tongue out of mouth help needed

[snaffles]

I have a pony that tends to droop her tongue out the side of her mouth. We had found that the magic bit worked and kept it in her mouth (for about 2 years) but as this isn't dressage legal we have tried other bits (jointed snaffle, straight bar snaffle, curved jointed snaffle, myler level 1, informed bitting mullen mouth striaght bar snaffle) none of these have worked and I now have the added problem that the magic bit no longer works either! The pony produces excellent dressage tests but loses at least 1 mark off every movement for the tongue hanging out. I am at my wits end as her young rider is in despair any suggestions greatfully recieved I just need a dressage legal bit that will keep her comfortable for the 4 mins of the test! Teeth/back etc have been checked apparently she has a small mouth and large tongue!

[Vez]

Have you had it fitted because maybe you need a thiner one that means she can have more room for the tounge. Make sure its not to narrow aswell, but I would think it is more likely to to be the thickness of the mouth peice! :)

[Pibstar]

a friend of mine who is a RI has a lovely horse called Goofy and he always has his tongue hanging out of his mouth... so funny to watch it flapping around. Sorry not the answer you where looking for :D

[puzzles]

have you had her teeth and the bit fit both checked?
horses almost always stick their tongues out because of discomfort: usually because they feel restricted because theiy have a fleshy tongue and/or a thivk bit, neither of which leaves much room for the tongue and bit together cayusing the horse to seek a bit more comfort and room elsewhere: outside of the mouth. therefore i suggest that if you a) have her in anything other than a cavessson, change it to one. an uncomfortable horse cannot work the best it can so increasing its comfort levels as much as possible can only help improve its way of going; and b) change her bit to a thinner one and/or try different mouthpieces specifically designed to enhance tongue room and comfort, such as a Myler bit (http://www.mylerbits.com/) and avoid mouthpieces including:

single-jointed
french link
straight-bar
dr bristol
ball point
waterford

you can also try these mouthpieces:

roller
mullen
ported
ported

you can also look for bit materials designed to increase horses comfort and encourage salivation and acceotance of the bit, including:

copper/sweet iron
rubber
plastic

trying any - or even all - of these will help to increase your horse's comfort and help to prevent her from poking her tongue out. physically forcing the issue (i.e. with a tight noseband/flash, etc) will only make it worse and does not treat the actual problem.

good luck

xxxx

[coss]

as puzzles said, if you're not in a simple cavesson noseband, goe to a simple cavesson nosebands as this will make the pony feel like she has more room in her mouth as the jaw will be freer (how do you spell that?!) i would try a roller bit as the roller will encourage the pony to "play" with the bit instead of sticking the tongue out and it gives more mobility to the bit.

Does your pony have a low roof to the mouth? if so then i doubt a ported would be good although it would give the tongue more room.

I would be interested to know why you don't recommend a french link puzzles :)

[Marmite]

A thinner french link mouth piece could work for her, or as coss suggested a roller to keep her tongue occupied and in her mouth. They'll give her more space for her tongue :) And echo Coss, i'm interested in why you dont like the french link puzzles :)

[Marmite]

Also, just been on that myler website and looked at mouth pieces...what on earth does a correctional mouthpiece do????? It looks harsh, and I can't see how on earth that would be comfortable for the horse :confused:

[coss]

I found that bit too Marmite, its got a very high port and that is designed to give extra tongue relief, but as i said before, what if your horse has a low palette - surely that would hit the roof of the mouth - ouch!
myler have expanded their range a fair bit by the looks of it (no pun intended!)
Is it me or is this just a dr bristol?
http://www.toklat.com/myler/mbits_10.html

[HorseWhisp3r3r]

If you pony has a small mouth and a large tongue you need to find a bit that fits in the mouth, I wouldn't use a ported bit no way and also can't see why a french link wouldn't be any good that would be one of the first ones I'd try but a thinner one as possible. I used to have this trouble with the ponies I used to produce and in the end I had to get my bits from Canada as english ones just weren't thin enough infact they were the same width as the horse bits:confused: how can you expect a pony to have a mouth piece the same size as a horse . . . . I wondered if the manufactures have ever seen a ponies mouth.
My friends dressage horse used to stick his tongue out of the side of his mouth and used to get him marked down in dressage, after going down the usual routes of back teeth, stress etc couldn't find anything out of the ordinary. She used to school him with a stocking over his nose which stopped it and changed his bit to a thin french link as he had a huge tongue which seemed to work. The poking the tongue out had become a habit but it slowly decreased infact to the point when you'd be surprised if he poked his tongue as we hadn't seen him to it for ages.

[puzzles]

Also, just been on that myler website and looked at mouth pieces...what on earth does a correctional mouthpiece do????? It looks harsh, and I can't see how on earth that would be comfortable for the horse :confused:

Quoted from the website:

Correctional:
"Usage: The MB-27 allows a rider to reward the horse with a “comfort zone” when relaxed at the poll. This bit is good for collection and stopping and works well on spoiled horses and horses that run through the bit."

Correctional Low Port:
"Usage: Rewards the horse with a “comfort zone” when relaxed at the poll. Good bit for collection and stopping. Works well for spoiled horses and horses who run through the bit. A good choice for horses with low palates."

Correctional Ported Barrel:
"Usage: Allows the rider to isolate one side of the bit to lift a shoulder and rewards a horse with a “comfort zone” when relaxed at the poll. A good bit for collection and stopping, as well as for spoiled horses, horses which run through the bit and those which drop a shoulder."
"Usage: The 41PB is a nice mouthpiece for more spirited horses needing more tongue relief. Featuring Independent Side Movement, it is good for stopping and lifting a shoulder."

Correctional High Ported Barrel:
"Usage:
Allows rider to isolate one side of the bit to lift a shoulder and rewards a horse with a “comfort zone” when relaxed at the poll. A good bit for collection and stopping, as well as for spoiled horses, horses which run through the bit as well as those which drop a shoulder."

Does this help?

it varies as there are different types of each mouthpiece but the above are examples.

french Links use tongue pressure as they 'wrap around' it, which can make some horses feel a bit 'suffocated'.

xxxxxxxxxxxxx

:-D

[HorseWhisp3r3r]

puzzles are you just googling answers or do you have direct experience with bitting horses ?

[Marmite]

I found that bit too Marmite, its got a very high port and that is designed to give extra tongue relief, but as i said before, what if your horse has a low palette - surely that would hit the roof of the mouth - ouch!
myler have expanded their range a fair bit by the looks of it (no pun intended!)
Is it me or is this just a dr bristol?
http://www.toklat.com/myler/mbits_10.html


They just looked very extreme! And it is, isn't it? How can they advertise that as softer than a snaffle and good for young horses??? :confused:

[Marmite]

french Links use tongue pressure as they 'wrap around' it, which can make some horses feel a bit 'suffocated'.

xxxxxxxxxxxxx

:-D

They're kinder than most other bits, loads of horses I know who are ridden in them have never gone better, especially a youngster who used to rear when bitted, he loves his. I really dont see how they could be considered harsh, unless the mouth conformation really didnt suit them or the horse didnt like them.

[puzzles]

sure the bit is kind enough, but it depends on the individual horse whether or not it is suited and i was merely saying that for this horse it may not suit - i could be wrong of course!
as to whether i have experience with bits, the answer is yes. Only the internet probably explains far better than me because i would just blab on and on :-)

[Marmite]

and avoid mouthpieces including:

single-jointed
french link
straight-bar
dr bristol
ball point
waterford



You can see why we were thought you were out right dismissing the bit and saying it wasn't right etc. And french links can be good for horses with fleshy tongues and low mouths, as it's action doesnt involve rising up and hittign the roof of the mouth, and the french link provides more and flexible room for the tongue :) Im not recommending it, but the same goes for the waterford really :)

[coss]

whats a ball point mouthpiece?
I now understand why you didn't recommend the french link puzzles. makes sense but i think it may be worth trying as it is liked by many horses.

[puzzles]

ok, thanks for not having a go :-)
a ball point bit moves round where the joint on a single-jointed bit would be, which encourages the horse to relax his jaw and salivate and accept the bit.
i think they're really useful - especially for young and/or sensitive horses.