Deaf Rider

[Shannon_Clover]

Would it be possible to ask an instructor to ride along a deaf rider to show what they are doing, explain/talk (which would be easier if beside learning rider to lipread and show what is being taught so that they can clearly understand and follow instructions.
They could ride beside, in front or behind.
Or move away into centre of arena to observe from a distance.

I know that they always teach on the ground but it impossible to hear them if you are at one end of the arena and the instructor at the other end.

Would an instructor agree to such a request or do they stick to their own teaching method like on the ground?
Health and Safety?

Another idea is radio aids but they may be a nusiance cos they usually wore around the neck and if you and fall they could be damage (very expensive equipment) or is there a better place to put them like arm ( Im not really sure depending on distance)
I will find out more in sept.

But would really love comments on the rider/ instructor question.
Also can a deaf person hunt or do you think it unsafe.
Obviously they cant wear hearing aids hunting, cos if you fall into a lake,river or water ditch - it bye bye to thousands euros worth of equipment.
I did found a proctective case but it not waterproof just splashproof.

Love to hear your comments/feedback/advice.
Thanks

[Wally]

Any riding instructor worth his salt should be able to adapt his teaching methods to suit a deaf person. It's not rocket science!

I often taught from horseback, as it is easy to demonstrate rather than jumping onto somneone else's horse.

I can see no reason why a deaf person should not take part in anything a hearing person can. I know for a fact I cannot hear anything other than the rush of wind in my ears out hunting.....and have to say, in many, many years of hunting I have never fallen into a river or ditch! :D :D

Hang on, don't they give radio aids to kids in schools????? If they trust them with them and they manage not to eat, scribble on them, fill them with crumbs or generally drop them from a great height, I dare say they'd survive a minor scramble off a horse!

How do deaf canoeists manage?? there must be a lot of dear folk doing rock climbing and other sdtuff like that, there must be specialist stuff to beg , borrow or hire (if you can't steal it) ;)

[Shannon_Clover]

Thanks for your positive feedback. :D

[CJABB]

I have single-sided deafness (totally deaf in one ear). I have problems hearing my instructor too, especially in windy conditions.

As I still have reasonable hearing in my good ear, I do not need a hearing aid. For lessons, me and my instructor have a walkie talkie each. I wear mine (very small) connected to my waistband and have a earphone attachment connected to it, which securely fits in my ear when I ride. That way my instructor talks into his walkie talkie and I can hear what he is saying from the other side of the arena.

The earpiece is the type that wraps around behind your ear. The ones that just sit in your ear fall out as you ride and the headband type don't work with a riding hat!

I also do most of my ridden work in a circle around my instructor so I can hear easier. Although, this gets hard when my bad ear is facing into the middle of the circle!

I find I have more problems when I go hacking, as I don't always hear the traffic coming up behind me. I also can not tell what direction a sound is coming from very easily, so if I do hear a car coming, I usually have to stop as I can not tell if it is coming up in front of me, or behind me!

My instuctor does not ride due to a disability, so I have never tried having a lesson with him riding a horse with me. I don't see what problems this would cause though, it would be good as you could see what your instructor was doing and it would be easier to copy him.

[Wally]

With modern cars I can't hear them either! Especially in a horse drawn cart that is rattling a bit.

[Nazdaq]

I have single sided deafness as well, and I have not been accomodated at all by my RS. The owner of the place took a lesson with me once, and it was a group lesson. I have had group lessons in the past and all was fine, this woman was just wholly rude. I told her at the start of the lesson, and yet she was treating me as though I was thick the whole time. So I haven't had a lesson since this, and I am not sure I will go back there or not. She insulted me (called me unfit) kept shouting at me when I could hear her fine. She said 'stop' and I thought she said 'trot' so she yelled at me for that as well (all the other RIs say halt instead, thats much better then it doesn't get confused!)

As you can tell I am still very angery about this, and there is nowhere else to ride in my area (Aberystwyth, if you know of somewhere let me know!) I might go for a private lesson (not with her!) when I have the money, but I am a student who has to fund herself and I am unemployed (no experience so no job) so it might even be a year before I can ride again. :(

The walkie talkie sounds a great idea though, I just lipread, but obviously you can't see them all the time, and if my deaf ear is facing into the school its hard to twist round to hear/lipread. Gah, its annoying. Sorry for the rant all over your post, I hope you find a solution to your questions. :D

P.S: I have no problems hacking as I am at the front of the ride (behind the RI) so thats fine. :D

[Wally]

That's dreadful, I'd be the one appoligising if you go the wrong end of the stick.

I have to say I ask folk to "trot on", and "forward to walk", and "ask them to
stand", so you cannot get what I am saying muddles because there is a whole phrase for what I want that you only need to hear one or two words to know what is coming.

Mind you I am so pleased you told you instructor you were deaf in one lug, as I was given a child to teach who was profoundly deaf in both......and nobody told me, so when I complained to the lad's carers that they hadn't told me I was told I was discriminating against him! I was not, I just needed to know so I could adjust my methods to suit him. I can do a bit of sign language, if I'd have known we'd have got on better from minute one!

[Nazdaq]

Yeah, I always tell everyone before we start, horse riding, lectures, interviews (sometimes if they have a certain tone of voice or way of talking that I know I will have problems with then I will say something) I find it much better for everyone to be honest about my problems from the start, but I still encounter this type of rudeness regularly where they make me feel like a retard (sorry I know thats an offensive word but thats just what it feels like) and I am not, my brain is fine, its just the one ear!
Grrr....:D

P.S: I too don't wear an aid, I had one once (about 8 years old) and it was just annoying, distracting and I broke it in the end! (they never gave me another one ha!)

[Wally]

I find selective deafness a useful skill, ;)

[Nazdaq]

haha yes, it is useful sometimes :D

[salee]

hi, both my parents had 1 side deafness due to childhood accidents, i had it due to severe glue ear which was never diagnosed as of course the tv etc was a bit louder in our house!
my eldest son has a hearing problem he wore aids on both ears as a small child but now he has improved and can cope ok.

if ANYONE had treated me, my son or parents like this instructor i would have demanded an appology at the very least, even if a person is considered a 'retard' as you called it they have paid for a lesson and deserve the same respect as all the other pupils = NO EXCEPTIONS!

i have taught riding since i was 12 years old (before the law on instructors ages & quals came in), including RDA, i found many so called normal riders have a problem, and it was nessesary to adapt the lesson or their ability to do some task to suit, even if the rider has just got a head cold they may need a bit more help, and be a bit less quick to follow the lesson, but thats no reason to make a fool of them.

the person with the problem here is the instructor, having a problem of lack of talent to teach!

putting yourself as much as possible in the place of the pupil is important to understanding what that pupil needs to learn and how they can best learn it, for example :- a nervous rider with a fear of not being able to stop quickly will not improve if still terrified no matter how much the instructor shouts at them to 'relax' but will often improve after a lesson on slowing down and stopping at will, as they now have the confidence that they can choose to stop.

sorry for waffling, but some instructors are good riders but not good teachers. bye

[8-legged-pony]

I have a pupil in RDA who is deaf in both ears and although he has a hearing aid, he needs to rely almost entirely on sign language/lip reading. As an instructor I have made it my business to learn all the sign language that I'll need in that lesson, and anything I can't explain, I ask one of his parents to explain to him - as they are much more proficient in sign language! We've even made up our own sign language for things like "walk on", cones, and poles. I also tend to address the whole ride, then go over to him personally and make sure he's understood what has been asked to him, things like changes of rein I'll just sign them as I speak to the whole ride, but more complicated things I'll communicate to him one-to-one. I'll also throughout the exercise go over to him and make sure he understands what he has to do. As to riding and teaching, I don't think in an RDA lesson I'd be allowed to do that insurance-wise, as I need to be on the floor the whole time anyone is in the school to ensure that if there's an emergency or a horse spooks or anything, I'm there to make sure everyone's safe.

[eml]

I have a profoundly deaf girl in one of my teenage groups and just make sure I am standing near her/facing her when giving instructions. I also have a teenage helper available as a 'friend' to discretely check the deaf girl has understood.

I don't think any of the others in the group even realise that she is anything other than a little behind them in their riding...my main problem is helping in things like canter transition where it is obviously difficult for her to try and be near enough to hear us or see our lips. This is where the 'friend' comes in useful as they can run faster than me :D

I have once taught a group in the school from on a horse and found I was just not manouverable quickly enough.

[laceyfreckle]

i am what is classed as some deafness although as i have had it since a small child it doesn't bother me. I can hear but not very well. I lip read a lot of the time (so have good eye contact skills lol) luckily i learnt to speak before my hearing got too bad (its degenerative and was quite bad by the time i was 6) so my speech is unaffected. i can tell when people are muttering behind my back though lol. when it comes to lesson si just make sure i have good eye contact and can see what they are saying. the only time i had a problem was when my RI who didn't know a few winters back put one of those head scarf that covers your mouth things on...that was a hard lesson lol

[Nazdaq]

Laceyfreckle, I try my best with the eye contact thing, and it does work most of the time, although a new girl has joined my group and she is really bad at controlling her horse/getting him going so she lags behind and RI is often at her end of the school and we are at the other end and the RI says something and I am like "what?" twisting round 180 degrees in the saddle to lipread and keeping my pony away from the pony in front all at the same time is hard! :p I try my best though.

[laceyfreckle]

yeah i didn't say it was easy all the time Nazdaq:p;):D Does your RI know you find it hard to hear? i know its a pain to say sometimesa s they can then talk at you like your two but sometimes you have to.....i normally say something like 'i can only hear you when you face me and have your face clear, but you don't need to shout;)

If in a group ride......and i know this is wrong but...........i always try to make sure i'm behind one or two in front so i can see what they're meant to be doing ;)

sorry if i'm not much help

[Nazdaq]

yes I do tell the RI and they get really snotty about it and deliberately look away from me etc. so now I don't bother saying anything becuase then they forget to be mean hehe. :p :D

[laceyfreckle]

lol pity you can't run them over and then say........oops did you SAY stop? :D i think thats what i'd do!!

[Shannon_Clover]

8-legged-pony: As an instructor I have made it my business to learn all the sign language that I'll need in that lesson, and anything I can't explain, I ask one of his parents to explain to him - as they are much more proficient in sign language! We've even made up our own sign language for things like "walk on", cones, and poles. I also tend to address the whole ride, then go over to him personally and make sure he's understood what has been asked to him, things like changes of rein I'll just sign them as I speak to the whole ride, but more complicated things I'll communicate to him one-to-one. I'll also throughout the exercise go over to him and make sure he understands what he has to do.

You are brilliant to learn Sign Language. :D
You have given me an idea to try and make a little book of signs (Irish Sign language) for Horse Riding.
It would also be useful for the RDA as they are some non-verbal kids.
I had offer to volunteer to teach ISL.
But I have not been contacted to resume volunteering and start teaching basic signs to the volunteers at the local RDA.
I will remind them again.

Could someone give me a list of popular words/instructions in a riding lesson like:
Halt
Trot
Canter
Walk
etc or even an good instructor book on teaching.

My last instructor would come over and explain the exercises and I watch a demo with the other students and then when it my turn she give me a thumb up for 'good' or thumb down for 'wrong' especially with changing legs. It hard work - trying to listen, lipread if possible and ride / guide the horse all at the same time.

The one before her just let me 'follow the leader' in the group lesson:mad:

At the time I didnt know any better until I book a lesson with the new instructor and of course I prefer her. :D


laceyfreckle: lol pity you can't run them over and then say........oops did you SAY stop? i think thats what i'd do!!

lol :D

[FelineWolf]

We had a group from the RNID ride a little while back and I must admit it made me almost embarassed because of how little we were able to communicate with the riders :(
The one member of staff who knows BSL had to carriage drive, cos the man in the carraige was profoundly deaf, so at least it meant that she could explain to him on a one to one basis what was being said. However, we had 3 profoundly deaf riders, none of us who were leading could sign, so we had to rely on a carer running back and forth between the riders signing the instructions and checking that they understood.
So we had a riding instructor who didn't know signing and a signer who didn't know riding :confused:

I have since begun learning BSL and suddenly realised how hard it must be for deaf/signing people to ride! One of the girls who comes from the local college to ride isn't deaf, but she communicates through sign assisted English because her learning difficulties mean she can't talk. There I am trying to lead her, and she LOVES riding, but she'll want to communicate something to me, will begin signing and I have to kind of go "Yes, yes, very good, but you need to hold on" and direct her hands back to the reins. I feel so mean, like I'm gagging her, but of course her safety comes first.
Like someone else has mentioned there are times when making out instructions on a horse can be difficult for all of us, I used to ride in an outdoor school and it was horribly windy and tipping it down with rain, not one of us could hear our RI's instructions, in the end she gave up and took us out on a hack instead.
Anyway, I'm rambling now, if you want to ride then go for it, any stables worth their lesson fees should work their hardest to accomodate your needs :)

[jemz]

I teach DeafBlind adults to ride and have made a point of learning BSL, makaton and sign supported english, althought I'm not fluent in any I have learnt enough to be able to communicate with the students with sight but hearing loss to be able to teach them and for them to progress, I think putting together a list of useful signs would be a great idea, especially if your RI is willing to learn them, I've had to learn it off my own back and I work for a nationwide charity, they gave us a couple of books with signs in but most dont relate to horses or riding so we've had to make up our own signs for some things but I thoroughly enjoy learning sign and find myself signing on a regular basis to my OH out of habit! Good luck!

[caj]

i work for a hearing support service and the new radio aids out plug into the hearing aid shoes as an attachment so there is no need to have anything on the body so would be less dangerousfor riding and you wouldnt need to spend whole lesson trying to lip read which would take up energy as well as distracting from instructions

[LMS]

You have given me an idea to try and make a little book of signs (Irish Sign language) for Horse Riding.
It would also be useful for the RDA as they are some non-verbal kids.
I had offer to volunteer to teach ISL.
But I have not been contacted to resume volunteering and start teaching basic signs to the volunteers at the local RDA.
I will remind them again.

Could someone give me a list of popular words/instructions in a riding lesson like:
Halt
Trot
Canter
Walk
etc or even an good instructor book on teaching.


In our canadian therapeutic riding manual for instructors there is a section that illustrates signs/hand signals for deaf & non-verbal riders. I would assume that your country's instructor RDA manual would have it too?

[Shannon_Clover]

LMS: In our canadian therapeutic riding manual for instructors there is a section that illustrates signs/hand signals for deaf & non-verbal riders.

Do you know where I can see pics of this or could you post pics of signs/hand signals here?
Or even a handbook with the signs in it that I could buy to show to the local RDA to let them know about this.
They dont know anything about sign language or hand signals and they have non-verbal hearing riders in their RDA.
So I assume that this is not available here. :o


Thanks.

Caj: "the new radio aids out plug into the hearing aid shoes as an attachment so there is no need to have anything on the body so would be less dangerousfor riding and you wouldnt need to spend whole lesson trying to lip read which would take up energy as well as distracting from instructions."

Where can I see this product online? Thanks

[aussieannie]

You may be deaf but if you can see and read check out my website. it will teach you so much about your self and riding you will only need an instructor to help you not teach you.
guaranteed.

[Shannon_Clover]

Hello,

Thanks for your reply.
That link is not working.
So I google and found it. I hope it the right one.
http://www.appliedpostureriding.com.au/

[Chukka]

I also taught a girl to ride who was deaf and we got on very well even though I did not know sign language but we she had private lessons. I think its a good idea to teach from horseback. Your at the same level so its easier to see.

We are doing sign language classes at work at the moment so I might enrol in them.

[Packhorse12]

I used to teach two profoundly deaf children. They were in group lessons with hearing children.

I kind of worked out things to tell them how to do what I wanted with basic signs - in the same way you might to someone who spoke a different language. It is fairly easy to do the basic things.

I knew the whole famil in the end - two families who were profoundly deaf and both had one hearing child and one profoundly deaf and most of them rode.

Most deaf people are very aware that they need to look at the person who is speaking and providing you open your mouth properly and say words clearly using your lips properly it is easier for them to lip read too.

You can easily demonstrate shortening the reins, and using a slowing down signal for them to go slower - palm downwards.

Trot is easy enough to demo with your hand palm downwards.
demo turning with your hand - is easy too. stop is basic.
canter - a bit more difficult to begin with but with an oval shape with your hand and arm - the sort of movement your seat makes in canter.

With a little ingenuity it is not too hard. Well I didnt think it was. Maybe the instructor is embarrased that she cant handle it properly. Maybe she is young and embarrased.
(dont know why I am making excuses for her though !!!)

Pac

[calvo]

i was born with severe hearing loss (i love selective hearing..lol) and if I cant hear, I just shout I cant hear you to the instructor and they just repeat it through the radio aid (I sometime tell the trainer off for mumbling hehehe:rolleyes:)

Deaf people can do the same as normal hearing people so its no different except you have to make sure they understand what they meant to do really:cool: (I cant do sign language but can do the letters but Im hoping to enrol in some classes at some point :) )

[LMS]

LMS:

Do you know where I can see pics of this or could you post pics of signs/hand signals here?
Or even a handbook with the signs in it that I could buy to show to the local RDA to let them know about this.
They dont know anything about sign language or hand signals and they have non-verbal hearing riders in their RDA.
So I assume that this is not available here. :o

Thanks.


So sorry for not responding. I can scan the pages & send them to you if you wish. Can't post them on here I'm afraid. (copyright)

[Packhorse12]

Hello Would that be the one shown on the Canadian Therapeutic Riding Association site

CanTRA Instructor Manual


http://www.cantra.ca/merchandise.shtml#resources


or is it some other site. If this is the one, it might be possible to purchase a copy by the look of it.

[oinkmoooink]

im not deaf, but if requested my instructors will give me a wakietalkie thing-carriage has no suspension whatsoever, or big windy arena riding

of course if your completly deaf this wouldnt help...

[sarah edwards]

i absoultley love teaching rda and i will always help riders what ever ther disabilty and accomodate as best i can even if ther isnt the means to ride alongside its amaing what you can do from the ground inregards to walking alongside and showing them from ther with your hands etc any decent riding school should accomdate ther need otherwise they shouldnt be teaching rda thats my opion

[Firefly]

I know someone who is profoundly deaf due to childhood meningitis and competes in one day events on his own home bred horses. There's nothing he can't do.
He lip reads anything he needs to know and then off he goes with no problems.

[Liz1949]

My best friends' eldest son - now in his 20's - has no hearing and never has, since birth. His speech is difficult to understand until you get to know him. His girlfriend is also profoundly deaf, but does have some hearing and speaks beautifully. They are both fluent in sign language, both lip-read and as long as they KNOW you are speaking, have little to no difficulty in understanding what is being said.

They have both enjoyed canoeing and white-water rafting on previous holidays and both hold down normal full-time jobs - he is a painter and decorator, she is a commis chef in a 5 star hotel. They're planning to go on a skiing holiday next year. They simply need to find somewhere they will be assured of having an English-mother-tongue instructor who is aware of their problem.

I am 110% positive that riding is no more difficult or risky to teach than is skiing - if either of them were the slightest bit interested I would happily start them off myself.

So I think this is not so much difficulties posed for the instructor by deaf, hard-of-hearing or non-verbal pupils, as laziness or ignorance on the instructor's part.

[fishiz3434]

In my old class i was with a deaf girl and she would go next to me or just behind so i could turn to her and repeat what was being said and if she couldn't understand me she's just copy or ask me to show her what she was doing wrong etc

It was really good for me too cos I'm training to be a coach and needed to learn to be aware of more than just my horse and myself

Any RI should be able to provide two good horses and either another rider or them selves to ride along with you

[rhsw]

:):):):):), brillant. xx