gets really agressive with other mares esp and is much better with just him :p

Perhaps finding one calm, quiet and possibly older gelding might be the answer to getting your mare to settle down?

J x

[NINA WANTSA COB]

Thank you all for your advice, especially you, Jessey - that last post is getting at what I mean:

My horse was in an all mare field of roughly 6, but then they moved all of the mares in together in one big field which contained roughly 10, maybe MORE:eek: (a very stupid idea if you ask me but there you are...)
She had been accused of kicking one horse who had gone lame with a small kick wound (not serious, but did make her lame for a bit) and had apparently tried to kick another horse but missed or the horse moved or something and she got a member of staff instead on the thigh - she's fine, bless her, but was bruised.

So, quite rightfully, they moved her into a field by herself - she was galloping up and down it for weeks, rearing and galloping off to talk to the other horses over the fence (there is a large gap between her field and the others) when I was catching her in and turning her out. So they tried her in a field that was directly next to the boys - so that she could talk to them. She was quite a bit happier in there, but she jumped the fence to get in with them so I had to move her back to the original field. (I must say that she looked the happiest I have ever seen her for a long time when she was in with the 8 or so boys, not kicking or anything)

So then she went into another field which is normally used for isolation, but when an isolation horse came, she had to move back to her original field - so now she isn't allowed in a field with other horses or in one that's directly next to other horses.:(
She didn't like it still for ages, in that she was thrashing around and rearing and broke out twice - once when the gate was open and the other she actually leant on the fence until it broke.

Now she's in the same field but has calmed down, but is still far from happy. Whenever we go past another horse (especially geldings) she desperately tries to drag me over to them, whether we're riding or if she's in hand.
The worst thing is is that the horse she's meant to have kicked was kicking out at the fence of the jumping arena (it's directly next to a mares field) everytime this other horse rode past, and when me and Bella were out hacking, and I let go and touch noses with this mare over the fence, Bella did nothing but the other horse squeeled and tried to kick her through the fence!:eek: How fair is that? Both horses kick but one is allowed out in a field with other horses but the other isn't! I've also seen 2 other mares from the same field turn and double barrel each other.


So, in short, I think Bella would benefit from being unshod and part of a nice small herd of mixed sexes, with no other dominant mares present...?:confused:

Thank you for all your advice, and sorry that this post is so wordy!:o

xxx Nina xxx

[Jessey]

I totally get you, generally 10 mares would be fine, but they would have to fight to get the pecking order sorted out and obviously your mare was just the one who got caught :(

I totally agree your mare sounds just like mine, just dominant and being challanged doesn't do her or anyone else any favors - at the same time don't let her get away with that - mine pushed her luck and I was the one who ended up being kicked badly as she wouldn't even take my requests :mad: my boy is a leader, but being a gelding he is not challanging her for the position she holds - just bossing her about :D that works for us.

I would definatly be looking for another yard that has small herd groups, and explain she is dominant and putting her with more laid back types prevents squabbling, esp if they could be boys OR maybe speaking with your yard owner and explaining that she is fine with boys and one friend would really help :p

My new yard (since October) was happy to take my two on, but my girl isn't allowed out with other mares, but my gelding is allowed with others if need be. Their paddock is surrounded on 3 side by a mix of mares and geldings and they seem to get on over the fence quite happily - most of the time, but even then I wouldn't want her in with them just in case even though she is barefoot etc :o

[NINA WANTSA COB]

Thank you so much, Jessey, I understand and agree with everything you just said! :D
My yard is big and busy - not a good combination for an easily-stressed, dominant 15hh cob mare! She would prefer somewhere smaller and quieter with a consistent small herd. It's just finding somewhere near us that is like that...:o

Thanks again, your advice really helps.
xxx Nina xxx

[Jessey]

Don't let big and busy put you off ;) I just moved from a 12 horse yard (with just 5 owners inc me) to a yard with 24 horses and almost as many owners, its manic but their routine (I have mine on livery) is very regular and mine have settled in really well :D

[NINA WANTSA COB]

That's great - good for you! But Bella just doesn't like lots of things happening around her, coz she came from a tiny yard to a huge yard and I think she preferred the peace and quiet...

xxx Nina xxx

[Pink's lady]

She doesn't sound like a kicker at all - she sounds just like a normal horse. ANY horse can and will kick out in a herd situation. It's natural and to be expected. None of my lot, nor any of their field companions, are 'kickers' but there are still flying feet on occaions. All the horses are barefoot behind but we won't hesitate to shoe then if needs be. If you won't risk your horse being kicked, don't turn them out with other horses.

I'd be moving ASAP (sounds like you already are) to somewhere that understands that horses will be horses.

[NINA WANTSA COB]

EXACTLY! :rolleyes:

Thanks, Pink's lady.

xxx Nina xxx