11-month-old colt with wobblers.Help please!

[latina]

Hi,
I am desperate to find advice on how to deal with a big holsteiner colt with wobblers.
We have bred this colt from our showjumper KWPN (with holsteiner lines) mare. She is a premium, predikaat sports mare from one of the best damlines in Holland, has 2 other very good children, successful in sport and there are no wobblers in her whole family. She is a big mare, 16.3hh, and the sire of this colt is a famous holsteiner stallion from Germany, Coronado (Corrado I), which was leased for a year to the National Haras in Spain. This horse is over 17hh.
We live in Spain and in this area there are no specialist horse vets!, well, not good ones.
The colt was very big already when he was born, grew quickly, and was weaned at 6 months old. We had people interested in buying him but we decided to wait until he was 1 years old. After weaning he hurt his hoof in the paddock so he was lame for quite a while...so it wasn't until about a month ago that we noticed that sometimes he looked clumsy. We had a lot of rain and the paddocks were just mud so we thought it might have been the difficulty of walking in deep mud. Now, a week ago we actually had him tested (no x-rays as there are no facilities near here), doing tight circles, pulling tail, backing up etc and he is definitely a "bit wobbly". he trots ok in the paddock and doesn't fall or anything like that but he seems a bit uncoordinated.
We have been very upset as he is such a well bred colt, very nice temperament, born at home and we have no good horse vets near us. As for operations, that would be out of the question. there isn't even a horse vet around here who can carry out a fairly simple operation on horses.!
So we have been trying to find out as much as possible on the internet. We contacted the dam's breeder in Holland, who is a friend of ours, and he has never had any wobblers, so he can't really offer any advice. We have read about restricted diet and controlled exercise and extra vitamin E.
If anyone in this forum has some information on this, like exactly how much of what sort of hard feed we should give, or how much vitamin E.. we would be really happy.
I am afraid if he doesn't improve we will have to have him put to sleep. He is going to be an enormous horse, highly strung although he has a nice temperament, and he would be dangerous if his condition deteriorates.
Any input will be greatly appreciated!!!:)

[Big Ears]

could he just be going through a period where he lacks coordination as he is growing and that he may grow out of it when he matures? Lots of big horses are very gangly and unsteady when young.

you must be devastated. in terms of vets, would you not find decent vets in France? is he insured - would the insurance cover the cost of getting a vet from France or Germany to spain? Or just as cheap to fly in a UK vet?

I know an excellent practice in sussex who could hop on a plane to you easily enough or it would cost you £400 or so to ship him to a UK vet hospital for assessment and treatment.

What a disappointment for you and the poor baby.

[varkie]

Try Ian Vandenburgh, from this link, as I know he has successfully rehabbed wobblers youngstock:

http://www.hartsopfarm.co.uk

[latina]

Many thanks for your quick replies. I will try that inmediately!! We want to do everything we can under the circumstances!! Living in an isolated area is wonderful when there are no problems with your horses.
We already had a bad experience three years ago when our beautiful Anglo Arab stallion died of a twisted gut colic after taking him to the local vet hospital where they had never performed an operation on a horse!! It was heartbreaking and the nearest vet hospital where they could have done it was 9 hours away by car! With the horse just lying down, writhing in agony we couldn't even load him in the trailer.
So you can see how desperate we are every time they get something a bit out of the ordinary!
Again, thanks!!! We appreciate all your answers!

[Kis Vihar]

Hi!

Like Big Ears mentioned - could it perhaps be that your colt is going through the 'uncoordinated gangly youngster' stage?

Our 2 year old warmblood caused us nightmares because we thought he was a wobbler, he would seem fine, then trot around the field all wonky and wobbly and sometimes fall over too!

After testing, a great vet, and lots of time waiting for him to 'grow out of it', he did just that - He just 'stopped being uncoordinated' and 'stopped falling over'.

I hope for you and your colt's sake it's something this 'simple' - if not, I hope you manage to find a good vet to help you! That was a huge concern moving out to Hungary - But I have a super equine vet so don't have the 'vet problems' that you do! What a real worry for you! Keep us informed on NR what happens with your colt - all the very best! Good Luck!

[julia gulia]

Diagnosis of Wobbler syndrome is not easy because several other causes of in-coordination exist in horses such as viruses, protozoa in the spinal cord, parasites, tumors or fractures.
Personally, I wouldn't be comfortable with a diagnosis of Wobbler syndrome based only on a physical examination . Who tested your horse?

[Pink's lady]

He sounds young to get wobblers - it's more common in 4yr olds. He's the right sex and type though......... It's not heritary however, although it is size related, so large, fast growing lines will be more prone.

Wobblers is progresssive and will eventually make him dangerous to ride and handle, IF it's wobblers. There is however the possibility it's just lack of coordiation due to his age and growing.

There is no rush to do anything about it. It will take quite a long time for his co-ordination to become bad enough to be dangerous. As he's only a baby he won't be being ridden for a good couple of years, so it's worth waiting and seeing. Riding a wobber is sheer madness but handling, when it's mild, is safe enough as long as your sensible and aware of his problem.

To confirm wobblers you need to get him xrays. And pracitse with a portable x-ray machine should be able to do it, so it would be worth investigating. Bigger farmanimal practises should have an x-ray machine.

If that's not possible then only time will tell. As there is no rush he can be given the benifit of the doubt and left to be a happy horse for the next year or so.

[latina]

Thanks for your answers and encouragement!. A vet did the examination but she did say it would be impossible to know if it is wobblers unless we have x-rays done and a myelogram. As you mentioned, there are a few things that could cause his clumsiness/funny hindlegs. He is already 1.54cm at the withers and he is only 11 months old, so I suppose he is a candidate for wobblers, but as you say he is at a gangly stage, his legs are very long. We will wait and see. In the meantime we are also going to try with vitamin E and we have heard that restricted diet and exercise might help. So if anyone knows exactly what a restricted diet means in this case (quantities and type) I would be very grateful!!!
Many thanks again!!

[Pink's lady]

A restricted diet is to stunt his growth, since wobblers is linked to too-fast growth and big rangey horses.

He will need plenty of fibre to keep him eating, but very little else. I would be having him on lots and lots of poor quality (but not dusty) hay and nothing else, and giving him just enough so he's lean. You really need to have him thin enough to stunt his growth, as mean as you will feel.

Exercise burns off calories that would otherwise go towards growth, as well as improving strength, balance and muscle tone. At his age you need to be really really careful with his joints, as well as him being mentally immature, so exercise will be difficult. I'd go with lots of inhand walking (or ponying from another horse) over different terrain. Good exercise and improves balance (going up and down hills, over bumpy grass etc) but easy on his joints. And great life experience too.

[Rips]

Thats unfortunate if he does have wobblers :( fingers crossed that its something less serious.

While we are on the subject of wobblers... what are the signs?

I just ask because there is a 5 year old horse at my yard and he is so clumsy it is just not right.
R was a very fugly colt, big long back legs that always made him look like he was standing under and long pasterns. He has grown into himself a little bit since then, he is 16h/16'1. He was broken slowly last last summer (he fell across lots of poles and rapped his shins quite a bit but was honest enough and it never seemed to phase him) hunted all last season.
About halfway through the season we were all at a flat out gallop across fairly flat ground, suddenly he trips and nosedives into the ground - he's that bad, the rider was in bits and hasn't ridden since. Terrible fall.

I had to misfortune to take him XC on wednesday... didn't get to do much, the 5th jump, a drop fence - he took a great big jump, landed nicely and then tripped, I when straight out over his head, just a tumble wasn't hurt at all. I got up again but I didn't really ride after that, not worth it.

When loading him into the box on the way home (its a converted lorry and the ramp is quite steep) he tripped and hit the ramp squarely with both knees, got to his feet and went the rest of the way up :confused: does this kind of behaviour sound like wobblers? He has problems on the road when hacking sometimes too - he 'peddles' with his back feet as if he's losing his balance (rarely, but I've seen him do it at least twice)

[Pink's lady]

Lack of coordiantion and 'inconsistant' movement.

Wobbles is when the vertebra in the neck (and it's always the same ones) deform as they are growing and pinch the spinal cord. Starts off mildly as the pressure is only slight but eventually progresses as the cord is more and more compressed. It's a disease of big rangy horses that grow too fast and too big. Most common in males, TB/TB types and for some reason it's been all chestnuts I've seen (maybe it's just co-incidence).

Symptoms are related to the pinching of the spinal cord. Lack of balance front and back, muscle weakness and inconsistant movement. Sensation is usually intact until the end. They have problems placing their feet correctly, often tripping over things or making odd movements. They lack spacial awareness of their limbs, leaving legs trailing or standing in funny positions. They show weakness and are easily unbalanced as they can't co-ordinate their muscle to catch them from falling. They are not weak as such, they just can't co-ordinate a response.

Rips - that sounds very like wobblers. Does he ever stand with his legs crossed or feet turned out oddly? A classic test is pulling his tail whilst he walks - a normal horse can resist it easily - a horse with Wobblers can be pulled over. Also pushing and pulling his head from side to side (quite agressively, swinging it a metre one way, then the other) whilst he walks in a straight line will exagerate his lack of co-ordiantion - he will start plaiting with his front feet. Also pushing his head up whilst he walks (so he can't see the ground) will make his stagger.

I would suggest his owner gets a vet out to see him. And most definintly don't jump him again until it's been investigated!

[Rips]

They show weakness and are easily unbalanced as they can't co-ordinate their muscle to catch them from falling. They are not weak as such, they just can't co-ordinate a response.

Thats the thing, when he falls, its always spectacular, its like he doesn't react, like if you tripped and didn't put your arms out infront of you... I must try those tests. Oh :p barely anyone rides him anyway, I sure as hell won't take him again!

He belongs to the yard but he was a cheap thing they bought in that never turned out. I've never heard of wobblers apart from on the net, don't think its well known?

[latina]

Well, thanks for all your answers. He does sound like wobblers but as he is young and growing I suppose he may have a chance he will be ok. In the meantime I will do the restricting diet, although he is not fat anyway. He is a big colt. I wonder if I can manage to just give him a cupful of hard fee a day when the others are all eating. I mean, I can manage, I will just feel awful. But I will try for a few months and I will add extra vitamin E as I have also heard this helps in some cases!
If anyone has heard of a success story with wobblers I would love to hear it!

[CopperQT]

Hi

I have a 15.1 TB mare that was diagnosed with wobblers at 4 1/2.

She was too old (to mature phsically) to try and correct this with feed and REDTRICTED exercise.
Do not exercise to burn of calories.

The only other option was surgery which doesn't have a high enough sucess rate for me to go for that option. Though i do believe that this has improved in the last couple of years.
Your youngster would probably be too young to opt for this option.

My mare had a foal and has been living very happily out of the last 3 years.

She was graded a 2 out of 4 in front and 2+ behind.

You really need a mylogram to know the true extent of it.

Good luck and please feel free to ask any questions!

[latina]

Hi again!
Thanks for your support. We have started to give him 6,000IU of Vitamin E, plus selenium, Bute, restricted feed and we are turning him out for a few hours in a small dirt paddock. At the moment it seems to be all we can do. He seems very happy, hasn't fallen and you only notice a bit of a funny walk from behind. He is now exactly 12 months old, measures 1.53cm, his mom being 1.70m and his dad 1.76m so, he still has some growing to do!
I just hope it won't get worse!

[Jenni]

i have a 4 year old holstein and when i took him to the vet hospital for a lameness assessment of a foreleg, when i brought him out the stable the vet looked a bit :eek: at his dragging of his hind feet and one back leg seemed to come inwards rather than straight.

He would drag his back feet if he had been standing for a while, but also when he was generally walking about. ridden however he was fine and picked them up.

So he asked me if he had ever fallen over etc and i said no. he did some tests that PL has mentioned included me walking him with his nose pushed up in the air.

He told me that a wobbler is usually INconsistently all over the place. Thankfully he said my horse was consistently lazy and he put it down to lack of muscle in the hind end.

The foreleg lamness was diagnosed as poor hoof balance, so he was trimmed and shod on the fronts. He has never dragged his hind feet since the day the he was shod correctly.

I can only assume he was in pain and uncomfortable so couldnt put even weight on the fronts so was taking it all on the back legs.

i would take a holistic view on it and seeing as how the colt had a lamness issue i would be extra cautious that it could in some way be related to that and maybe he is uncomfortable in some way, but not lame. give him time and let it develop. My lad is 16.3hh (and a little bit) so he probably grew quickly and its taken his muscles a while to catch up!

Best of luck with him.
(especially as he is a holstein!! im not biased at all :D)

[latina]

Hi! Glad to hear from other holsteiner owners! I think they are more likely to be clumsy and be affected by their rapid growth. he is all legs and big joints. You can see dad (Coronado) and his grandad (Corrado I) in this German page. You can probably find some of the stallions in your horse's pedigree here!!!
http://www.horse-gate.com/hengstvideos/list.php4
we will give him time and see how he progresses. He has already lost weight due to his restricted diet and I feel awful about it! He seems so hungry! But we'll carry on if there is a chance of an improvement.

What's your horse's pedigree?

[Jenni]

my horse is The Heartbreak Kid.

here is his pedigree. he is by con air
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/the+heartbreak+kid2

fingers crossed he will be okay.

[latina]

He is beautifully bred!!!! I like Contender and Cassini!
My colt is
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/cash+de+albion

I also hope he will be OK!! We had offers for him when he was weaned. Decided to wait... Well, just as well we didn't sell him then!

[charlie25]

Hi

My sisters horse has just been diagonised with wobbler syndrome. It came as such a shock, he'll be 3 next month. Don't know much about this condition so have been looking on the internet. Could a special diet help?

[CopperQT]

You can def try changing his diet but he may be too physically mature already for too much to change, but definitely worth trying.

What breed is he and how big?

[latina]

Hi,
The colt is Holsteiner. His sire is Coronado (Corrado I), a very big powerful horse, over 17 Hh, his mother is KWPN from Holstiner origins, also tall.
Maybe he is too old already for the diet to do anything....
He is so well bred and such a pity!