I survived the Andrew McLean clinic this w/e

[VickiGG]

hi all - well I was a bundle of nerves thinking about this clinic...there are quite a few spectators at these clinics and only 8 riders. The spectators sit above you in an indoor arena - tiered seats - quite intimidating - when you ride the long wall (B side) you can hear whispers....and candy wrappers etc! Andrew had a microphone system so we also had to ride past a loud speaker. :eek:

Anyway - despite getting the one and only head cold of the last 2 years, on Friday - I battled through and overheated in the ground work sessions and the riding, and tried to get the most from the weekend... :rolleyes:

I am going to post some photos soon... Garbo was an angel - he was a bit worried about the long drive there - it was an hour - on motorways - but after there and back both days he was fine by the last trip home - but he was pleased to be home last night. :)

Garbo didn't spook in the indoor arena despite all of the above.... Andrew figured out that he didn't know that leg pressure back from the girth meant move sideways.

It was a long day sitting through 7 other lessons so by the time it came to our turn I was a bit nervous so some old habits crept in - it was really hard to concentrate and hear him sometimes... but Andrew figured out that his falling in and cutting corners is a symptom of his not understanding the leg yield aid.
so he got me to tap his side with the whip to reinforce the leg aid and I warned him that he would kick - of course he did - and buck - he told me to keep going till he got it.

Ten minutes later after providing the most interesting, amusing lesson of the day for everyone - Andrew asked if I wanted him to get on, I said ok.!!

He said at the moment he thinks the whip means leap! ie he is trying to remove the pressure any way possible. He persisted with Andrew too which was good (not just me) and after another few minutes he had him leg yielding beautifully across the arena both ways with just leg back and then I did!!
Well mine was not as pretty but hey!
No leaping or bucking.

He calls it conflict behaviour - when they don't understand, he had him leg yielding into corners after that and not falling in!
Amazing...

I'll post some ground work piccies and a short video as soon as I feel better...

[Chinarider]

Sounds like you had a great time:D

Sorry to hear your a bit under the weather, get well soon.

Looking forward to seeing the pics :p

[Dina]

I was wondering how you got on,someone on another forum I post on went and I told them to look out for you and they said they saw a gorgeous palomino so I figured it must have been you :)
Sounds like you a great time,looking forward to seeing the pics of your gorgeous boy:D
Hope your feeling better soon :)

[Waikato Valuta]

Just wanted to mention that I have an extremely negative experience with this lot. Please keep an carefully open mind when thinking of sending a horse for training at his establishment.

I don’t want to say anymore because I have been banned from other riding sites when talking about my experience with this mob. Just be careful. This goes for any trainer you never know what really goes on.

That said, I also know people who have had positive experiences.

[Little Dolphins]

hi Vicki, hope you're feeling better today!
Wow, what a long and concentrating-ful day you had !

It must have been very gratifying to achieve such a result in your session:D

We all look forward to enjoying your pics(and I for one will be looking out for your usual carefully coordinated colourscheme!), so hurry up with them, eh?:) :) :)

[Whatanejit]

Oh well done Vicki and well done Garbo for putting up with everything.

Sounds like a fabulous experience.

Can't wait to see the pics.

Get well soon.

[VickiGG]

ok - thanks everyone... and feeling alot better now so here they are!!

Dina - who was the person you knew? There was a lovely paint horse there...

well I just LOVE this photo....looks very European don't you think....

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c188/VickiGG/IMG_0015-1.jpg

LD - you'll see my colour scheme in the video - the ground work one I had un-co-ordinated gumboots on!

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c188/VickiGG/IMG_0018-3.jpg

and here is the video....
Andrew took only a few minutes to teach Garbo that whip tap (then leg back only) means move sideways - not leap.
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c188/VickiGG/th_LegYieldAMCNRversion.jpg (http://s27.photobucket.com/albums/c188/VickiGG/?action=view&current=LegYieldAMCNRversion.flv)

Garbo was showing what he calls conflict behaviour - didn't know what the answer was - so we had to show him what the right answer was by removing the pressure as soon as it moved sideways - eventually - as you see just using leg back as the signal. Garbo had done this before so it was great he did it on the day because then we were able to sort it out - and so quickly - honestly - took five minutes.!

I need to practice with more leg yield on the ground and in saddle and then Garbo's falling in should be a thing of the past!

[Little Dolphins]

Fantastic! What a result!!

And Vicki, you look so elegant in the neutral tones, even WITH wellies:D

Garbo's looking very very handsome, isn't he?!

[Ruskii]

Dont know why, but I think that first pic is absolutely lovely.

Glad you had a great time :D

[teabiscuit]

great post!

thanks for the report, it sounds as if it was time well spent :D

[coverblown]

he certainly is gorgeous. Looks like a great lesson, well done x

[teabiscuit]

just seen the vid-thanks for sharing :D

[VickiGG]

glad you liked the attire! :) - he's nice and easy to match to. You should have seen him with his chocolate brown travelling boots - it was the cutest thing.

Poor thing - he was trembling when we arrived on the first day - after an hour on the motorway - OH said he probably thought I was selling him :eek:

He was fine after I took him home again that night - and even the next day...

But Andrew was saying - he did a thesis on Equine Behaviour - that horses cannot think back to a time 6 months ago when that happened - but when they see a stimulis they can recall the fear or flight response - called spontaneous recovery when they run again (flight response) due to said stimulis.

He really reiterates that you have to use operant conditioning - teach one thing at a time until it becomes easy and the horse does not have to think about it anymore - then you can teach another. ie obedience to the aid first, then rythym with obedience, then straightness, then roundness, engagement and collection (for EACH aid).

[VickiGG]

oh - the other thing I thought was really interesting....

The muscles the horse uses to slow down or take shorter steps (or stop) are the same muscles you need to strengthen to be able to gain a strong topline - and therefore roundness and eventually collection. So by practising lengthening and shortening in walk and trot (lots) - and canter when you can (I am not up to that yet) without worrying about the head then you can build up the strength for them to relax from the poll. He said you should never feel more than the lips and tongue on the bit (no more than 200gms in the reins). More than that and you are forcing the head into a position it's not ready for. That's what I like the most about this method of training. :)

[Dina]

Great pics and vid :) Garbo is looking his usual handsome self.
The person I knew who went just went to watch in the audience.

[VickiGG]

I tried out some of my new skills yesterday.

A week ago Garbo sniffed an electric fence while I was on board - YIKES - and since then he just won't go into that paddock - thinks it's the gate that bit him! Everytime I tried to ride him towards it he would turn away or plant his feet.

Andrew said "The motivation of the aids must be stronger than the motivation of the environment" - I have been saying that to myself all week (because Garbo gets VERY distracted when we ride) - and so yesterday we headed towards the nasty electric shock paddock and he dug his feet in and stopped and snorted. (Please note I had already spent 30 minutes the other day inhand taking him back and forth through the gate until he was calmly walking through it).... but no - yesterday it was the big scary electric shock gate again.

So immediately I tapped the whip twice in a row on his shoulder and guess what????? He walked calmly into the paddock...okay he had his eye on the gate (very closely - just in case it was suddenly going to leap out and bite him) - but we walked through a few times after that and there was no rushing or stopping - and whip not needed again.

I was so pleased.

I am feeling better again now - OH now has said cold.... :rolleyes: and thinking back to the clinic - I was feeling so crap - imagine how much I would have got out of it feeling normal?? :mad:

Anyway - some other stuff you might be interested in....

When you lead your horse from the paddock to the stable - do you use a go and stop aid on the lead rope? Or does your horse simply follow your legs - you move he moves, you stop he stops? What we learned what that this way is great - until you need to get your horse to stand still while you move away.

Suddenly you move away (to do up the girth on the other side, or to back off the trailer which your horse has just loaded into) and they move too - and we tell them off or correct them.... for moving - when all they are doing is what they always do....you move - they move.

So - Andrew McLean says you should ask your horse to move forward by a forwards pull on the lead rope (while your feet are still standing still) - then you move off.... and when you stop - ask with a backwards pull (once - not constant) on the rope - but keep moving your own feet....then stop once horse had stopped. Horse should stop n three beats. Otherwise they are learning to go and stop by association rather than by an aid. So - biggest challenge - to remember to use the stop aid when you arrive at the stable to tie up your horse. It's really hard to remember to do.

So - once you have that - unless you ask your horse (with the aid) to move forwards or back - theoretically they 'park' - this is us practsing park....

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c188/VickiGG/IMG_0012-1.jpg

Here's a photo of Garbo (and I - see unco-ordinated feet!) - trying leg yield inhand...

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c188/VickiGG/IMG_0037.jpg

and

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c188/VickiGG/IMG_0046-2.jpg

[teabiscuit]

really hard to remember not to move when you ask them to move

that is a challenge!!!
mine does exactly what you said in your post, i never thought about it before now
:)

thanks so much for sharing all this with us

[VickiGG]

oh - one more thing - okay - "who is the most handsome horse of all?"

okay - well the paint is kinda pretty
and the gray is kinda cute.....

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c188/VickiGG/IMG_0022-1.jpg

[VickiGG]

ok - I know this is a post with myself (I seem to be doing more posting that anyone :) ) but I re-read what I wrote from beneath my headcold - and it made no sense what so ever... so I know you are probably all bored of this - but this version of the weekend (off my blog) makes so much more sense.... for anyone that wants to have a read....

Last weekend was the Andrew McLean clinic for Garbo and I. Garbo didn't like the one hour drive via three motorways very much the first day - he was shaking and sweating a bit on arrival at Ambury Park - but by day two he was much more relaxed about the trip each way, each day. I was really nervous because it was a lot of new things for Garbo and I - an indoor arena, spectators - some serial spectators at that - speaker system! But didn't spook at anything -he was so well behaved - took it all in his stride - even being penned up with hay all day. He had 7 other new horsey friends to chat with and snooze with so he was pretty laid back about the whole thing.

Day One was ground work in the morning - reinforcing the stop and go aids so that they are clear and light - not moving before the horse moves, not stopping before the horse stops - so that they don't just create an association with your moving/non moving legs. This is fine until you need them to stay on a float or stand still while you tighten the girth on the other side.

Then the afternoon we had a group lesson with three others. It was really hot in the arena and I had a terrible head cold, so felt really bad - it was so much harder to concentrate - but we got through. We worked on controlling where Garbo placed his front feet mainly... if you control the location and speed of the feet - everything is calm, Andrews says.

Another thing Andrew says which has really stuck with me is "Motivation of the Aids must be stronger than Motivation of the Environment". This rings true for me having Garbo who is so affected by the other horses, feed buckets, people walking by etc. I tried it out yesterday when riding him into a paddock he decided is scary after last week sniffing the electric fence outrigger - he stalled so I tapped his shoulder two times with the whip and he simply just walked into the paddock YAY. Going to try that tomorrow with the corner poo pile too!

The following day we had another ground lesson and worked on leg yielding. He said horses that have a go problem often have a leg yield problem....turns out horses that fall in and cut corners (Garbo) also have a leg yield problem.

I was the last individual lesson which was kinda good because some of the spectators had left by the time we came to ride. I was still burning up and also drowsy from the pills I took - but we soldiered on - as you do!

Andrew was pleased with our lengthening and shortening of strides, and stops, and transitions so then he asked for leg yield. He asked me to reinforce the aid with a whip tap - Garbo started bucking and leaping but he told me to keep trying. Andrew offered to get on and explain to Garbo that a whip tap does not mean leap (the same leaps Garbo does when stressed at competitions).... and within three minutes Garbo was leg yielding beautifully across the arena with Andrew on board, with leg back aid only. I was really impressed. Then I got on and no leaping for me either! Yay.

So - we have to practise

* stopping in three beats of the rhythm
* downwards transitions in three beats
* shortening, then lengthening the walk and trot and canter to build topline
* keeping the stop and Go light and instant

He has a series of processes each aid or gait must go through

* Basic Attempt
* Obedience
* Rhythm (cruise control)
* Straightness
* Contact

and they must only be done in this order....you cannot ask for straightness without rhythm and so on....

This is practising the stop in three beats of the rhythm (how on earth do you spell that word??)

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c188/VickiGG/IMG_0007-4.jpg

[poohsmate]

great photos vicki.. sounds like you had a great time:D :D just one thing am i the only person on NR who has never heard of andrew mclean:eek: :eek: and what does he do:confused:

[VickiGG]

No - I doubt many would have - he is from Australia - here is his 'blurb' He has completed his PhD at the university of Melbourne. The title of this thesis is "The Mental Processes of The Horse and their Consequences for Training". His hypothesis of the evolutionary origin of mental abilities in mammals and birds has been published in the elite peer-reviewed journal Applied Animal Behaviour Science. He has also published various experiments on horse behaviour in that journal. Andrew has co-authored chapters for 2 university text books on the application of learning theory to horse training ("Equine Behaviour - A Guide for Veterinarians and Equine Scientists" by Dr Paul McGreevy, University of Sydney and "The Behavioural Biology of the Horse" by Professor Daniel Mills, university of Lincoln, UK.). In addition he has been invited to contribute to The Encyclopedia of Animal Welfare and Animal Behaviour to be published in 2005. He has presented his academic work at various international conferences.

In 1989, Andrew won the prestigious Gawler CCI*** and later that year represented Australia in the Trans Tasman Cup. He has represented Victoria in Dressage, and has trained and competed at FEI level. He has ridden in show jumping Grand Prix's, has ridden in bareback races in Australia and New Zealand. In addition he has held an owner-trainer's racing license.

Andrew has conducted clinics in Belgium, Denmark and has lectured and demonstrated training and retraining in the UK at the Royal Vet School in Edinburgh, Lincoln University, Rodbaston College and Nottingham-Trent University. He has lectured and demonstrated at Equitana 1999, 2001 and 2003. Andrew has a strong interest in disseminating the science behind horse training to the equestrian world, having contributed articles for The Horse Magazine for 10 years. He has also written articles for French And Danish equestrian magazines. Together with his wife Manuela, he co-authored "Horse training the McLean Way" published in 2002. In 2003 he published "The Truth About Horses" which has sold over 30,000 copies world wide and is now translated into Spanish (2004) and Dutch (March, 2005).

He presented at a symposium (dressage) in Holland I think too - and has discussed his methods with many top riders like Anky etc - and has worked with Kyra Kurkland.

Also he starred at Equitana 99 where he performed Prix St George movements on a stallion - ridden only with a piece of string around his neck - no saddle or bridle.

[poohsmate]

hi vicki, thanks for that...impressive cv:D :D