Connected/connection

[teabiscuit]

what does it mean when my instructor says "oooo you've got connection, can you feel it? arghhhhhhhhhhh you lost it"

:eek:

no i can't feel it, either when me and my horse have it and when we've lost it :confused:

help, what does connection mean?

[Mareish]

Connection for me is staying on the full hour ;)

[angelfben]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v649/angelfben/connection1-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v649/angelfben/connected2.jpg

[teabiscuit]

Connection for me is staying on the full hour well i didn;t fall off when she said i'd lost it :confused:

[teabiscuit]

angelfben, thankyou, a picture tells a thousand words :D
but seriously, what did she mean?

[Mareish]

Excellent sense of humour :D

James Jackson actually wrote a very interesting thread on this on another forum - will ask him to pass on his version ;)

[teabiscuit]

Excellent sense of humour :D

James Jackson actually wrote a very interesting thread on this on another forum - will ask him to pass on his version ;)

ooh yes please, thankyou

[Mehitabel]

well, i know what i'd mean if i said it - but that could be a completely different thing to what your instructor means. i think you need to ask her toexplain in a differnt way.

i;d liken 'connection' to something like feel, those moments when it all goes right and you can correct the problems almost before they happen. it could also mean a correct contact, an outline, the horse working from behind and 'through' as the stressagers say.

[teabiscuit]

she told me that when the horse first learns to go on the bit, he wants to bury down and go heavy on the forhand (or that might just be lazy Old Finn)

we're working on lifting his shoulders up at the moment, lifting the withers?

maybe we got a few strides of that?

[KateWooten]

I've felt it with Rosie in her dressage lesson ... but I'm sure I couldn't describe it any better than your instructor or any of the good dressage folks here. And what I felt didn't quite coincide with what my dressage lady was telling me either.

[teabiscuit]

can you tell me what you felt then Kate?

and how it differed to what your instructor said?

aren't i mean asking you to type that out! :o

[Skyhuntress]

To me, a connection means that Im connected to the horse's mouth as well as his hind end. Generally, it means that I have a contact with the bit that is light but insistent, while still getting some impulsion from the hind end

[KateWooten]

I'll try ... it's easier to feel with Rosie than with any other horse on the planet because of her saddlebreddyness ... this is not her, but she has a tendency to look like this .....

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f135/joePony/baylicious3.jpg

So, for the first year, riding Rosie was like this ... "get your head down... ok move ... forward ... a ... bit .... aaaargghh, stop stamping them feet up and down ... forward ... .head down .... arrrrghhhhh.... just a bit of bend .... (stomp stomp) " etc.

Well, in the dressage lesson - and I have failed to go back for another, alas, since the instructor is now 5 hours away and I am a gimp, we had her trotting round on a circle.... and then nose down.... and from there pushed her forward into my hand... and allowed her to chew the reins out of my hand so her nose was real low ... and then a little more push and there was a point there where her whole attitude was forward (big step forward) but up.. ack, I don't know how to splain what she felt like ... like normal, only more responsive .. I mean, ok, she is very 'well trained' in lots of ways - she will move any part of her, any direction on the very softest cue - just a look, if we're on the ground, or just a weight shift from the saddle ... but her intention to do that means nothing at faster paces because she can't physically manage it - she hasn't the strength or coordination. So this point I'm trying to describe was where she was trotting around in a circle and we reached a balance point together at which she felt willing and ABLE to move any part of her any direction. ( but if I'd have put that to the test, I would surely have lost the connection).

So, then when we 'got it' she looked like this ...
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f135/joePony/Rosie/wrongLeg3.jpg

The thing about the instructor is she's not riding the horse, but very close - as you can see from the piccy - look how intensely involved the instructor is with the horse - not with the rider, but the horse. I think the mismatch with what I was feeling compared to what I was hearing from the instructor was just a question of the delay from me acting, the effect on the horse, the instructor seeing the effect, the instructor calling the effect, and then me hearing it. That's quite a long cycle when you're just starting out !

[coverblown]

oh I'm going to be a grotbag.... you know I'm good at it

I felt connection for the first time ever with Bad B. We were doing lots of dressage practice he was straight when he needed to be, bent like a banana on the circles, responding to a tiny movement of a little finger, light as a feather. We did canter figures of 8 - he pinged through the centre change of bend, fan ****** tastic.

Then the next day he bucked me off and I broke my back...

[JamesJackson]

So, here's what I wrote recently on 'connection'. It's a bit of a braindump, there are changes and modifications that I would like to make, but here it is in its (mostly) original form:

When somebody recently was questioning what 'connection' is, I tried at the time to pen an answer that reflected my understanding of it, and realised that it is actually an amazingly hard thing to describe as it encompasses so many areas of understanding. So, I took myself back to my instructor, books I respect, and most importantly a variety of horses to remind and (re)educate myself such that I could explain my understanding of it to others.

As part of this, I revisited various buzzwords that are often thrown around - Outline, collection, impulsion, 'on the bit' etc, and various principles that are often rather vaguely defined by some instructors and therefore understood incorrectly by riders.

So, connection: I would define this as a supple, straight and submissive horse working lightly and responsively with impulsion between the aids as given (length of rein, pressure from leg).

Note no mention of 'outline'. I'll come to that...

Suppleness - you get this through progressive gymnastic exercises (starting with turns on the forehand (suppling) and leg yielding (suppling), leading on to shoulder in (collecting), travers (collecting), half pass (collecting) and renvers (collecting). These all encourage (if ridden correctly) the correct operation of the horse's body.

Straightness - just what it says on the tin. With maybe a slight flexion to the inside (i.e. you can see the corner of the inside eyelid), without a tilted head etc. Note that a straight horse (with slight inside flexion) on a circle steps under itself with the inside hind to turn, this has the effect of engaging the hindquarters, which leads to the next item:

Reponse and Impulsion - The horse does what is asked (or more importantly what it thinks you asked - no reaction can not be tolerated, but a reaction, even the 'wrong' one can). Impulsion of course just means it's using its hind legs properly, to the degree that the training and gymnastic ability allows.

Submission - The horse is listening to the aids, doesn't have it's mind on other things, and isn't nervous about it (chomping on the bit, tossing head, whatever)

Lightness - This is really where it starts to get interesting. A horse really isn't carrying itself properly unless it is light in the hand. To do this requires the horse to be carrying themselves properly. Essentially the back and neck must both dorsiflex (i.e. flex with an upwards curve, ventriflexion being what we don't want - hollow back, giraffe neck). If the back is encouraged to dorsiflex by correct rider position and application of suitable leg aids, then out of pure balance the horse will put its head into a suitable (and correct both in terms of looks and movement) place and alignment.

Note this can be in free walk on a long rein, or in the extremes of collection. In both cases you have dorsiflexion of the back and neck, and a lightness of hand. If the horse is heavy in the hand then there will be some degree of blocking the correct usage of the neck muscles and the forehand - it's essentially a continuous application of an incorrect use of the rein aid used to hold a foreleg moving (such as when leg yielding, holding the outside foreleg whist the inside moves - you don't hold continuously but ask for a 'pause' with the outside rein whilst the inside leg crosses under, releasing the rein pressure when the outside foreleg has to move).

So, how does this relate to collection and 'outline'? I hate the use of the word outline purely because it's often misused. People get a horse's head in a position they believe to be correct, without thinking about what the rest of the horse is doing, and call this outline. This is wrong. Outline will make itself when the above is correct and you ask for a degree of collection larger than that in a free walk on a loose rein. How do we get that? The half halt, to varying degrees relating to the collection required.

I asked a number of riders what they consider to be meant by the half halt, and the number that responded with something along the lines of it starting from the and worried me. A half halt doesn't stop or restrict by use of the hand, it adds and contains (or removes and contains, depending on the horse's temperament) by riding up into the hand. A better way of thinking about it is 'adding elevation and flamboyancy' - you won't get elevation without collection (unless the horse is bucking, then you're in trouble).

So a collecting half halt - straighten the back, deep breath in, lighten the seat (often said as 'heels down' but that is thinking about it completely the wrong way around), be soft with the hand and the horse's hindquartes will follow where your muscle tone is taking it - i.e. up and forwards. Oo, that's collecting! As a result of this collection (hindlegs under, back dorsilfexing) the head will move into the position known as 'outline', but with lightness and not restraint. If you really ask this of a well schooled horse, building and building but upwards and not forwards, you can trot just about on the spot, the beginnings of piaffe, but with lightness - collection comes in diagonal pairs (mostly).

My point with this is that the 'bow and string' way of thinking, often taught, is actually wrong. If you get the horse so it is tight through its back and ridden into an overly restraining hand, you just end up with tightness ( = blocking), and not lightness, and therefore you can't have a connection.

I hope this rambling makes sense, it's a bit of a braindump. Essentially connection does not equal connection does not equal outline. Correct usage of the back and neck muscle groups, plus a willingly submissive horse (note not forced into submission but encouraged to be so) does equal connection. But it requires two...

[JamesJackson]

she told me that when the horse first learns to go on the bit, he wants to bury down and go heavy on the forhand (or that might just be lazy Old Finn)

we're working on lifting his shoulders up at the moment, lifting the withers?

maybe we got a few strides of that?

You see, I would take this as going about it the wrong way around. A young horse, who can't collect at all, can work 'on the bit', this just means he's respecting the length of rein you are giving him and not evading. If he's burying down and heavy on the forehand, he's not learned to carry himself properly. The only way you can do that is to let him have a longish rein, don't fiddle, don't upset your own balance, and the horse will figure it out. As time (and suppleness) progresses, the length of rein can be shortened, the hindquarters asked to engage more, and the horse will be 'on the bit' but with a headcarage closer to the vertical line position we see quoted in textbooks.

A horse that is not encouraged to work properly, or forced into things, or unsure, will bury his head and be on the forehand. The whole purpose of training is to encourage the exact opposite of this by showing the horse how he can use his body properly, and gradually as his athleticism builds.

[coverblown]

well quite a lot to keep in your head when you're going round the arena......

[julia gulia]

[QUOTE=pepsimaxrock;1334702]well quite a lot to keep in your head when you're going round the arena......[/QUOT

:p:p:p:p:p

[KateWooten]

That can really upset your balance actually .... when your head gets totally full with all those weighty thoughts ... it can make you tip forward quite a lot and put the horse's balance all out. I think it's better to think about sunshine and happy songs, tip your head back, look at the sky and laugh. That'll get your ol' pone's back legs underneath him.

[Peanut]

I haven't read all the other replies so I may be entirely wrong :o, but to me it means that you have become one with your horse. You feel that lightness of hand, perfect balance and you are both totally in tune. It's the most wonderful feeling but to me a little like riding on a knife edge because one misjudged moment, one wrong step and you've lost it. That connection (or what it means to me) is what I'm constantly striving for.

[teabiscuit]

You see, I would take this as going about it the wrong way around. A young horse, who can't collect at all, can work 'on the bit', this just means he's respecting the length of rein you are giving him and not evading. If he's burying down and heavy on the forehand, he's not learned to carry himself properly. The only way you can do that is to let him have a longish rein, don't fiddle, don't upset your own balance, and the horse will figure it out. As time (and suppleness) progresses, the length of rein can be shortened, the hindquarters asked to engage more, and the horse will be 'on the bit' but with a headcarage closer to the vertical line position we see quoted in textbooks.

A horse that is not encouraged to work properly, or forced into things, or unsure, will bury his head and be on the forehand. The whole purpose of training is to encourage the exact opposite of this by showing the horse how he can use his body properly, and gradually as his athleticism builds.

don't worry, my RI hasn't let us loll about on the forehand - we were just getting the hang of softening and she let us have some lea way while we got the hang of it, but not for long :D

finn isn't a youngster and there's been a bit of a battle of wills with the softening, lovely though he is he can be as stubborn as a mule

[teabiscuit]

. So this point I'm trying to describe was where she was trotting around in a circle and we reached a balance point together at which she felt willing and ABLE to move any part of her any direction. ( but if I'd have put that to the test, I would surely have lost the connection).

So, then when we 'got it' she looked like this ...
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f135/joePony/Rosie/wrongLeg3.jpg



. I think the mismatch with what I was feeling compared to what I was hearing from the instructor was just a question of the delay from me acting, the effect on the horse, the instructor seeing the effect, the instructor calling the effect, and then me hearing it. That's quite a long cycle when you're just starting out !

thanks for that Kate, Rosie looks "up in the withers" to me in that pic, so maybe up in the withers is how they are when you get


we reached a balance point together at which she felt willing and ABLE to move any part of her any direction