Treeless Saddle Doubts

[sammyantha]

Do all treeless saddles slip? Does it feel like riding bareback? Are they secure? Have been reading some awful reviews about pressure dispersion etc, but no one seems to mention how safe they are to ride in in terms of staying in the saddle (and it staying on top of the horse!) :eek: My mare is very bouncy, I can't ride her bareback at all! She also has a tendency to shy to the side, bounce on all fours, and stop suddenly while cantering sometimes.

My main reasons for wanting a treeless were the fact that they accomodate the horses changing shape, thereby saving me money in the long run, for horses comfort, and my comfort when we start doing long rides. Am I better off sticking with a treed GP? Also facied an aussie stock but I've heard they're VERY heavy :confused:

[Showjumper]

http://www.freewebs.com/alternativehorse/treelesssaddlereviews.htm

[Bay Mare]

To be honest it depends on the horse.

I've got an SBS on Saff and it has only slipped once, 30 minutes into a lesson, cantering around a corner when .... I forgot to do up the girth!!! Any saddle would have slipped. Saff is a bit of a hot head under saddle so we've had various airs above the ground, we've jumped some teensy xc jumps, galloped across fields including 'gallop half pass', spins and normal riding and it hasn't moved an inch.

Mine doesn't feel like you're riding bareback because it has a bit of a twist. It does feel wider to ride in and you definitely have to get used to the different feel but I love mine and wouldn't swap it for the world. It is the most comfortable saddle that I've ever ridden in. The only other saddle that I was ever tempted to buy was the custom made Lauriche but that was WAY out of my price range (and they're not made anymore).

It depends what you want to spend but I know someone who's selling an SBS at the moment for under £700 (£660 I think) + P&P.

[Iron Maiden]

I bought a treeless for exactly the same reasons you cite - accommodating changing shape. Trouble is that you still need to pad the saddle, you don't just plonk it on & ride off into the sunset, and I had a lot of trouble getting the padding right on my pointy withered mare. I gave up in the end & bought a Saddle Co, which was ideal for us - treed so much easier to fit to a high wither, but adjustable so no need to worry about changing shape (just got to keep Poohsmate sweet!). I have used a borrowed treeless when the Saddle Co has needed adjusting & it's a very handy thing to have for such circumstances but I'm pretty convinced now that I've made the right choice for me & P, it was lovely to get back on the all-new reflocked & adjusted Saddle Co this week.

[Wally]

I ride Fákur, fat person in my HM SBS treeless, simply because his Saddle Co easi sit doesn't fit him anymore, on account of being a fat boy! :o I could send it off to be altered, but I like the SBS.

It hasn't slipped on him. He has a table top for a back ATM.

[c2b]

I have the trekker saddle the old style with the fleecy underside. I use a suber pad and the trekker numnah underneath. My Dales mare is very round (a euphenism for fat :D) with no withers and changes shape from week to week it seems.
I don't have any problems with it slipping, walk, trot, canter and even mounting from the ground.

[Bebe]

I've got a high withered, big shouldered mare.

I had a Fitform, it slipped backwards a touch but that was easily fixed with a breastgirth. It would slip sideways a little under extreme circumstances but never far enough to cause real problems, apart from the time I didn't check my girth and jumped a ditch with a sharp turn immediately after it, I went one way and saddle went the other :rolleyes:

I also had a Freeform, which never budged but it didn't really suit my mares high withers so I didn't keep it for long.

My last treeless was a HM Flexion SBS. I always had problems with it slipping both backwards and sideways and I spent a fortune on grippy pads, girths and breastgirths trying to keep it in place. In the end I settled on a sheepskin half pad which worked the best but I never really trusted it and as a result became too scared to let my horse do anything faster than a sedate canter. I pitched off a few times because it slipped when going around corners at speed, once when going uphill it slipped so far backwards I came off the front and ended up riding bareback instead and one time it slipped so far round it ended up under my horses stomach whilst I again rode bareback galloping at speed over a field of corn (horse was being naughty and ran off initially, then truly bolted when the saddle went). I'm not even sure how that happened but I did manage to stay on and stop, eventually! The backwards slipping never really stopped and as a result it sat too far back on my horse and resulted in soreness. No-one else has ever reported having problems this major with it though so it seems my mare is unusual in this respect but for us it was a serious problem.

So, it really depends on the horse and saddle combination, as with any item of tack really. Treeless isn't always the nice and easy fix that it may first seem, I could have bought a good quality treed saddle with the money I spent on padding and things for my SBS and still never got it right.

[Yann]

I've got a treeless Fitform and treed saddles, and although it's nothing major I do find the Fitform is less stable and secure on the whole.

[Bebe]

Oh yes, forgot to say that if we're just comparing treeless vs treed, my treed saddle is far more stable and secure than any of the treeless I've had.

The only difference in my mares way of going treeless vs treed is that she goes much better in her new treed than she did in her last treeless saddle. She goes the same in her treed & Fitform (which is a recent acquisition, I sold my original one ages ago but bought a Fitform back as a back-up saddle for it my treed has to go off to be altered at any point), though my hips appreciate the treed more.

[KateWooten]

My Fhoenix is definitely less stable for mounting from the ground - but I avoid that anyway. It has slipped once on Summer, big wide, flat-backed mare at a walk going down the road without the girth (well, it was on, but baggy loose). When riding it is really secure - it doesn't slip on the horse at all and I ride it in the arena, out galloping on trails and jumping too (and it's a dressage saddle ! ) and it's very secure on the horse. It also feels a lot more secure to me, I mean, as to whether I feel like I'd fall out of it, than my treed saddle. The way it's constructed out of memory foam means that you sinkn into it so when you're riding you're more 'in it' than 'on it'. I tried my regular treed saddle this weekend by cotrast and felt very perched and insecure.

[Bay Mare]

I just use a Stephens or Bartl sheepskin saddle cloth underneath the SBS

[carrieh]

My Fhoenix doesn't slip at all. I use a Stephens lambswool pad underneath and a Professionals Choice girth as recommended by Enlightened Equitation who make the saddles. I use it on a very wide tubby Fell pony.

The beauty of the saddle is that you are actually more secure in it as a rider, because it automatically drops your legs into the correct position. This can take a little getting used to at first but it's well worth the effort. Then everyone compliments you on your beautiful position on horseback :D and it's not really you, it's the saddle doing it for you!

[sammyantha]

So it really does just depend on the individual combination then I guess. I'm worried about security and slipping so I think I'll go witha treed or part treed for now but I'd very much like to try treeless and see how we get on for a time when my balance has improved LOL. Thanks for all your replies :D

[KateWooten]

yes - that's it carrieH that's what I was trying to say !!! it drops you right in the correct position and helps you stay there and you feel all secure and powerful - 'grounded' they'd say in yoga !! And yes, all the lovely comments about what a 'soft' rider, with a great seat :D :D I lap it up (but then I do have to spoil it by telling everyone it's the saddle !!)

[jamsinthecat]

not to be a scare monger but my treeless put me in hospital last weekend!! up until then i would have defended treeless saddles to the hilt but i have been completely put off. I have a very difficult to fit a saddle to new forest pony and having tried numerous treed saddles got myself a Trekker talent which i loved and we used without incident for about a year. Earlier this year i thought i'd treat myself and bought a barefoot london. It is great for schooling but slips alot despite having a sheepskin pad, neoprene girth etc. anyway, long story short i was cantering along the downs and my girlie spooked, i lost a stirrup and was slightly unbalanced but as i tried to right myself the saddle kept slipping round and i couldn't stop it! anyway i fell off, cracked my head, had concussion and spent the afternoon in a &e having spinal x rays!. needless to say the saddle has to go and i have made an appointment to get a made to measure treed saddle instead. i still think treeless saddles have a place but they are not a cure all solution

[sammyantha]

:eek: that's exactly what I'm worried about! Hope you and hoss recover soon.

[Bebe]

anyway, long story short i was cantering along the downs and my girlie spooked, i lost a stirrup and was slightly unbalanced but as i tried to right myself the saddle kept slipping round and i couldn't stop it!

Sorry to hear you ended up in hospital but I'm glad you're ok. My SBS did this numerous times, particularly when my mare was learning how to canter in the arena. I fell off a record 3 times in one lesson purely because my mare would get a bit unbalanced, manouvre in an unexpected manner and drop me over a shoulder in the process, at which point the saddle would spin and I'd hit the deck.

The SBS has also done this to my OH several times on a different horse, and once to my instructor who has a beautiful seat and position and never comes unstuck!

The rider tends to get the blame for this but I don't think this is fair, some horses don't have the conformation for keeping a treeless saddle in the middle of them (mine spun around once without me even being on board!).

[marsden]

jamsinthecat hope you recover soon!

I've rode a few horses in treeless saddles and personally i just don't like them at all! Maybe i'm stuck in my ways, but i feel so much more secure in a 'normal' english saddle! one of the horses i was riding had a major tantrum and i just felt so insecure, luckily i managed to stay on!
I don't find them very comfy either :confused:well they are ok in walk, but trot i just didn't feel right!?

But each to their own and if it suits you and your horse then go for it! :D

[jamsinthecat]

"some horses don't have the conformation for keeping a treeless saddle in the middle of them (mine spun around once without me even being on board!)."

exactly, and no matter how well balanced you are if the saddle slips then there is absolutely nothing you can do to save yourself. I know I wouldn't have fallen off if the saddle hadn't slipped with me. My girth was done up as tight as humanly possible and I reckon that you could still swivel the saddle round completely. anyhow i have bought a lovely working hunter saddle and hopefully we shall be incident free now!

thanks for your kind wishes, by the way. Barring a few bruises i am absolutely fine now and pony is super too.:D

[lana27]

I don't know if all treeless saddles slip, but some definately do. One slipped on mine cantering in the school and I came off as a result (there's just no way of saving yourself). And to be honest I have used several treed saddles and some of them were fitting quite badly, but they still didn't slip or at least not to that extend.

Sitting in this particular saddle (the one that slipped), yes I felt secure (till it slipped that was :)).

And no it didn't feel like riding bareback.

Think it really depends on the horse and saddle. Good luck with your search.