Pointing Out Toes

[Maggles4Lyf]

ARGH!!
sorry guys, but i really need your help on this one (if possible)
okay. my problem is that when i ride, my toes point out. Not just 'oh my toes point out slightly, its not going to hinder my riding in any way', its more like they stick out really far if that makes sense.
I have asked my RI about it (who i get along with really well, and we ended up talking about it whilst out on a hack!) and it turns out she had the same problem, but when she was 9/10. What she didnt tell me, was how to fix it , which is why I am turning to my fellow NRs.
i am including some pics, but please no critique except for my toes, as my leg position is because of the saddle (which i cant change, and it is much much better in other saddles).
Virtual Cookie if you got through that!!

*PICS!!!!!*

halt:
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/PICT0220.jpg
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/PICT0195.jpg

walk:
(on the grey)
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/JulyCamp059.jpg
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/PICT0311.jpg

trot:
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/trot3.jpg
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/Jan08241.jpg

canter:
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/canta5.jpg

gallop:
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/CopyofTakenoffvideo001copy.jpg

jump:
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/Rivernmezoomedjumping.jpg
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc218/ping_meep_random-noises/recent%20riding%20for%20toes/RiverJumpVideoFrame005.jpg

Thanks in advance guys, i have literally tried everything short of tying my feet to the girth to fix this!!!!

[Bay Mare]

To be honest I think that lengthening your stirrups a bit for flatwork would help so that you can bring your butt forward in the saddle. From there you can drape your legs and, until your hips stretch out, think of stretching down the outside of the leg, you'll probably find more weight in your little toes at first but this is fine and should even out as your hips release. Initially don't worry about your knees being slightly off the saddle as this, too, will rectify itelf.

It may not be an option for you but I also found that things improved when I used the stirrups with the 'eye' at 90 degrees to normal ... the stirrup hangs so that it's facing forwards so you're not fighting to bring your toes in.

[Maggles4Lyf]

thanks BM :D
shall try all of this next time i ride :)

[Chukka]

Yes I agree take them down two holes or before you do ride without stirrups for a while stretching the legs down as I think you are relying on them a little too much.

Also you are pushing your heels down a lot so making your toes push out, so work without stirrups should help. The only way to fix it is practice practice pracitice as your body has got used to the way you ride now.

[Fanshawe]

Might also be worth seeking an osteo/chiro to check if they can increase the flexibility in your spine/hips which will help you do what BM and Chukka have suggested. I used to do this with one leg and it was considerably helped with osteopathic intervention followed by lots and lots of practice!

[LaurenEff]

Practice, Practice and more Practice. Thats how i learnt and today after 5 lessons of constanty checking, they stayed in the right place today.

[vivi]

Read a Mary Wanless book! Its just your position in the saddle that is causing the problem. Firstly try standing in your stirrups at halt. Your lower leg will have to move back to stay underneath you. Try to keep it there. Repeat at halt til feel you can balance standing in the stirrups. Next try it at walk - stand 6 steps, sit 6 steps. Your body should start to use core muscles and thigh muscles to hold you in balance much more. You can then do this at the trot. Try sitting trot 6 steps, rising trot 6 steps and standing 6 steps. This will start to get you in balance. If you can also start to think about rotating your hip joint a little inward towards the saddle that will help keep your thigh on down to the knee. It can take a while if you are not so flexible knee downwards but it will come. Keep your seat bones pointing straight down (see M Wanless!) as you are rolling back onto your pockets in some pix or pointing them backwards (fork seat) and hollowing your back in others but not using core strength to keep the pelvis upright in 'neutral'.

Find a trainer who can help you with this.

[Sarah_Sayers]

Practice, Practice and more Practice. Thats how i learnt and today after 5 lessons of constanty checking, they stayed in the right place today.

:eek: I have the same problems and do try to be consious of my position the whole time. After a year of lessons, it's better, but I'm still not happy with my toes! Slow learner I guess! :o

[Maggles4Lyf]

Read a Mary Wanless book!

where can i find one of these wonderful books?? ;)

[Em 1]

i am including some pics, but please no critique except for my toes, as my leg position is because of the saddle (which i cant change, and it is much much better in other saddles).

Thanks in advance guys, i have literally tried everything short of tying my feet to the girth to fix this!!!!


First of all, I know you said no critique but I just wanted to say what a nice position I think you have! You generally look well balanced and the horse always seems to be relaxed and attentive. I'm particularly jealous of your jumping position:D

To your toes - my feet used to turn out like that! My feet would always be at a 45 degree (or more) angle to the horse's sides. I discovered the problem was mainly in my hips not my feet/ankles. If the ball of your hip joint is set at an angle in the socket, it will be impossible for your toes to point forwards. I do various excercises that seem to help.

1) Stand next to a table/chair and hold on to it. Lift your leg out to the side. Circle your leg backwards until your foot reaches the floor again.

2) Stand on one leg. Bring the other leg up in front of you to form a right angle. Open the leg out to the side then straighten it until your foot is on the floor.

3) Loosening your knee and ankle can also help. Try standing on one leg. Bring the other leg up to form a right angle and then keep your knee still and circle your lower leg. Do the same with your ankle.

4) When you are on your horse try lifting your legs out to th e side and then drawing them back before letting them relax.

Obviously these exercises may not work - I don't do them if they hurt too much! I've got a friend who almost managed to dislocate her knee doing activity 3 so please be careful!

[Maggles4Lyf]

First of all, I know you said no critique but I just wanted to say what a nice position I think you have! You generally look well balanced and the horse always seems to be relaxed and attentive. I'm particularly jealous of your jumping position:D

thank you so much!! :D:D
that was something i actually needed to hear atm, was just told by someone else that i can't ride to save my life (which i know isnt true, it just hit hard;)), so this post came at just the right time!! :p

i will try those excercises, am just going to print off a copy of all the suggestions to stick in my room so i remember!! ;)

thanks so much guys! you have all helped so much! :o

[vivi]

You can buy Mary Wanless books direct from her site, Amazon or via any bookshop!

I think a 'bad' rider (not that you are) becomes a 'good' rider the moment they make a serious effort to improve and fix their faults. Nobody starts off great its all about being so interested in the process of how to ride well that you slowly learn and build your skills. One great horseman (forget who!) said you should read (about horsemanship) as much as you ride.

[chickyd444]

mine are worse than yours, ive been riding for yonks and nothing i do makes my toes stay in, in the end i gave up, when doing my dressage lessons i have to really consentrate, but they stick out like handle bars :(

[Maggles4Lyf]

yeah, i have been having lessons for nearly 7 years!! :eek:
but i think it only really started in 2006-ish :eek: that was a while ago!!
im pretty sure it was coz of my RI (who is no longer my RI) when i was riding a very lazy, un-goey horse, and she was telling me to kick, kick, kick, use your heel etc etc, so to push him on, i was being told to turn my feet out if that makes sense? coz by kicking with my heel i had to turn my toes out? and it is proving to be a very very hard habit to break :rolleyes::p
thanks heaps guys!!

[titch_]

How about one of them strap things?

[xox stace xox]

this sounds silly but at first instance i did this to stop my sis lower leg swinging back but it also worked and brought her toes in

try tieing bale twine roun the stirrup iron and the girth

[Maggles4Lyf]

try tieing bale twine roun the stirrup iron and the girth

yehh i have been wanting to try this, but coz i dont have a horse of my own i dont know if i would be allowed to at the RS because of insurance? :rolleyes:

lol it always takes lots of persuasion (and choccies for the RI!!) for me to do work without stirrups, let alone this!, but i will try!!! :D:D:D

[ANN H]

I have the same problem. My friend has special stirrups with a tread that's higher one end so that it keeps your foot in the correct position. The rubber tread is a sort of wedge shape. If I try to point my toe forward, I end up leaning more on the outside of my foot.

[graciemoo]

http://www.videojug.com/film/how-to-improve-your-classical-seat-in-horse-riding try watching this, as your toes pointing maybe from another problem that you are unaware of...

graciemoo (http://www.graciemoo.co.uk) x

[Maggles4Lyf]

I have the same problem. My friend has special stirrups with a tread that's higher one end so that it keeps your foot in the correct position. The rubber tread is a sort of wedge shape. If I try to point my toe forward, I end up leaning more on the outside of my foot.

where can i get them!? coz i try and put them forward and then i lean to the outside and end up with sore ankles? these treads sound awesome!

thanks heaps guys!

:o


ETA: just found out i cant ride then next time i was planning to :'( so looks like this will have to wait till i can get on a horse next! but hopefully i can go on a 3hr (that always runs overtime :D) soon, but i dunno how that will go for my toes, coz tis a high country trail ride, with lots of flat out canter/gallop :D
shall take camera and get PICCIES! for you guys!

[ANN H]

If you try googling 'wedge shaped stirrup treads'm or similar, I'm sure you'll find something. I found some on Equestrian and Country Leisure Ltd.

[curlycal]

Have you tried thinking "heels out" rather then "toes in" this works for me.

If you try it sitting in a chair pushing your heels out brings your toes inwards :)

[elaine@dow-evan]

I'm looking at a pic of me with my feet turned out in just the way you describe!

At the moment, I am having sessions on a simulator to help me with balance, position etc. I have a lesson on a "real" horse on Friday, so we'll see what difference the simulator sessions have made...but I have found that the 2 sessions I have had have put me in abetter position in the saddle, because the instructor has worked with me on opening my hips and lengthening my leg - and I can see the difference in the mirrors.

[Packhorse12]

I agree with Em1 it is a seat position which causes the riders toe out. The seat and the upper leg. The comments on the short length of stirrup also of course have a bearing on this. However, you cannot change the foot position without changing the upper part of the leg and the seat.

Get your riding instructor to look at your pelvis in the saddle because it is most probably just very slightly tucked under you or your thigh is not placed correctly.

[horsemad]

I agree with Em1 it is a seat position which causes the riders toe out. The seat and the upper leg. The comments on the short length of stirrup also of course have a bearing on this. However, you cannot change the foot position without changing the upper part of the leg and the seat.


I agree with this too - if you try to correct the problem just by turning your toes in, you will just end up stiffening your ankles. And I say this because I have exactly the same problem! In my case, its partly caused by my pelvis being out of alignment - which means my right toe always sticks out more than the left. Doesn't look very pretty, but there isn't much I can do about it, so I've just stopped worrying about it!

PS I agree about your nice balanced jumping position - looking good :-)

[Chels&&Cleo]

i had the same problem =]
try lengthening (sorry cant spell) your stirrups and lots of schooling, also try get someone with you to keep saying FEET! and put your feet back in the right position, it helped me :)