Parelli Program: Is it Worth it?

[Uma]

I am thinking about purchasing the Parelli Level 1 program for my horse Vega. I want opinions from people WHO HAVE BOUGHT AND USED the Parelli program. Is it worth the high price? Have you found a better alternative for a lower price?

Also I would like to hear from those that have bought the Parelli Success Program, I'd like to compare the two and see which would be the best for me to get.

Vega is a very sensitive horse with abuse in his past. I want to build a stronger more trusting relationship with him and just have safe fun with him. My long term goals are only to have a safe and fun pleasure horse that I can enjoy on the trails and trust to put my family on. That's all.

I'd love to hear your thoughts.

Thanks,

Uma

[Est]

Hi Uma
I only partly fit your criteria for replies :o :D because I'm too poor to buy the programme (but it often goes on ebay for reasonable prices, which could be a good starting point).

However I have tried working through the 7 games from this website (http://iceryder.net/7games.html) which explained it all very clearly. You could perhaps use this as a starting point and see how you get on with it?

A similar programme is Clinton Anderson's Downunder Horsemanship (http://www.amazon.com/Clinton-Andersons-Downunder-Horsemanship-Establishing/dp/1570762848/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1199399095&sr=8-1) which is very similar exercises, and you can make your own equipment for that to keep the cost down so it works out cheaper (I have the book and I think it's very good - clear layout and masses of photos to show what's being done).

A livery at my yard follows the Parelli programme and he has the Success Series as well as Levels 1 and 2, and he thinks it's great. He certainly has a good relationship with his horse! If you want to ask any specific questions about the programmes/DVDs, let me know and I'll ask him - I'm sure he'd be happy to talk about his experiences with it :)

Best of luck with Vega - sounds like he's very fortunate to have found such a caring mum :)

[Dancinglite]

I guess it depends if you want your horse as bored as this one?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ukspOPvtH8&mode=related&search

[Uma]

Thanks for the links Est, I think they will be very helpful. I've seen some of Clinton Anderson's stuff in the past, maybe I'll do some more research into his methods.

Dancinglit, I've seen that video before and yes I do admit that the horse looks a little board, but I've also seen a lot of other Parelli videos where the horses look like the are having lots of fun. Check these videos out (of course some of these are a lot more advanced into the Parelli program than just the starting & games, boy but it would be the ultimate!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_SuwgPEIxQ

This one here is Parelli himself riding bareback and bridleless.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcXcbXA9oVk

Tell me this horse isn't having fun!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqi0NlPvMEQ

I know what I think the problem is with the horse in the video you showed me. He was probably run through those drills so much it wasn't fun for him anymore. The girl in the video was taking a test to do all 7 games in 7 minutes, you know that must of practiced that a lot to accomplish that. That horse WAS board, but he was obedient and safe (which is more than what I can say for my horse). We just have to remember to keep it fun for them. I really do hope that someday I'll be able to do this sort of stuff with my Vega.

Uma

[Harry Hobbes]

Parelli Program: Is it Worth it?Depends on what you mean by both "it[s]."

If by "Parelli" you are referring to media, tools and procedure, then you get to decide if purchasing media (DVDs), tools (Carrot Stick, halter, etc.), or procedures (Friendly Game, etc.) - the incidentals - are worth the investment.

If by Parelli, you are referring to developing yourself within the world's largest and most successful people development program (in the equine context), then that's a different value proposition. What is self-development to a level of competence that you choose worth to you?

You can certainly accomplish your stated goal (in your third paragraph) by personal development within the Parelli program (and elsewhere, for that matter.)

But it isn't cheap because self-development to the competence levels obtainable through Parelli's offerings has value (and Parelli's prices reflect that value.) (And despite all the wishful thinking extant on newrider.com and elsewhere: TANSTAAFL)

The investment is very much a combination of cash (which is the easy part) and commitment and work on your part (time and effort - which is the value part, and is where the rubber meets the road.)

The Success Series is designed to cover several topics (in ten DVDs) broadly, but without the in-depth detail provided later in the Level programs; and without the step-by-step methodology. Think of the series as broadly introducing many topics, but not in-depth on any one topic.

As such, this serves as the foundational introduction, and forms the base of the pyramid of course offerings. (Parelli Professional Program being the apex.)

The three Level programs form the next layer of the pyramid, and get into lots of depth (detail) in a progressive manner (Level One, then Two, then Three.) Then comes the advanced development further up the pyramid.

Parelli's programs are far and away better than the videos published by such folks as John Lyons and Buck Brannaman, for the simple reason that Lyons and Brannaman are largely demonstrating how to train horses, while Parelli's courses are more educationally oriented toward people learning, using real students. (Parelli's original VCR programs were also largely demonstrations; his updated courses now show real students learning - and making mistakes that are corrected. Hence the need for many DVDs to replace each original VCR tape.)

I purchased the first three Level Programs years ago as VCR tapes. I now have the Success Series and have reviewed the new Level One Program (in DVD) and the Liberty and Horse Behavior set (in DVD.) I expect to upgrade to the DVD Level One and Two Programs and purchase the Liberty and Horse Behavior set within a year or two.

For yourself, it may be more beneficial to join the Savvy Club for a period of time, and review the DVDs sent to you. (Eight of them per year.) Although not designed to be "courseware," these are highly educational, as you get to see what success can be, and how it is achieved, using the Parelli principles, methods, technique and tools - but most of all: mindset. (What Parelli refers to as "emotional fitness.")

Then, based on what you learn from those DVDs, you can make a more informed decision about pursuing or not pursuing further course work. Personally, I find that the eight DVDs per year is worth the 20 USD per month club fee.

Or, you may be able to review some of the DVDs from local Savvy club members; then decide whether or not Parelli fits your needs.

Best regards,
Harry

[CMR]

I first bought the Level 1 program, with all the recommened items: halters(three different sizes), carrot stick, lunge, leadrope, rope bridle, etc.

It did nothing for my horses. I was expecting some super secret magic knowledge that I didn't know. It wasn't. It was extremely basic. So I bought Level 2, thinking the amazing things would happen then. Again, nothing.

As I had thrown enough money to them, I did not buy Level 3 in hopes to find the "secrets" then. :p

My horses and I did the exercises. I came into it "just to see," and thinking that I was going to have some amazing wisdom imparted onto me. I could already read body language, and work with my horses fine. We had no problems to fix, and I wasn't someone looking for a magic cure for anything.

My huge beef with Parelli, is it is advertised as though someone who has never been near a horse can just pick up the home system and fix their bucker, rearer, biter, kicker, etc. I don't see how that is possible.
What I see Parelli as, is a certain system of groundwork and training. The prior knowledge must be there to do ANY sort of groundwork or training alone(with no experienced help). You must also know ALOT about horses to have the "amazing" results many of their top people have. I suppose beginners could glean information from it, and get ideas about a way to do things, but they would need to work with a good instructor to really do anything.

Overall, Parelli is just an overpriced training system. For beginners, it could work well, only in addition to support by an experienced person. That could also be said for any good training program. A beginner is going to be able to get good results from any training program with experienced help. There is no training system out there that would allow beginners to go it alone successfully.

I prefer to not only follow one system, I take what I want from many ideas, and bring them together to create my own version. I suppose what I mushed together would fall under the "Classical Dressage" heading. It focuses on being soft on ground and in the saddle, as well as teaching the horse to carry itself and a rider properly.

A book I *love* that falls under the "Classical Dressage" heading is 'Right from the Start' by Michael Schaffer. On the cover it says "Create a Sane, Soft, Well-Balanced Horse." It focuses on many groundwork exercises, some much like Parellis seven games. However, amazingly, it doesn't require for you to buy hundreds of dollars worth of his equipment. In fact, I don't even think he has tack to sell! Outstanding! ;) :p


Okay, I will shut the trap now. I know people can only standing so much negative spewing before they tune out and start rolling their eyes :D

Just one more last thing though, I detest the halters. Hate, Hate, Hate. They fit none of my horses properly. Either the halters have weird proportions, or all five of my horses heads do :cool:

[Harry Hobbes]

By the by,

The Parelli YouTube video referenced in your post, above, is taken from Pat's original VCR tape set from circa 1993. This is a three-tape set with five parts and was filmed mostly in Australia. It pre-dates the Level programs.

The complete sequence (of the YouTube video) on those original tapes ran about ten minutes to a really snappy Bluegrass soundtrack provided by Denis Caplinger and John Moore. The complete sequence shows Pat and Chinook (the gray mare) doing all kinds of different things, such as repeated flying lead changes on every stride, cutting a cow from a herd, and jumping high obstacles. All without tack or equipment.

The complete sequence is a real toe-tapping and exciting demonstration.

Best regards,
Harry

[Alyth Long]

I have been following the Parelli system for about 9 years now. It is the best thing since sliced bread!! When I went to my first clinic I was surprised how often things that I learned as a child came up. As Pat says "its so old it's new again!!" . I bought things gradually as I could afford them. Started with the halter, then the 12' line, then the carrot stick and string. There were no levels packs in those days so I managed with the book and a couple of clinics. I bought the packs as they came out. With birthday and Christmas presents windfalls and savings I have added more halters, a 22' line a bareback pad and a theraflex pad for under the saddle. The only costs I have nowadays is any clinics I can get to. Think how much traditionalists spend on riding lessons and at the saddlery!!! I am still using the original halter and line. My mum used to say to me "you get what you pay for" and that is very true. My equipment is excellent quality and lasts a very long time. And you can never put a value on knowledge. The PNH system is a people training system par excellence. Go for it!!!

[Lili & Morgan]

If by Parelli, you are referring to developing yourself within the world's largest and most successful people development program (in the equine context), then that's a different value proposition. What is self-development to a level of competence that you choose worth to you?


Yep that is a VERY good description.

I have joined the International Savvy club, and then bought the "new" level one program ... the material is EXCELLENT! really a reference for self-developemnet educational system.

However, having a difficult/challenging horse, I did need the help of a Parelli instructor. But I have a very difficult dominant mare ... so


I would advice you to join the Savvy Club first then see if you like it. Then invest in the gear etc ...

Lodge Ropes on here, also sell excellent gear. It is worth to invest in good gear. I have also bought second-hand Parelli gear ... still excellent state.

Have fun!

[wonkeywoody]

Hi
As I've posted many times before I got 'into' Parelli cos my boy had developed a vertical rear, and despite 35 years of horseowning and BHS training I couldnt fix him (neither could other VERY experienced poeple I asked for help) The problem just compounded.
I got L1 & 2 at the same time off ebay. I've never bought 'the kit', I made a CS myself and still use a normal headcollar and lungeline.
I started back in March. In the summer I enjoyed a few visits to the beach where I was confident enough in my horse to go for a canter on the buckle end of my reins! NEVER thought that was possible.
Now working on L3 (again purchased off ebay having sold on 1&2) Still having great fun.
The changes in my horse are too many to list on here. All I can say is that they are all positive.
The changes in me and my approach are mainly that I am much calmer, have developed endless patience and am more confident as now tend to find a way to sort a problem with horse savvy as oppose to the 'traditional' ways I was always taught. I was never taught how to read the situation, more "if he does this, you do that" (regardless of the circumstances), now I appreciate WHAT my horse is telling me. Must be much nicer for him.
I find it great to be able to do something else other than hacking/schooling or jumping.
I have purchased 3 of the SS, which I felt were appropriate to me and 'My horse wont go' . They cover alot of ground that is in the levels, but they do offer other pieces of useful info. I wouldnt recommend purely buying the SS as it doesnt 'start' at the beginning!
I appreciate that NH or PNH is not for everyone. However, for me it was the best thing I've done in years, and without it I probably would have had to put my boy to sleep as I couldnt pass him on for someone else to beat the **** out of...................

[Afellpony]

Yes, it's worth it if it's what you really want.

[Uma]

Thanks for all the input everyone, I think all of your opinions are going to help me make the right choice... I need to think it over a little more.

If anyone has anything else to say about the subject I would love to hear it.

Thanks,

Uma

[Joyscarer]

I think for me the P1 gave me a reaffirmed beief in myself and worked in manageable chunks to give me direction.

I could see the progress when working through the programme methodically and because my issue is not that I can't do it but that I beleive I can't do it, this was exactly what I needed.

I liked the little pocket books which I took into the yard with me.

I did buy a rope halter (which has never been out of the pack!) and a carrot stick copy which I never really used :rolleyes:

The way the Parrelli was presented may me better able to make use of the information in there. Parelli used consultants specialising in how people learn.

Yes the information is out there cheaper in other places but having done the Parelli it makes me better able to take on information from other sources that isn't so well presented.

For me Parelli great. I wouldn't buy it new and I have no inclination to do tests on P1 or go onto P2 but it has given me the basis to read around and more sense of everyone elses work :D

[KateWooten]

Errrrr .... HH, yes the parelli program is better produced and much clearer than ummm ... Buck Brannaman :confused: John Lyons ???? Good Grief, these guys are older than God. Compare like with like ! Parelli, (IMHO), does NOT compare particularly favourably with, say Clinton Anderson. The Parelli program for sure, purports to take a complete novice to parelli horse trainer spectacular in 20 easy payments of only 19,999 (or 'Zero to Hero' as he modestly describes his own journey !) - but others will allow you access to the same information with far, far less of the BS (and the cha-ching!)

You really don't need to buy into the Parelli cult if you don't want to. (of course, you can, if you want to). Some people really take to it. I don't. It's horses for courses. If you watch the guy enough you can easily figure out if you can stand his attitude or not.

Personally, I do not think the old level packs are worth the money. Neither do I think the residential courses, the new style, are good value either. Some of his materials are outstanding. His trailer loading DVD is easily the best of the (many) that I've seen.

But it's all nothing new. If you want step-by-step video instruction on groundschool, in a simple, no BS, no hoops to jump through, progressive kind of way to build a better bond with your horse, I personally prefer Clinton Anderson's groundschool DVD sets.

[Lili & Morgan]

But it's all nothing new. If you want step-by-step video instruction on groundschool, in a simple, no BS, no hoops to jump through, progressive kind of way to build a better bond with your horse, I personally prefer Clinton Anderson's groundschool DVD sets.


They aren't cheap either :D

After having an horrendous experience with John Lyons's DVD ... costed a fortune and were utterly BADLY made!

So far Parelli has not match. It is not what Parelli teaches, it is HOW.

Maybe that is why he has such a big following. No, I am not cultish, I do not like the guy, he has such a big EGO, but Clinton with his "mate" everywhere gets to me too.
But I like Linda's teaching ( not riding). She is very skilled at teaching. I think she the one making the difference, IMO.

[wonkeywoody]

Yes the information is out there cheaper in other places but having done the Parelli it makes me better able to take on information from other sources that isn't so well presented.

Ditto that. I've hunted around and seen many 'NH s' other vidoes etc. Its nice to see how others' do 'it' - some had given me a new way to approach something, but only cos I UNDERSTAND the whys and wherefores....

[Uma]

A lot of you are talking about "Cheaper Alternatives" but I'm having a hard time finding anything like that. I know about Clinton Anderson but he is pretty pricey to. I haven't been impressed with much I've seen or heard of Lyons. Who else is out there with such a program?

Thanks,

Uma

[Spoof]

I guess it depends if you want your horse as bored as this one?

People keep saying this and showing that video. What do you expect to see? The horse looks content to me, doing what horses do 90% of the day in a dirt paddock, despite the woman and the orange stick. :p

That is a horse I'd feel safe putting my family on, bored or not.

I think the programs are worth it for what you are looking to get out of your horse. I bought my ropes other places to save a little $$, got the halter and stick from parelli.

I'd say keep an eye on ebay or tacktrader.com, they show up on there too. Also, find out if there is a Yahoo group mailing list for yor your area. People occasionally have level one and two kits on them, as well as equipment. Actually, you are close enough that you could keep an eye on ours, it is southernsavvyriders@yahoogroups.com. There may be someone in your area that will loan you the kit(s). :)

Good luck!

[Harry Hobbes]

A lot of you are talking about "Cheaper Alternatives" but I'm having a hard time finding anything like that. Caveat Emptor: You get what you pay for:

Value = Benefits - Cost (All factors evaluated from the buyer's perspective.)

If you see (or realize) the benefits of an integrated, progressive education program that develops you in a planned and orderly fashion, and based upon educational development methods (much like a degree program), then to you, its value is high.

If you see (or realize) the benefits of stand-alone videos on specific topics where you get to integrate the courses yourself (much like taking individual technical courses outside of a degree program), then to you, their value is high.

The thing to keep in mind is that from a personal development perspective, comparing Anderson (and Brannaman, Cox, Pate, etc.) to Parelli (and Lyons), is the equivalent to comparing apples to oranges; that is, comparing stand-alone training courses to an intergrated and progressive education program.

There is very much a difference between "training" and "education."

Anderson is a horse trainer, who is passing his knowledge on in a show and tell style. Parelli is an educator, developing people physically, mentally and emotionally. (Which you can discern from the offerings on each of their web sites.)

Hence, we come back to the original question that you have to answer for yourself: Depends on what you mean by both "it[s]." (From your first post.)

What do you want? (That is, what to you value?) Show and tell? (And you'll connect the dots.) Or well-rounded education? (That maps out and offers progression paths.)
Who else is out there with such a program?Of the well-known names, only Lyons and Parelli have "programs" for people development.

Lyons is limited to his "Trainer Certification Program." He also offers a ground manual and riding manual, which are compilations of training exercises from start to finish. The remainder of his offerings are various "how to..." videos on specific topics (just like Anderson's.)

But if you only want training, then Anderson (and many others) will do nicely.

Best regards,
Harry

[Uma]

Thanks for all the input everyone. I've decided to go ahead and purchase the level 1. I think it is definitely what is best for Vega. Although I think I'm going to try and find some less expensive versions for the Parelli equipment. Does anyone know of any good sites that sell similar equipment? I might buy the Downunder Horsemanship Handy stick instead of the Carrot Stick because I've used it before, it does the same job, and it's less expensive. But if I can find one even cheaper that would be great.

Thanks again everyone,

Uma

[jinglejoys]

http://www.freewebs.com/lodgeropes/trainingstick.htm :)

[Lili & Morgan]

Regarding the "bored" horse DVD :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ukspOPvtH8&mode=related&search

I am not sure that he is bored ... he looks like a left brain introvert, more woah than go. If you watch, you can see him ignoring her, then re-connecting to her, thinking " okay if I really have to ... sigh I'll do it".
He is a laid-back horse.
Yes he was drilled into the exercises, but I think she is really good.
Well I will be happy to do the same. but My mare is left brain extrover, there will be more energy and opinion expressed :D

Uma - you posted a video with Jen and Tres 4 yrs old QH, it was impressive, but the horse looked really ****ed off more than once. I doubt he had much fun ... Just MO ... well trained horse .

Regarding tack, I highly recommand LodgeRopes ;)
But it is better to get your carrot stick somewhere closed to you, it costs a fortune to post :D

[Harry Hobbes]

Regarding tack, I highly recommand LodgeRopes ;)
But it is better to get your carrot stick somewhere closed to you, it costs a fortune to post :DOr make your own:

http://77.72.200.82/forum/showthread.php?t=32827

[KateWooten]

I have to admit to still not seeing the difference between Parelli's training people to move the horse about and saying why, and Anderson's showing people how to move a horse about and why ! You get out, watch the horse, move him about and learn ! it's not rocket science, and it shouldn't be costing $3000 a week to go study with the guru with the flappy fringes !

I really don't think people need a 'do this packet, then this packet, then this packet and you'll be a horse trainer' approach. They are pretty much intelligent enough to be able to buy 'a progressive groundwork series' then 'a progressive ridden work series'. Seriously, if people are really not, if they really need hand-holding to the extent that the parelli program claims to, then perhaps they should reconsider whether they're ready for this journey.

John Lyons stuff is truly dreadful, and I can't figure out why he even comes up in these sort of conversations any more. That 'Riding Manual' effort is the single most badly produced, incoherent work I have ever tried to work through. It surpasses even Western Horseman's 'Horse.Man.Ship' for obfuscation.

But if people are thinking that no other trainers have produced materials which can take them from near novice, to well-equipped to have a great relationship with their horse, they're just wrong !

Personally, I learn by 'doing', as long as I'm always building on what I already know - not leaping ahead to things I'm not ready for. It makes not one whit of difference to me, whether we achieve this progression by focussing on ME as the 'level one learner' or focus on the horse as the unbroke learner. Either way, I can progress, step-by-step, at my (and his) own pace, learning as I go.

This famed distinction between people-developing and horse-developing is a complete fallacy. In My Humble Opinion.

[Spoof]

I purchased some things from these guys, they were very friendly. http://www.naturalhorsesupply.com/

[Uma]

I realize that Parelli's methods of training aren't all new. People have been doing the stuff he's doing for a long time. But he and Linda put all of that info into ways that people can understand, as he has said himself "This isn't new stuff, people have been doing this for a long time. I just married the right woman who showed me how to put it in a box." :D

Honestly, if Parelli was presenting all stuff that was completely new, completely unheard of, I probably wouldn't go for it. I would consider it a gimmick. I just like the way he puts it all in a fresh way. "It's so old, it's new again."

There are no horse trainers in my area that I would trust to train my horse or walk me through the process. I'm right smack dab in the middle of Walking Horse country, not that all walking horse trainers are bad (I'm not that ignorant) but in my area everyone seems to be in it for the money and for nothing else. I need a program like Parelli's to guide me through the process. I'm not cultish in anyway either, show me something better or just as good and I'll go for it too.

Thanks to everyone that posted links to the tack sites. Very helpful.

Uma

[Chilli]

If it’s how you want to work with your horse and it works for you then yes.

The problem is knowing before you buy if it’s going to work for you.

Personally 10 or so years ago when I tried it, I didn’t have the skills for it to work for me and as I learned more and gained those skill I realised it’s not what i wanted to do to the point now where it’s what I dislike about Horsemanship.

But those who get on with it love it and those that don’t slate it, it’s like most things in life.

I’ve found everything to do with horses costs :(

[Jenni]

i am have always been slightly anti parelli. mostly due to the 'if you buy this dvd etc you will have a bond with your horse and everyone who doesnt do parelli is wrong'

so i bought it and honestly i think its quite rubbish.
he doesnt seem to enjoy it and i have taught him to do things myself much quicker and easier for him to understand.

Its going on e-bay asap.

i think most of the people who glorify it are the ones who dont have much basic common sense generally and because someone has written down and given them step by step instructions they get to the result.

But how many people who use parelli actually do much more than the 7 games with their horse?
If being able to do the games is the thing to judge competence on then i find it quite insulting.

[KateWooten]

HOLY COW !!! I must be going blind ! UMA !!! HEY !!!! :Waves and jumps about like a loon: Where are you ? Fancy coming out for a pony ride ? :D


Kate (in Tennessee, also surrounded by WH people !)

[wonkeywoody]

i think most of the people who glorify it are the ones who dont have much basic common sense generally and because someone has written down and given them step by step instructions they get to the result.

..... gee, thanks a bunch........so much for 34 years of horse ownership and several years of BHS training then, not to mention all the successful competition, representing Club at the British Champs but to name a few...........

But how many people who use parelli actually do much more than the 7 games with their horse?

.........eeerrrrr, well, me for one..................

[Crystal Fire]

Cheaper alternative: www.silversand.com.au
But don't expect loads of courses and instructors, or even loads of DVD's and stuff to buy. The Basic Skills set is a good basic intro to natural horsemanship at a fraction of the cost of Parelli level 1 though. The approach is rather different to Parelli, so it would be up to you to choose how you go about things.

[wonkeywoody]

Ha, jenni - just read your signature.................

[Joyscarer]

I really don't think people need a 'do this packet, then this packet, then this packet and you'll be a horse trainer' approach. They are pretty much intelligent enough to be able to buy 'a progressive groundwork series' then 'a progressive ridden work series'. Seriously, if people are really not, if they really need hand-holding to the extent that the parelli program claims to, then perhaps they should reconsider whether they're ready for this journey.

I did and am ready for the journey. Just because Parelli isn't for you doesn't mean that you should question whether I am ready for for horses just because it clicked with me :mad:

I don't call Parelli 'hand-holding' any more than I would refer to any other trainer in such a way. I see it a thoughtfully presented good progressive course that follows a logical sequence and therefore worked better for me as a first forray into NH than other trainers.

As for Clinton Anderson, his is not a name that pops up for sale very often over here in the UK on my favorite sites. The brand new individual books I have seen up for sale over here are actually more expensive than the Parelli books! I also can't seem to find them second hand which is how I have bought Parelli. I won't spend out more than double the cost ( I don't see the point of buying new on books if I can help it) on something I haven't had a chance to see for myself to be able to place a value judgement on. I certainly don't have more that £20 to throw at something I might not click with.

If I see them coming up at a price that I would consider risking then I will buy it based on the respect I have for your opinion but as yet I haven't found anything. I have to admit I am curious to see what you have been raving on about and do like to read as much as I can :)

Having said that I wouldn't consider the new Parelli packs good value either but then that comes from my 'why pay more than you have to' ethos in buying many things second hand. Good bless the likes of eBay for saving you money.

As for the hype surrounding Parelli, I don't buy into that but was lucky enough to borrow first without knowing a thing about Parelli. I liked what I saw, decided it connected with me and then found a second hand copy which I could sell at the same as I bought it for if I wanted to part with it so wouldn't be losing money.

I have no wish to be able to work at the level that lady in the clip was doing. That sort of work holds no interest for me but Parelli was just what I needed at the time to combat a crisis of confidence due to becoming stuck in a rut.

Learning is a very personal experience. To my mind the Parelli L1 would work for a larger proportion of the horsey population than other methods. It works on an auditory, visual, and kinetic level.

I would be loathe to put down those that work better in one way over another, all I do say is that if you work better seeing a DVD and then trying to replicate with a pocket handbook and then recording your achievements then Parelli has it all there in a bundle.

I like to think that when I work with Joy I am doing my best to set her up to succeed (I can't rember what NH trainer I got that from - all of them maybe?) and Parelli did just that for me.

[Alyth Long]

I am finding this discussion quite amusing!!
As is usual there are a number of people who dislike PNH and they usually don't know anything about the system!! For instance Jennis post about things other than the 7 games. Actually everything everone does with a horse any time is one or more of the 7 games!! It is simply different levels of play. Many of the alternatives have been developed by people who went through the PNH system and are now marketing their own version!!
For inspiration have any of you watched Mikey and Red Sun on youtube?
Alyth

[Harry Hobbes]

...so i bought it and honestly i think its quite rubbish...Its going on e-bay asap.So are you going to advertise it as "rubbish?"

Or commit fraud?

[cvb]

There is a saying - I think it is from martial arts ? I heard Mark Rashid use it in one of his stories ;)

When the student is ready, the teacher will appear

By which I mean that I think we are all open to different messages, teachings, etc at different points in time depending on the journey we are on.

Whether X education package is going to be of value to Y person (and their horse by association) often depends on what teacher they are ready for at that point in time ?

I've heard a lot of people talk about how they turned to PNH when they had a problem and had tried everything else... and everything else had not worked.

For me - I had a loan horse for a year where the owners had started PNH - so it only seemed fair to the horse to be consistent. I have, over time, acquired old levels 1 2 and 3, and new level 1. But only really used old level 1 (I confess... one of these days...) However all the associated "stuff" (articles, conferences, savvy club etc) have meant I have not just stood still... and I have found myself being able to apply the principles in ways outside of the 7 games. In fact mostly outside of the 7 games !

[Joyscarer]

There is a saying - I think it is from martial arts ? I heard Mark Rashid use it in one of his stories ;)

Now there is a trainer I enjoying reading. Highly recommended to put you in the right frame of mind IMHO :D

[Lili & Morgan]

inspiration have any of you watched Mikey and Red Sun on youtube?
Alyth

This one :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ow2yDdRK_Zc

Very impressive :cool:

[Lizbeth]

Thanks for all the input everyone. I've decided to go ahead and purchase the level 1. I think it is definitely what is best for Vega. Although I think I'm going to try and find some less expensive versions for the Parelli equipment. Does anyone know of any good sites that sell similar equipment? I might buy the Downunder Horsemanship Handy stick instead of the Carrot Stick because I've used it before, it does the same job, and it's less expensive. But if I can find one even cheaper that would be great.

Thanks again everyone,

Uma

Hi Uma
Don't know if you've gone ahead yet, but I have the level 1 and level 2 programs. OK, I admit, I didn't get all that far, but that was down to me, not my horse. Actually she just stood there and yawned at me, as though she was thinking 'for god's sake woman, sort it out!!!:D
So if you don't mind my scribbly notes in a couple of the notebooks in level 1, other than that, it's all in pristine condition. I have the equipment too, though, that's quite well used, but only in a 'muddy' sense! Let me know if you are still looking....
Lizbeth :)

[Uma]

Wow, those Red Sun videos are amazing. I guess that gives the rest of us something to dream about and aim for.

Thanks for sharing.

P.S. Lizbeth, I sent you a PM about the stuff you have to sell.

[Jenni]

i just did not think it lived up to the hype.
excuse me for having an opinion after making the effort to actually learn about it.

I just felt it was not teaching you anything other than what you can learn at a good riding school about handling horses correctly.

The one video that made me laugh had a part about tacking up your horse. He taught you how to tack up a horse.
By the end of it i was still waiting on the bit where he was going to show you how it was any different to how you normally tack up a horse?
It was utter nonsense.

as for my 'no common sense' remark. i think its valid.
i was watching a programme and this guy had graduated from harvard etc,yet he still did not have the ability to get a dog to stay when it was told, or to figure out how to break it down into small stages so he could teach the dog.
These are the people i mean, the ones who cant think around a problem themselves so they get a step by step instruction book, which is great so long as the outcome is the same.

[Crystal Fire]

I think you tend to get two different categories of people interested in Parelli. You get those who need to go back to basics and get some confidence from day 1 (those who might appreciate some tips on good practise when tacking up for example). Then you get those who aim to go all the way and want to learn to ride without tack, do extreme liberty work etc.
You should be able to learn good basics at a decent riding school, but you certainly can't learn extreme liberty. ;)
Jenni, if you wanted to go further with Parelli you should have just knocked level 1 on the head in a few days, then gone on to level 2 and beyond. Probably EBaying the level 1 pack as you went. I think by the end of level 2 you would have started to see some of the things that makes the more dedicated Parelli students so enthusiastic.

[mayoguinness]

At present I'm staying with an Ex Pafrelli Instructer, she was a Parelli Instructer a while a go but has since progressed a lot on her horsemanship journy. Her views on Parelli are that its right for some humans and horses at certain times in their journy together, you can overface a horse easily but it depends on how you interpret and change it. Parelli horses have to fit into a box, its your job to make that box more flexible if and when necerserry to fit in with the horse. Do it if it feels right as thats proberly where you need to be at this point and then you can be ready to move on when you want, if it doesn't feel right - stop and move on. You're not gunna lose anything as long as you check in and listen to your horse accept maybe a few $$$ but nothing ventured, nothing gained and it might be good to refer back to in the future if thats the case.

[mayoguinness]

So are you going to advertise it as "rubbish?"

Or commit fraud?

lol:D, that put a smile on my face in these 45 degreee conditions:rolleyes:

[VickiGG]

So are you going to advertise it as "rubbish?"

Or commit fraud?


ROTFLOL :D

[VickiGG]

Everyone learns differently - I cannot learn well from a book - or from just watching someone do it on a DVD - so I liked the fact that with the new Level courses you got all three - theory, watching someone do it - and get it wrong too, and then tasks to go and do for your self. A really good way of home study - one of the best IMHO.

Parelli is not about fitting a horse into a box - but I think Linda now admits the early levels courses were interpreted that way by some - it's actually (to me) quite the opposite - it now gives you multiple ways of dealing with an issue depending on the horse that turns up on the day, and his personality.

I also find it so strange that some people get so upset about others spending money on Parelli, or in fact loving it! Who cares?!

Each to their own I say.

My horses are certainly happier and more interested in me now - 6 months into Parelli - and I have alot more confidence, my riding position is better also.

I had tried the traditional riding schools - I didn't agree with alot of their methods to be honest so moved on. Sure I am a reasonably new rider, so may fall into Jennis lack of common sense category! but my friend who has been riding horses all her life has been doing the new Levels too and she has had some outstanding results with her ridden horses as well as her young horses.

:D