Position!

[slh]

Well, had my first ever lesson today - very good! I've never been in an arena before but it all went well! Some points though - as I've only just come back to riding after so many years off - my stirrups are quite short at present (helps stop me losing them whilst trotting/ cantering) which means that I find it really uncomfortable to get my legs/heels in the correct position during walk (I never realised me heels had to be that far back! I felt like my calves/ feet were back by the horses tail or something!) In turn, this made me ride more on my bottom instead of on my seat bones which I know is wrong - will it get better when I am able to lengthen my stirrups a bit - or have i got some kind of position problem?? Generally I find it easier to ride without stirrups/ barebacked as I don't grip as much - why do I do it when I have stirrups??? Ahhhh so many question!!!!!!!

slh

[IrisSilverMoon]

Ride without stirrups, you'll learn better...;)

I think it's a lot harder to ride with your stirrups short than long, it puts your leg in a wierd position, it's not really a big deal if you lose them or don't ride witht hem at all, your still learning! :) Ask your instructor if it would be ok for you to ride without stirrups until you've learned a little more, you'll find it's a lot better to get the correct position and you don't have to concentrate on keeping your stirrups.

[Rakeli]

It could just be because it's you're first lesson, and you're not 'riding fit' yet. Congrats for coming back to riding:D , don't know how you managed all tose years off (i get panicked leaving him for a weekend! Mad!)
See how it goes, your second lesson should be better.

[slh]

Thanks for the replies/ encouragement!!!
I went out today on the horse I ride out for somebody on the weekends and I did quite a lot without stirrups, for some reason I feel more secure as I sit deeper and closer, even if he's playing up!! Another question - leg related, I know you are not supposed to grip, but are your knees supposed to touch the saddle or should they be 'open' (ie, not touching?!) so that the calves do most of the contact, not thighs?? (Probably sounds like a really stupid question to most of you!! and honestly I can ride - I was just never taught by an instructor so I don't know the 'correct' way!!!)

[nirikina]

Hi slh

Sorry I can't offer advice but I'd really like to hear other people's ideas as I have the same problem. Although I'm taking lessons now I learnt without instruction. At the moment I feel that stirrups are only there to aid in mounting. And what about knee blocks? If my knees were far enough forward to rest against the knee blocks then I'd most definitely be in the chair position.

IrisSilverMoon, I agree, my position is so much better without stirrups, but as soon as I take my stirrups back my weight shifts and my position isn't so good.

Niri

[Nhi]

Here are a few tips on how to find the right position in the saddle - best get someone to hold the horse when you do this. Take both feet from your stirrups and draw your legs (one at a time is easier) away from the saddle and back. Try not to tip forward. Do not expect this to be easy or comfortable!! As you gently return your leg to the saddle hold back the fleshy part of your thigh so that you feel 'closer' to the saddle (alas, more relevant for women that men). Next, hold both arms straight out in front of you and, one at a time, circle backwards. Once your elbow comes back to your side bring your lower arm forward as though you were holding the rein. You should now feel deeper in the saddle, your chest should be open and your shoulders straight and back. Find your stirrups but leave the riens and concentrate on how this position feels. Once you start riding it will probably all go to pieces but if you can remember what the correct position felt like it should be easier to get it back again. Maintaining it is the difficult part. Make sure that your hips are moving with the horse. If you can, close your eyes for a few strides and feel how much movement there is underneath you. If you were to 'sit still' in the saddle, as we are so often told to do, you would effectively block the horses natural movement. The trick is to allow your body to move with the horse, but without disturbing the overall construction of your position. The hinges (elbows, hips, knees etc) move to allow the rest to stay balanced and upright.

Great in theory - I'm still - after many years - trying to put it into practice!! :-)

Good luck

[Debby Riley]

i feel so scared without my stirups, why is it that other people ride so well and better without them, i lose my balance and feel so scared, is it so wrong to want to ride with stirrups all the time ??

[Wally]

It probalbly all comes down to the saddle design thing.

Most saddles have the bars too far forward, so when you have stirrups you struggle against the saddle. Take the stirrups away and you can settle into a relaxed natural position.

If you pull your fleshy bit of thigh away from the saddle it will make your lower leg stick out at silly angles. Try not to. Let you hips open and let the muscles and tendons of your legs lengthen and relax down. knee and toe pointing forward, heel down ( only slightly) and back. Without stirrups let your foot flop, point it down, you will find you are drawn deeper into the saddle.

Try to imagine you stirrups only supporting your foot and lower leg, not your body. The vast majority of your body weight should be carried on your backside, and big muscles of your thighs. if you are on a big horse your weight should even be spread as far as your calves clinging to the horse's sides. Not so on small horse riders, whose calves don't touvh the horse!

If you are taking your body weight through to your stirrups you will not be sitting on the horse and using your backside and weight to influence the horse.

If you are struggling against a badly desinged saddle, not badly made by any means, but made by a saddler not a ride,r of course you will be at a disadvantage.

[virtuallyhorses]

Originally posted by Nhi
...As you gently return your leg to the saddle hold back the fleshy part of your thigh so that you feel 'closer' to the saddle (alas, more relevant for women that men). ...

oooh dear, you haven't read Heather's book then ;)

However I fully agree with you on the years of practice and it being far easier to know the theory than to actually do it :)

[Debby Riley]

thanks for all the tips on riding without strirrups,
i tried again this weekend, i was riding a slimmer
horse and felt okay for a while, until .... it came to
trotting and turning, tried to remember to firstly
relax and not lean but it just spook me and i felt
myself clinging onto the pommel ( what a wimp eh ? )
steering went to pot too oops !! just had to cling on
but i tried not to panick but alas i did, didn't help that
the girl infront of me slid off the saddle oh so gentle
( she too came up to a corner ) but she was on a
shetland whilst i was riding a 16 h + horse my theory
it would not be such a gentle slide for me more of a
crash to the ground ungratefully which is what is
scary the pants of me !!!

When i was younger (much) I had a bad fall that put
an end to my riding days, until many years later i
decided to try and ride again, so here i am with this
fear so much in the for front of my mind, my instructor
is aware of my past and is very good in making me feel
more confident but i have heard you are not a good rider
until you have fallen off at least six times, please don't
tell me this is true, cause i will just have to remain a bad
rider if that is the case !!!

[Old but trying!]

I do admire your willpower. I too am struggling but quite determined to master at least basic riding. I am fine in the walk but the trot causes problems. I tense up and grip in the school and the poor horse just stops, not her fault I guess I am tellling her to stop. However when I hack the trot seems to be no problem. I think I just have a fear of corners or possibly any change of direction! I am hoping time and practise will help. Good Luck with your lessons.

[FreedomStar]

I understand that you might be scared. Once I got off really bad with one horse, which kept charging me and my friend when we were trying to get another horse out of the paddock. It scared the daylights out of me, and I'm still freaked out about that horse. I always take someone with me to get a hrose from that paddock. Since you're afraid of falling off, don't start right away without stirrups, but lower them so that they're longer, so that it's almost like riding without stirrups but you still have them. Also, maybe having a neck strap would help. You can hold onto it if you feel like you're unsteady. Don't grip with your knees, you'll just start bouncing around like crazy when you trot and it's more likely that you'll..n/m. And it's kinda true that you don't become a good rider until you've fallen off about 5-6 times. some people say ten, but it is not ten. I still have a long way to go as falling off. I've fallen off about 3 times in my whole riding career. But enough 'bout me.

Be patient with yourself, and don't rush into trying. If you don't get it one day, then don't worry and fuss, just take it slowly again the next day. Be patient. You'll get it soon enough.

[Debby Riley]

Oh where do i start "fear" is an alwful thing to try and win over, I have decided that fear is not going to stop me from enjoying a life long wish of riding horses. I am determined to over come this and i will bet the little old silly voice in my head telling me to be scared on something that might not happen !!

I try to think positive instead of being negative, I have something that knocks that voice smack bang in mid flow and i repeat this several times while i am trying to ride, it goes at follows....

" I can do this, i will do this and I WILL ENJOY THIS !!! "

It has helped me so much, i used to be scared of going in a stable with a horse and now i am confident to do that, one battle one !!! One to me, nil to voice :D

I am still working on the trotting without stirrups but today in my private lesson i won another battle today:D

I was terrified of cantering and every group lesson i would tense as soon as the class took their turn in canter, i always wanted to be last in row to avoid doing it, but i decided that this was silly !!

So i booked a private lesson and someone came in the lesson with me, and it was the best ride ever :D :D :D .

I never thought that the horse i ride could move so fast, he enjoyed it so much it was a shame to let my fear stop him from cantering like the wind !! so i had to just go with the flow and with my instructor yelling in my ear, go, go let him go, sit back, relax, sit back relax and BREATHE funny i always forget that last bit ha ha.

I now can sit here in the confidence that i did it, i rode the canter better than i ever did and i was still in the saddle on not on the ground, so now i am cautious and not terrified !!! of the canter anymore:D


WHOPEEE RIDE EM COW BOY !!!!!

[Old but trying!]

Wow Debby-- you really are determined aren't you. I really relate to the breathing bit, I often seem to forget too, particularly when tense. I think that at the time I am concentrating on staying onboard, sitting in the right place, doing the right things with hands and legs (and other bits as appropriate!) breathing comes at the end of a long line.

You have come a long way and I wish you success and lots of enjoyment. Well done.

[tarkia]

Make your stirrups longer,
Although you may think that having your stirrups really short is going to stop them coming off, it doesn't mean its comfortable.
The shorter your stirrups the more your likely to bounce around in the saddle in canter, you need to lenthen your stirrups so there comfortable, stand up in the stirrups to see if they feel right.

[Debby Riley]

I did check with my instructor about my stirrup length, she said they are correct for me, i am short with very short legs, my tail bone is still aching from that wonderful canter on sunday,i have ahd the odd ache and pain since fracturing my tail bone, so i am wondering if i should miss my lesson this weekend to give it a rest but then i think i would miss my weekly dose of horse:(

Plus if i miss a week i know i will ache all over, so no win:D

I will just have to go !!! Whoppee I can't wait to ride like the wind again !!

[Cathy Reynolds]

Debby
Don't always accept what your instructor says blindly. You may still be riding too short. You have the opposite problem to me (cue Sue Carnell chuckling at my endlessly long legs! which required specially-made leathers for comfort). Sue gave me a really good tip to sort my legs out which I do EVERY time I get on board. I get into the saddle, settle myself without feet in stirrups then streeetch my legs down as long as they will go. Then allow the muscles to relax back before sliding my feet into the stirrups. That makes the whole seat thing much more comfortable and balanced.

[Debby Riley]

thanks Cathy i will try that next lesson, one more question when you rise in the stirrups how far should your butt rise, is it a little or a huge gap, the reason i am asking, is because i always feel high if i stand in my stirrups, i am not talking about trot either i do this just after getting on to see if they are the right length. i feel that i could easy put a cushion in the gap is this too high ?

As if it is then they could be too short hence the bouncing alot and losing balance, although this is getting better now, but am i fighting against the wrong stirrup lenght?

[ravenin]

I'm not quite getting how standing in the stirrups is supposed to tell you if they're the right length or not.
To get my stirrups the right length I always take my feet out of the stirrups, letting my legs hang, and see where the bottom of the stirrup is. It should touch at the bottom of your ankle bone or just below it, you know, those knobby little bumps on the sides of your ankles (technical terms, eh?).
I also have very helpful ankles in that they ache and stiffen if things are even a bit too short.

Perhaps this method is only applicable in hunt seat, though, and not dressage?
IrisSilverMoon???
I'm only just becoming seriously interested in dressage (presently having just quit @ my H/J barn and about to start w/a Classical dressage-oriented instructor)...so I'm no expert there...

[virtuallyhorses]

Debby - ravenin's method is as correct as you will find - standing in your stirrups is not a good method for determining stirrup length. When 'standing' will have your legs straight - whereas in rising (posting) trot you still have bend at the knees.