Barefoot trimming & simple systems q's?

[Kc..]

My mum arranged for a barefoot trimmer to come and have a look at Nim to see if he could do it yesterday. I'm very anti no shoes as last time he went lame for months. I do realise that this method of trimming works differently to the normal farrier no shoes trimming but even so i would hate for Nim to end up lame again. So what are everyones views and experiences of it?

She said she would take him as a case study as his feet are so un-ready to do it (made me even more sceptical) she said she'd be confident if she did his back feet within a week he'd be fine but his fronts are a different story.

She also said that we would need to change feeds, we've only just found a feed that keeps weight on him so i'm a bit sceptical about this. It would mean cutting out all sugars etc, she reckoned simple systems did have a veteran mix that keeps weight on.. anyone used this?

I do like the idea of a) the money saving in not having shoes and b) the reduction of concusion through his legs without shoes. But still i'm sceptical.

What are your thoughts?

[Roofio]

i don't think barefoot has saved me money. it hasn't cost me more either, its roughly the same. hopefully when things settle down more, it will be a bit cheaper. what 'sort' of trimmer was it?

my two have low sugar diets - i use fibrebeet to keep weight on and it works well.

eta- J's feet were so bad when his shoes came off i thought he would keel over and die without them, he hasn't so far ;)

[Kc..]

Erm.. something to do with 'natural' trimming. I have seen it before and it worked well, but that was on a cobby good doer.. Nimby's a poxy 23yo tbx :)

After how thin he got over winter i'm really worried about a feed change it would mean no speedi beat, no build-up, no show shine cherry chaf! etc etc

Also it would mean giving him magnesium which we used as a calmer when i was XC'ing & hunting. He doesn't need calming at 23!

Btw.. as he'd be a case study it would all be free and any support needed she owuld give :)

[Roofio]

speedi beet is ok i think!?

if your confident she's not a crock, and your committed to the level of input he might need (possibly booting up daily for turnout, gaffa taping on pads, hand walking, scrubbing feet daily, that sort of thing) then you have nothing to loose!

[Sooty]

I believe Speedibeet is unmollassed so will be fine, or you could use Simple System Purabeet. I haven't used their veteran products but all their feed is forage based so would be based on lucerne rather than grain. I feed my two on SS feed (both youngsters though) and they both do very well on it.

Magnesium only works as a calmer if the horse's diet is deficient in magnesium - it doesn't act like a sedative and won't zonk your old boy out! It is, however, brilliant for feet :)

[Kc..]

I think it would be very good for Nimby, i spose if it doesn't go well he can wear boots or just have his shoes back on. Just don't want him dropping weight, over summer he'll be fine just don't want to get to next winter and him drop weight :rolleyes:

[0dd]

It does take patience and perserverance (sp?) but we'd already been trying corrective shoeing (to correct underrun heels) for a year with not a lot of luck so I guess you could say barefoot was our last resort.

We had the vet out about 8 weeks after the first trim and the vet announced him sound after lunging him on the bark surface and trotting him up on concrete ^^
We bought him some easyboot epics to ride in so that he would be comfortable whilst riding on the roads.

This was 2 years ago! I admit we're still "transitioning" as we slacked a bit in that department and we still need to work on toughening the feet and encouraging concavity, but his heels are nearly in the right place now.
We've been galloping over stubble fields, hacking on the roads for a couple of hours at a time, and show jumping (all without boots!).

I've just ordered some Hoof eeze boots now so that we can do some more pad walking when I am home to encourage concavity, growth and get the foot working as it should. We should be fully transitioned by now but I am at uni during the week so it is difficult to find time to do so currently.

I think barefoot is most definitely worth it if you are prepared to put the time in to make it work, and of course if shoeing simply isn't working for you!

http://photos-269.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v108/149/0/518047269/n518047269_79934_1877.jpg

A pic of us last year "popping" a jump :D

[MelanieD]

Is he totally sound in shoes? Are the feet so bad that they can't be improved with shoes on? I'm a big fan of barefooting but not sure I'd go for it in a 23yo horse that'd struggle unless the horse wasn't ok in shoes either.

Speedibeet should be ok since it isn't mollassed. A low sugar diet is good but if the bucket feed is only a small part of the overall diet the amount of sugar in the hay/haylage/grass is much more important. TBH I've had less trouble feeding sugary 'equine junk food' than i have with bl**dy alfalfa, which is a part of most simple systems diets. I'm not a big fan of magnesium either but it seems to work for some.

Having said all that though.. boots and pads are great for comfort and if you only did the barefoot thing for a month or two even that'd give some improvement. Being shod all the time isn't really a good thing for the feet. And being free does make it rather appealing. You could always try it with the plan of putting shoes back on if it doesn't work out.

[Kc..]

He is 100% sound in shoes, but i think it would be much better for him to have them off. Redues concusion etc..

Not to mention the fact it would save shed loads in money, but i'd rather have a healthy horse than a cheap one that's why i ask :)

[Yann]

I have to say I might also be thinking about not fixing something that wasn't broken on a veteran. That said barefoot is a very good way of fixing feet and improving soundness in terms of the horse's way of going, I've seen an old pony given a new lease of life by following this route.

SS stuff seems to be good for keeping weight on to be honest, and as others have said there's no issue with continuing with speedibeet if you want to, I have. If the trimmer wasn't doing it for free it wouldn't be saving you money :D

[Kc..]

Can going barefoot be better for a horse with a bit of arthritus?

[Yann]

I would have thought so, less concussion and better foot balance won't do any harm at all.

[shandy84]

Simple systems has not been adequate for weight maintenance on my 6yr old, I wouldn't be comfortable switching a veteran to it unless they were a very good dooer

[Kc..]

Well Nimby does have a bit of arthritus in his left knee and shoulder not bad only slightly, so i was thinking it would be better for him to get rid of the shoes.

And Shandy that's what i was worried about, they do say that the veteren mix keeps the weight on though.. And Nimby isn't a good doer at all..

[Yann]

You don't have to feed SS as such, just make sure what you are feeding is low in sugar and starch, because it can and does make a lot of difference to the feet in many horses. There are lots of off the shelf feeds that tick the boxes too.

[Kc..]

Yeah it's definately something to look into, going ot take alot of work but i think it'll turn out for the best..