Schooling trouble...its always a battle! Help Please!!!

[fluffy_betty]

I've been having the same problem with my mare's schooling since I bought her 9 months ago and I really needs some ideas.

She moves forward nicely, goes in a correct outline, bends left and right although she is much stiffer to the right, does basic lateral work etc. I'm 99% certain is a true outline, not just holding her head in, as you can see her muscles along her neck and back and belly working, and she always tracks up in trot and over tracks in walk, and her topline is developing albeit slowly. She can work long and low when asked or more 'up and together'.

I lunge her regularly and she is the same , I alternate between using a chambon or side reins, or 2 lines.

Now the problem -

No matter what I ask her to do, no matter how much schooling we do or what exercises we try, she always feels like a bomb waiting to go off. She has this constant desire to go up a gear, whatever pace we are in. Other horses will feel really light and responsive, like you could put the reins down and they would carry on in the same outline in the same rhythm. She always feels like shes about to explode. She accepts the contact when my hands are still - but fights downwards transitions and half halts.

The only time I have truely felt like we weren't fighting was one time out hacking, we galloped a good 1-2miles and when i finally started to pull up she rounded up and cantered along for a bit really nicely, neck arched, back working, before dropping back into a big springy trot without any resistance at all.

Its like no matter how much you work her, it will never be enough and I really need some advice.

She lives out 24/7 on moderate grass, no hard feed except a handful of chaff containing garlic and a joint supplement.

She is worked every day, either schooling, lungeing, hacking or jumping if I'm feeling brave! In theory she isn't fit as I don't work her hard, but that said she rarely breaks a sweat or gets out of breath regardless of what you do with her.

Her teeth and back have both been checked since i moved yards 10 days ago and were fine - her teeth are being rasped next month but the vet said they are not bad and it shouldn't affect riding her.

I ride her in a dutch gag and running martingale. I believe the bit may well be too strong for her as she fights it less when i put the reins up a ring, although then it literally takes me three or four laps of the school to pull up from a canter!

I am intending to start having lessons on her in the next few weeks which hopefully will shed some light on the source of the problem.

Shes come such a long way since I bought her, from bombing off in canter within 5 minutes of you getting on and refusing to stop unless you ran her into a fence, but although she doesn't physically pretend to be a racehorse any more, in her head her attitude doesn't seem to have changed.

She is a 16.2 TB, 11 years old. She was bred to event and is not an ex racehorse (well, apparently!). I am at a loss as to the source of the problem, if its down to my riding, her schooling, the bit, or whatever, I've been battling for 9 months and I just want some ideas.


Cookies for getting this far.... any suggestions (literally any!) will be greatly welcomed.

[inhs]

She accepts the contact when my hands are still - but fights downwards transitions and half halts.

ok, I'd work on two things: backup & soft feel.

soft feel:

Start with creating a soft halt.

As you stand still, pick up a light contact and just hold it.

Wait.

Your horse might do nothing, might pull against you, might up their head, etc to get out of it. Don’t increase the contract, don’t move your hands, again just hold it and wait for softness. When your horse gives his head a little, and you feel the strain gone from the reins, immediately loosen them a little as a reward.

Do this often enough and when you hop on, and pick up the reins, your horse will automatically soften his mouth. The idea is now your horse is balanced – he could just as easily take a step forwards or take a step backwards, whatever you choose to do. A lot of horses, when you sit up and take alight contact, they immediately push their weight forward, so you’re not at the 50/50 forwards / backwards balance, you’re about 80% forwards, 20% backwards, and so not balanced and not really ready for all manouvres.

Once the soft halt was establish, do this again from halt to backup. Once this is established, then it is time to start doing it in a walk. Looking for one step of softness first.

Walk around. Pick up a light contact. Hold it and wait. Your horse might pull against you, ignore you, etc. Just wait. When you get that moment of softness, relax the contact a little. Eg. On Saturday your horse might be up to doing this for three steps in a row in walk, and on Sunday it might have built up to five or more steps of softness together in walk.

Homework would be to continue this in walk, slowly in increasing the steps required with softness. When you’ve a solid walk, then the next step would be to go through all of this again in trot, etc.

backup:

as above, work on the backup with softness.

the idea of all of this is to get your horse to accept a light hand presure, and come into it, rather than doing the opposite, and pushing against it. start it at a halt & backup, and slowly work up.

hope that makes some sense :)

[twinkle11]

might be something as simple as the mouth piece on your bit!

my mare had a single jointed bit and was the same as you discribe. i couldnt work it out until i got a video on bits and ended up getting her a new bit which had a barrel in the middle it was a comfort snaffle (myler bit) but there are loads of bits out there with a link in it to stop the nutcraker action that alot of horse dont like, i just liked the barrel bit on the myler bit as it looked like it would be nicer and smoother in there mouth! good luck:)

[LindaAd]

[

soft feel:

Start with creating a soft halt.

As you stand still, pick up a light contact and just hold it.

Wait.

Your horse might do nothing, might pull against you, might up their head, etc to get out of it. Don’t increase the contract, don’t move your hands, again just hold it and wait for softness. When your horse gives his head a little, and you feel the strain gone from the reins, immediately loosen them a little as a reward.

<snip>

hope that makes some sense :)

This is interesting, inhs, and something I mean to try. But I'm a little puzzled by the bit about loosening the reins as a reward. When the horse gives, doesn't that loosen the reins anyway?

I hope I'm not hijacking your thread fluffy_betty:rolleyes:

[Sticky's GF]

When your mare does come back to halt/walk etc. - whatever downward transition, do you 'give' a little with your hands as a reward?

Reason I ask is, I had a lot of time in my teens riding and not having lessons and the mare I rode (arab x) would hack along on loose-ish rein, I'd pick up the rein when I wanted to go faster = her knowing this was a cue, and when I wanted to canter/gallop I'd give with my hands, lean forwards etc.

So when I got jez my current horse and started having lessons I realised how many bad habits I'd picked up and the mixed messages I was giving him, i.e. throwing the contact away when I was trying to get an upward transition! I now hold him through upward transitions and give a little when he respons to downward transitions as his reward. If I give him a loose rein he automatically goes into freewalk/free trot and doesn't pick up speed.

Not sure if this is 'correct' but this is what I have since been taught and hope is of some help. :) Might also be worth experimenting with a milder bit.

And having lessons def. help!!!

[wonkeywoody]

Ditto re soft halt and back up. Good advice.

You could also try some groundwork because she sounds as tho she is right brained and groundwork will help her think more about the 'puzzles' (become left brained) and therefore will relax/calm her down even when she wants to become 'stressy'

[fluffy_betty]

We had our first lesson today and started to work on the soft feel thingy.

My instructor pointed out that I am far too reliant on my hands. She said as the horse is fairly well schooled she should respond to my seat and I shouldn't be pulling to stop her. I knew it all along really but try resisting the urge to pull when your bombing round the school at 90mph! Anyway having someone on the ground made a massive difference and we even managed a trot to halt transition without using my reins at all!:D

With regard to the bit, we are going to put it up one hole at a time (bottom hole atm) until we can revert to a snaffle. We put it up one hole today and she definitely fights it a lot less.

The soft feel thing is really good so thanks for the suggestion! Think it will take a bit of practice to get rein back but we'll keep working on it.


Anyway, just wanted to say thanks to everyone for their suggestions!! They have all been really helpful and I couldn't believe the difference we made in 30 minutes, I know she will always be hot headed but she felt a lot lighter today and less fizzy. So thanks everyone!!!:D:D:D:D:D

[pineapple]

i know my horse is abit differnt to yours physically. she is a 13.2 welsh but she had the same problem. i couldnt stop her canterin. and when she jumped she was impossible to stop. when cantering out she would bomb past the big horses and keep running until she was exhausted.

i was riding on the last ring of a 3 ring gag. i decided to train her to go nicley. i read up about it and changed her bit to a straight snaffle. at first it was awful and i couldnt come out of walk with out loosing control, once we did 10 laps before i jumped off, i couldnt even turn! but after a few months she was voice trained and now i only need to use the reins out galoping. it has taken a few years but is possible!

good luck:)

[Dooley]

My instructor pointed out that I am far too reliant on my hands. She said as the horse is fairly well schooled she should respond to my seat and I shouldn't be pulling to stop her. I knew it all along really but try resisting the urge to pull when your bombing round the school at 90mph! Anyway having someone on the ground made a massive difference and we even managed a trot to halt transition without using my reins at all!:D



That was exactly what I was going to say. It sounded as if you were talking about me a while ago, before I had some lessons with a really good instructor ! I couldn't bring her horses back to me because I wasn't using seat/weight aids correctly. As soon as I learnt not to use my hands (i wasn't pulling a lot, but I shouldn't have been pulling at all!) everything was brilliant!

Well done you for finding this instructor. Hope things continue to improve.