Trialling a Fhoenix - questions

[Portia]

Have a Fhoenix GP standard on trial atm.
I love it - feel comfortable and secure, it holds me in a 'correct' riding position (my toes point forward - even in canter - incredible!) and the mare moves much more freely through her shoulder. With me riding - she happily accepts working onto the bit, rounds up almost immediately without being asked (usually takes a lengthy 'discussion' and only daughter achieves it).

BUT! (there usually is..)
Having worries over saddle slipping to the side - a good 2 -3 inches at canter in the school, and numnah sliding back under the saddle. Yes, am using a Profesional choice neoprene dressage girth, yes, have a mattes 1/2 pad (wont tell you how much I've spent trying to get this to work for us). Mare HATES the girth, trying to bite even though I do up one hole at a time. Don't want to use a nonslip pad, that will irritate her skin.

What am I doing wrong? Is this just not meant to work for me/us? Any advice please?

Oh, and daughter HATES the saddle, she feels the opposite of what I do - so odd, given then I'm by far the less experienced rider and a good 30 yrs older !

[Bay Mare]

Hi :)

Did you buy this new or second hand? Was it fitted by an agent?

It's probably worth speaking to the agent in your area as they're experienced with stuff like this :)

The other thing to consider (and I hate saying this but am only saying it because it happened to me) is how you sit. Could it be that you ride twith your weight to one side? It still shouldn't slip that much but I know that they only time that my SBS slipped was when I didn't do the girth up properly and wasn't sat centrally in the saddle.

Do you have any piccies of it with and without a rider?

[MelanieD]

Have you tried it with just a thin cotton numnah? I found anything more than the thinnest numnah/saddlecloth under mine encouraged slipping.

Is it always slipping to the same side? Is it possible you or the horse are wonky in some way pushing it over to one side? Have you checked the panels are even? (I had one I never felt straight in, eventually realised the panel pockets were sown on unevenly so it couldn't sit straight)

[Portia]

Not bought, on trial until the end of the week. An agent came initially to assess mare and myself prior to arranging the trial.

BM, yes I am most definitely stronger on my right side - agent picked that up straight away, suggested the mattes 1/2 pad. Plus I do tend to 'polish' the saddle, shall we say, when riding - much easier to avoid this in the fhoenix as I can feel the mare move, but old habits die hard.

M, have tried several diff numnahs before I bought the matte - two high wither and one plain thin one.

Plus the saddle slipped both ways with daughter as well as myself on board - neither of us could pull the girth any tighter. I think the lateral slip is what worries me the most - the numnah moving back is most likely my poor riding style, but for everything to slip to the side despite a tightly cinched girth is another matter.

Mare isn't a huge barrel-shape, and weight tapes the same for the past 2 years so don't think its her. Summer coats' in (glossy and silky) but would that be the cause? I believe it's me tbh, going to talk to the agent tomorrow and see what I'm doing wrong.

Am very disappointed, this saddle is truly lovely, dont think I've every ridden in anything quite so comfy AND be able to feel the horses' movement AND know that she's comfortable too. Thanks all for your replies.

[ali cat]

i have a fhoenix

it slipped at the canter --with me on board

i fell off and fractured my spine!

i'm still trying hard to ensure it doesn't slip again --non slip pad-pro choice girth etc etc

BUT whether i'll ever get back my confidence in the saddle i really don't know yet

it's ok saying it might be the rider --it might just be the case that i'm crap -- even after 40 years riding BUT my treed (cheap synthetic) saddle never slipped

no advice here cos you have to do what you think is right for you

ps

my horse loves the saddle -- that's why i'm trying to make myself persevere with it

[Bay Mare]

I'm sorry that I've offended you by my comments, ali cat, but I didn't say that it WAS the rider just that it was something to consider as it can have an influence. If you read my post again you'll see that I do also say that the saddle shouldn't slip and that the best recourse would be to speak to the agent who knows the saddles a lot better than I do.

[ali cat]

bay mare---not offended at all!! please don't think that :)


i was just recounting what has happened to me

never even thought of what you'd posted--just telling my story

so dinna fash -- no offence taken
and certainly no criticism on my part aimed at you or your post

ali

[Yann]

I trialled a Suberpanel Fheonix and found it very comfortable but very unstable too, in fact the agent ended up falling off my horse in canter because of it. This was on a not overly wide horse with a decent wither. I'm aware of someone who sold their SBS because they lost confidence riding in it for similar reasons.

The whole purpose of a saddle is to assist in keeping the rider on a horse, not the other way round, they clearly don't suit every horse.

[MelanieD]

Slipping both ways IMO makes it unlikely that its a rider being wonky kind of issue. It might be that the rider isn't always sitting perfectly central and putting more weight into one stirrup than the other but a saddle should be able to cope with that unless its extreme.

I've gone back to using a treed saddle because any time I had to put more weight into one stirrup of my SBS when pony was doing some sharp turns and spins (generally not requested, baaaad pony!) and I had to put more weight into one stirrup the saddle slipped. Pony is now very happy in her well fitted treed saddle, apart from one proper attempt at throwing the toys out the pram when she realised that nasty human can stay on board better and argue with her now :D

I did find a wintec girth was the best thing for keeping my SBS or Fhoenix in place, the slipping with a plain neoprene girth was spectacular (not good when activity for the day was trying to stop pony running out from a jump and taking off across field practicing handstands), but it was still nowhere near as good as the lovely treed saddle i now have on the sphericalpony.

[Portia]

Thanks again all - am coming to the conclusion that the fault is with my riding style; am much stronger on the right (can barely put my leg on the left ), and that combined with the mare being softer and bending better on the left rein (no doubt as a consequence of me being uneven) is causing the predominantly right slip.

Not giving up yet though - saddle gives me that 'light bulb' moment, when you suddenly realise what you're supposed to feel (and do!), so it's worth persevering!

[Skippys Mum]

what about trying one of these thinline girths? I think someone on here sells them. I am considering one as I am awaiting delivery of my new freeform and I have major worries about slipping to the side (although to be fair, the freeform I had on trial didnt move but I have fallen off in the past with my treed saddle slipping and I am now paranoid).

I also put a bit of shelf liner under the saddle between the pad and the horse. It only costs a few quid from any hardware shop and its BRILLIANT. Not only does it help stop slipping, it helps to keep their backs dry as it seems to let the sweat air a bit. I had tried umpteen non slip pads prior to this and found they either didnt work or they moved slightly (down to me) when I was getting on and then gripped so hard I couldnt get straightened up.