Schooling the green horse (w/pics) - A Reflective Lesson

[dophi_arno]

It was about a year ago now that I learned from NR the whole concept of outline and working "on the bit". It took me a long time to get my head around how it all worked, and how to school a horse to work correctly. There's so much advice out there and so many different methods (doing the hard yards vs. side reins vs. pessoa vs. draw reins and so on!), and the members of NR helped me find the right way for us. So I thought I would post this to show the transitions my horse underwent when schooling him to work on the bit and to show the problems we're still having, because maybe it will help others :).

For those of you who don’t know Harashee is a 9 year old arabian gelding. He's an ex-endurance horse, and this was his usual way of going when I bought him:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/1.jpg

Even though he was only a pleasure hack, I learned from NR that by him working in such a hollow outline it prevented him from balancing the rider properly, and could be bad for his back and joints. I had a lot of people telling me to use side reins, or try the pessoa, or draw reins etc (and nothing against these methods- I believe most things have their merits!) I felt that these would be putting him into a position that he might not be ready for yet. Instead I wanted him to tell me when he was ready (mentally and physically) to be working in an outline.

So I began working on circles, serpentines, transitions (within and between gaits), cavalletti, bending through barrels, spiralling etc. Yes it did take a long time, but eventually he flipped "up side down", and started working in a long and low outline:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/th_SV400009.jpg (http://s2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/?action=view&current=SV400009.flv)

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/22.jpg

I encouraged him to work long and low and he started gaining a lot of muscle plus his topline improved out of sight. I could not believe the change in his neck either! This is probably not the best photo (as there was another horse in the arena, hence the attitude!) but this is how he was looking at the beginning of this year:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/3.jpg

You can see from the above picture that he was beginning to make the transition from low to high at the beginning of this year. I like to think there's two ways of teaching a horse to work on the bit... one is encouraging the head to drop from high to lower, and the other is encouraging the head to rise from low to higher once the horse is fit for it. Its a bit convoluted to write out but it makes sense to me!

So in any case, the idea was that he now had the muscle, flexibility, suppleness, freedom of movement, relaxation, and the mental maturity to work on the bit. So maintaining the impulsion I would pick up the contact, offer the aid and this is how we look now:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/4.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/5.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/6.jpg

Each time I felt him really come onto the bit (not just put his head in the right spot, but engage from behind as well) I would reward him. It took a very long time to go through the whole process and by no means are we perfect yet. One of the biggest problems I'm having now is that he can not maintain the outline for very long (but this will improve with time I hope). Fixing his canter is next on the menu too and as you can see in the stills there's still some resistance (although that was the second time he'd ever been worked in that arena, we'd just changed agistment!).

So yes, that's pretty much the end of my ramblings. I just wanted to show that you can teach a horse to work on the bit with minimal use of "gadgets" - it is possible. Although it takes longer it might be worth considering this route depending on your horses level of education and I found it to be really good for my horse. Comments and thoughts are welcomed.
Thanks for reading this not-so-conventional NR post :p

[sheryl]

Well done!

What a different horse, he looks now. And his neck looks great:)

I'm really jealous of your school!

What happens during your transitions? Do you lose the outline, or have you cracked that too?

[coss]

they are brilliant pics and really show progress. i am another person who has an arab who used to work like your first pic, she was also an endurance horse. my problem is that i wasn't mature enough and good enough to think about outline and how to help the horse until a few years ago so my arab is now 30. i started trying to work her "properly" when she was mid 28!

I love your method! i agree that with suppling exercises, and encouraging relaxation will lead to the horse carrying themselves when they are physically (and mentally) ready for it. i love the lunging at the beginnning of the year pic! looks floaty and relaxed in the work, you can really see how the neck is relaxed underneath which i always think is a beautiful sight... well done :)

[Whatanejit]

Well done and what a great story - thanks for sharing.

[Grace O'Malley]

An inspiring set of photos! Nice work :)

I've been working through similar issues with my former polo pony, though I don't think we're doing as well as you are :p . Still, when I feel like we haven't made any progress...going back to look old pics... Yeah. There is still a *long* way to go, but we have come a long way together.

Satisfying, isn't it? :D

[domane]

What a lovely report, and such a dramatic improvement. And all done "by hand" with a gentle persuation and no training aids or gadgets... inspiring stuff....

Well done you!!!! :)

[Montana]

Beautiful pics there at the end, and it's so nice to hear of a non-'quick fix' solution to asking your horse to be able to work well. I love how patient you've been, it's really inspiring to me:) And he's is such a beautiful boy:D Well done you:)

[dophi_arno]

Thankyou for the lovely comments guys, very encouraging!

It's good to hear your experiences as well, it'd be great to see some before and after photos as you progress too. I plan to keep updating this thread as our canter improves, and I'll try and put a short video up soon too, so feel free to post photos of your progress as well :) I don't mind thread hijacking!

Well done!
What happens during your transitions? Do you lose the outline, or have you cracked that too?

Our trot to canter transitions are quite embarrassing really! His canter is still VERY unbalanced and it's not his natural pace of choice, so it's taking a very long time to get him comfortable with it. At this stage I'm just allowing him to rediscover his canter, both on the lunge and ridden, so I am not asking for outline at all until he has learned to balance himself and a rider as well.
I'll post some photos if you like as it's very unrelaxed and quite an effort for him to maintain the canter (tack, back, teeth checked and fine) so it might be nice to keep track of the progress we make with that too.

Otherwise after a decent warm up, halt/walk/trot transitions go quite well. I use a natural approach of applying four phases which I've found has helped him to relax into his transitions instead of tensing up as it gives him forewarning that I would be asking him to change speed. I also allow him to stretch his neck out when warming up, cooling down and intermittently while schooling and he'll flow into each transition with no resistance there so I think applying a bit of natural horsemanship into the schooling has really helped. There's definatley a lot of room for improvement with the transitions, but I think that having done all that transition work to begin with (while getting him fit, supple etc) has definately had an impact on how he goes with them now.

Thankyou again for your lovely comments, much appreciated!

[Iron Maiden]

What a brilliant job you've done, he looks amazing! I can really relate to your story, it took me 3 years to get my ex-RS cob going properly, I spent about a year just getting him to bend & flex properly in walk! I was sooo tempted to stuff a gadget on him & just hoik him in but when it all came together, it was wonderful & I was such a proud mum! I hope lots of people read your posts & are inspired by them, you've got yourself a smashing horse there.

[Bebe]

I think the pics are lovely, the improvement is obvious for all to see and it looks like you've done a really good job. He'll be able to hold himself properly for longer periods as he builds strength, it will come with time so don't worry yourself about it.

Your lunging pics have inspired me to get after my mare and do some with her. She thinks it's boring so puts minimal effort in but that's not really an excuse as it would benefit her.

It took a long time to teach my mare how to go properly, partly because I didn't know how originally and partly because she had very set ideas of how she should go. We did manage it and she was going beautifully last summer. Unfortunately she now claims to have forgotten all of it after a period out of work so we're pretty much back at square one.

[Chinarider]

Hi Dophi_Arno, great pictures and Wow what a difference :) Gorgeous before and even more gorgeous after;)

Sorry we didnt have the chance to meet up when I was in Perth. What a fab place you live in but a little on the quiet side for me;) But all the tack shops made up for it !!

I have a before and after pic to share too, but from a different angle really. Celebrity knows how to work properly, it has been me that has had to learn:p His previous owner trained him well but he took a lot of ' holding together '.So I have had to learn how to ask, and he has had to learn how to hold himself !
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c380/Kippax-Chui/CIMG2470.jpg
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c380/Kippax-Chui/DSC_1759.jpg

[NicP]

Having just bought a horse used for hunting and hacking so for whom straight lines are great (!), this is indeed an ispiring post.

Well done - I need to take a leaf from your book and increase my patience!

[*toHorse&Away*]

what a completely incredible transformation. looks like a different horse. Whatever you did worked for you guys!:eek: :D :D

[Joyscarer]

Thank you for posting that as this is what Joy and I are working on so you inspire hope :)

[dophi_arno]

Thanks guys :)

Chinarider what a huge improvement! So much more relaxed, that's brilliant to see. I'll send you a PM sometime as I'm heading your way in a few months, maybe you can let me know where the tack shops are?!

NicP, Harashee also only knew straight lines when I bought him, it was like trying to drive a semi trailer around a small roundabout! I tried not to do too much lunging because of what I'd read about the problems it could cause, however I found I could keep it interesting for him by introducting lots of transitions (halt, walk, trot, canter, backup) and once these were established I could begin to ask for halt to trot, walk to canter etc. Best of luck with your horse!

[summerguest]

Chinarider

One of my arabs had a neck like your horse that dips just infront of the wither...working long and low really helps build the muscle up in this area, and you can change the shape quite a lot.

[Chinarider]

Summer guest, thanks for that advice, trying my best with the long and low, but sometimes it just seems to be me doing not the horse. In my effort to encourage him i feel myself sink lower !!

Dophi_arno, are you coming to China, how fab, a meet-up :D i will plan a trip round the factories and the bootmakers !! I was only in Perth 10 days but managed 6 trips to the tack shop !!! 3 in just one morning... Horseland =heaven:p

I watched your lungeing video and Harashee really listen to you and drops his head :) How have you taught this ? Also how do you teach him to back up ??? I do lunge often, but the walk to halt is a bit rubbish, and trot to walk can take a while to begin with .

Any thoughts? Perhaps if you are coming over you can show me :D

[dophi_arno]

Dophi_arno, are you coming to China, how fab, a meet-up :D i will plan a trip round the factories and the bootmakers !! I was only in Perth 10 days but managed 6 trips to the tack shop !!! 3 in just one morning... Horseland =heaven:p

Hahaha, great isn't it! I spend WAY too much time and money in there! Meetup sounds great if we can organise it, I think I'm heading there the end of July (off memory), will PM you when I know for sure :)


I watched your lungeing video and Harashee really listen to you and drops his head :) How have you taught this ?

This all just has to do with your horse and what makes your horse work best. Although very forward, Harashee's favourite "reward" is a quit (this links back to natural horsemanship). So to begin with when asking him to stretch long and low, if he trotted around on the forehand, hollow, with his head in the air not listening I would keep him trotting until he stretched out... which the first time was him stretching his head down and snorting ;) . The second he did this I let him drop back to walk which was his "quit". Then I would repeat the exercise. It didnt take him very long at all to figure out that as soon as he stretched his head down and out he would be allowed to drop back to walk. Very simple :)

So then I would increase the period of time between quits, and also ask for more impulsion until he was at the point now where he can walk and trot long and low for extended periods of time with no problems. Not only is it a great way to let him stretch his neck after working on the bit, it now serves as a new type of "quit" reward when ridden which makes life easy for me!


Also how do you teach him to back up ??? I do lunge often, but the walk to halt is a bit rubbish, and trot to walk can take a while to begin with.

At the very beginning I had a friend help me out with this. I would lunge while she would walk at Harashee's head. I would say the voice command (eg walk on) and if Harashee didnt respond she would use the cavesson/halter to ask him to walk on and then reward him for moving foward. Same for halt, trot to walk, and back up- I would say the voice command and she would use the cavesson/halter to stop or back him and then reward him. Once that was established she dropped out increasing distances, I would give the voice command and she would only step in if he didnt respond. Maybe think about clicker training for this as well, as I'm sure the clicker method would work just as well, if not better, as this took a fair bit of cooperation and effort to establish!

[dophi_arno]

I know this is bringing back an old thread, but I thought I would offer an update on how the schooling is going.

Indeed as bebe said, with time Harashee's strength improved and he can now maintain the outline for extended periods. I'm now encouraging him to really engage with his hind end, I'm trying to bring out his natural movement and I'm not so concerned anymore with what his head is doing, as it all falls into place once that hind end kicks in. Unfortunately I do not have too many photos, but here is one that is sort of an example of what I am talking about:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/DSC_0106ed.jpg
Not perfect, but we will get there soon.

I still continue to do transition work with him, as well as some sidepassing, turns on the hindquarters and turns of the forehand to keep him coming off my leg well... and of course still plenty of long and low for warming up, breaks, cooling down and as a reward when he works nicely on the bit. As the length of time he works on the bit has increased, the need for solid half-halts has become a lot more important (especially with the increased impulsion) so I have been working on making my half-halts as effective as possible to stop him from running through the contact:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/DSC_0028ed.jpg

So that is where our trot is at for the moment. A while ago I mentioned his problems with canter, which is the real reason why I've updated this post. He has had a lot of problems with his canter in the past; it is often hard for him to maintain it and in the field he is much happier to extend his trot than break into a canter when running with his paddock mates. He counter-flexes and is quite short-strided. His teeth, back, saddle and other tack have all been checked and are fine:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/DSC_0184ed.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/DSC_0132ed.jpg

Although it looks quite comical, I can assure you it is not at all easy to ride such an unbalanced horse:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/DSC_0135ed.jpg
(I'm leaning forward slightly to give with my reins)

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/DSC_0150ed.jpg

So again I focussed on transitions, free lunging and plenty of circle work in order to help him become more balanced and flexible. With time his transitions into canter became less tense, and his length of stride increased:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/DSC_0371ed.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/DSC_0439ed.jpg

And without the use of "gadgets" or training aids, his current canter is now looking like this:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/dophi_arno/DSC_0148ed.jpg

Of course there is still a very long way to go; I'd like to get 100% correct leads, canter on the bit, 20 meter circles and of course my position needs work too... but I think now that he is much more relaxed this will all come much easier. I'd like to continue to update this thread if people are willing to read it, as I think it is beneficial to see the transformations possible with effective schooling and a bit of patience :) .

Again comments and thoughts are welcomed.
Many thanks!

[Peanut]

Thank you, very inspiring thread giving lots of food for thought.

You've done a fab job. :)

[Lucyad]

Wow - great thread, and a great job on your part. Very inspiring!

[NicP]

That canter is looking so much more relaxed, well done.

I have found a great RI who is helping me no end - I had a lesson yesterday and was on a high as he started to get the hang of doing turns on the forehand!

I am also moving yards in a month to a place with a great menage and a smaller sand school for lunging etc. so I think we will be able to improve more then (the menage I have access to now is small, square and on a slope which isn't too helpful for trying to aid balance!)

[dophi_arno]

Thankyou for the comments guys :)

That's great to here NicP! I remember you mentioning that you had just bought a very "straight" horse, how has the circle work come along?

I will post some more photos later; sometimes with the canter it is easy to think that the photographs have just been captured at a bad time, but I can assure you that is not the case... those photos really do show the way he used to canter. I will try and get a more recent cantering photo too as that one from behind is at a bit of a bad angle too.

Thanks again for reading this!

[Montana]

I love this thread:) Please do keep updating it. I thought you'd done a great job first time around, but I hadn't seen the 'before' canter pictures then - brings a whole new meaning to the word stargazer:eek:

What a lucky boy to find you:)