Towing with a BMW Tourer

[poniesrule]

Has anybody ever towed with a BMW 525 Tourer automatic Diesal?

Just wondering, as my OH has one and we have talked about borrowing a trailer off a friend.

[DavidH]

I believe Ditz had one and used it regularly to tow.

[KevJ]

Hi - I tow a Williams 505 trailer with my BMW 525D Tourer manual without any problems at all, you can feel the extra weight but the car coped fine, including hill starts.

I bought the car last year specifically to tow the trailer, (I didn't really like the idea of a 4x4 and the 525 was voted caravan clubs towing car of the year).

We had something like 15 trips out last year, about 3 of them with 2 horses in the trailer, with 2 horses we were getting close to the cars towing max towing capacity but still had no problems.

[mikh]

http://www.uktow.com/towing%20capacity.asp#tab1

you may need to put make/model in - going by this I personally wouldnt :)

I certainly wouldn't be towing 2 horses with it, and to be 100& legal you would prob have to have the max laden weight of the trailer replated

[eventerbabe]

you are looking at a max tow weight of between 1600 and 2000kg dependant on spec of the car. Your problem will be the max laiden weight of the trailer. This MUST be equal to or less than the max tow weight of the car. so if you were to borrow an ifor 505 and tow it with your BMW you'd be towing illegally (whether it was empty or full) as the max laiden weight of the ifor 505 is 2650kg. your tow vehicles max tow weight is only 2000kg (dependant on model). You'd have to have the trailer down rated and this would limit how much you could load into the trailer.

[DITZ]

I did indeed use to have one but it was a 528 touring automatic (it was petrol though) and it towed like a dream. Not sure if its hugely different to a 525, wouldnt have thought so but worth checking. I towed a Rice double trailer (in fact I do believe I used to tow my old treble with it too) + big horse, say 500kg.


Would highly recommend it. I use a Ford Ranger pick up now and its a swine -very bouncy.

[DITZ]

Here you go, found this. (you need to click on BMW as the link doesnt come thru properly)

http://www.uktow.com/towing%20capacity.asp#tab1

Looks like you can just about tow 1 horse + trailer by the 85% guideline (it is only a guideline and not the law) and max allowance is 1800kg which should be plenty.

[mikh]

I did indeed use to have one but it was a 528 touring automatic (it was petrol though) and it towed like a dream. Not sure if its hugely different to a 525, wouldnt have thought so but worth checking. I towed a Rice double trailer (in fact I do believe I used to tow my old treble with it too) + big horse, say 500kg.


Would highly recommend it. I use a Ford Ranger pick up now and its a swine -very bouncy.

Hi Ditz - I would check the above website that I have posted, I would think if you were pulled over or had an accident your insurance would be invalid. According to that webside a 5 seriers touring or otherwise, would require any trailer to be replated and even then it would not be recommended to tow over 85% of weight

[DITZ]

I must be missing something, cant see any mention of the need to have the trailer plated. Which bit are you referring to?

[Iron Maiden]

Hi Ditz - I would check the above website that I have posted, I would think if you were pulled over or had an accident your insurance would be invalid. According to that webside a 5 seriers touring or otherwise, would require any trailer to be replated and even then it would not be recommended to tow over 85% of weight

You might be confusing the legal requirements for licensing & safe towing. I did a search last week (was bored) and couldn't find reference to any legislation that specifies that a towing vehicle must be able to tow the MAM of the trailer. The MAM seems to come in when you are working out whether you can legally tow on a post-'97 car license, in that case you have to add the MAM of the trailer to the weight of the towing vehicle, regardless of how heavy it actually is on the day. If anyone can find a legal requirement for a vehicle to be able to tow the MAM of the trailer I'd be very interested to hear about it, but I searched VOSA, DfT, DVLA & OPSI (the website that has all the current statutary instrumenst in full) and drew a total blank.

[DITZ]

whats a MAM?

[Iron Maiden]

It's the maximum gross weight of the trailer when fully loaded as per the manufacturer's guidelines. It's marked on the chassis. A lot of people seem to think they are OK towing a trailer on a post-97 car license if the total weight is <3.5 tonnes, but that's not the case. The MAM + the vehicle weight needs to be <3.5 tonnes. You can have a trailer replated with a lower MAM to get under the 3.5 tonne weight limit on the license if you are not going to load it to capacity. Hope that makes some sort of sense :confused:

ETA - it is confusing & I think this is why people think the MAM is relevant to the safe towing capacity of the vehicle, but as far as I can make out it isn't. Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong though, I have a wagon so I wouldn't be affected anyway!

[mikh]

I have always been told that if ou are stoped police will look at max capabilities of car and max laden weight of trailer - if the car doesn't match or exceed then you're technically towing illegally - regarding of what's actually in the trailer, or type of licence.

I agree it is very confusing

[eventerbabe]

BlueWicked did extensive research into this, and her findings (that the max laiden weight of the trailer must be no more than the max tow weight of the car) are posted in a sticky at the top of this section of the forum. should you wish to tow with a vehicle that's max tow weight is LESS than the max laiden weight of the trailer you have to downrate your trailer, which will mean it needs a new plate on it. i know very little of this procedure but believe some NR peeps have had it done to suit their tow vehicles and enable them to tow legally. they may be able to provide more info on this process :)

[DITZ]

Forgive me if I am misunderstanding this but are you saying that the max towing capacity of the trailer must not exceed the maximum towing capacity of the car? If so yes this makes sense but presumably would only apply if you had the maximum weight in the trailer to begin with, which in most cases is 2 horses? So if you only have 1 horse in then you are nowhere near the maximum capacity anyway?

[mikh]

Forgive me if I am misunderstanding this but are you saying that the max towing capacity of the trailer must not exceed the maximum towing capacity of the car? If so yes this makes sense but presumably would only apply if you had the maximum weight in the trailer to begin with, which in most cases is 2 horses? So if you only have 1 horse in then you are nowhere near the maximum capacity anyway?

No thats not the case you could be towing an empty trailer and yet the authorities would still go buy the max laden regardless of what was inside said trailer.

[Iron Maiden]

BlueWicked did extensive research into this, and her findings (that the max laiden weight of the trailer must be no more than the max tow weight of the car) are posted in a sticky at the top of this section of the forum. should you wish to tow with a vehicle that's max tow weight is LESS than the max laiden weight of the trailer you have to downrate your trailer, which will mean it needs a new plate on it. i know very little of this procedure but believe some NR peeps have had it done to suit their tow vehicles and enable them to tow legally. they may be able to provide more info on this process :)

I'm afraid that my own research disagrees with BlueWicked's, as I posted on that very thread. The leaflet that she links to does not mention MAM & safe towing, take a look, and she hasn't referenced anything else to back up what she has said. This is cut & pasted direct from the DfT website:

In the case of light trailers, that is less than 3500kg maximum laden weight, there is not any specified relationship in UK law between the weight of the towing vehicle and the weight of the trailer.

For M1 category vehicles (motor vehicles used for the carriage of passengers and comprising not more than eight seats in addition to the driver's seat) the maximum permissible trailer weight is quoted by the vehicle manufacturer. Alternatively, the vehicle manufacturer may provide a maximum gross train weight (the laden weight of the trailer plus the laden weight of the towing vehicle). If this is exceeded it is possible that the Courts or Insurance Companies may take the view that this constitutes a danger.

No mention of MAM there! It just says don't exceed the maximum permissible trailer weight, which is the max weight that the vehicle manufacturer says it can tow - NOT the same as the MAM, which is the maximum authorised mass of the trailer as shown on the plate. I'm happy to be set straight on this one but I want to see something official that states that the MAM must be within the maximum permissible trailer weight of the vehicle because so far I haven't found anything, and neither has BlueWicked as far as I can tell. Not knocking the research BW has done - it's all useful stuff - but there seems to me to be some confusion creeping in here with the licensing requirements, which are far more prescriptive, depend heavily on the MAM and are clearly laid down in law.

[mikh]

LOL Maybe we should all publish the exact laws of towing seen as no one actually knows!

[Iron Maiden]

LOL Maybe we should all publish the exact laws of towing seen as no one actually knows!

I don't think there are any, that's the point. If the vehicle manufacturer is only recommending a max permissible trailer weight it's very hard to write a law that makes that mandatory & enforceable in every case. Not like licensing where you have clear categories set by the Government & it's easy to write a law that applies equally to everyone.

[DITZ]

Call me Deborah Meaden, I'm out.:)

[Iron Maiden]

Call me Deborah Meaden, I'm out.:)

:D Spoil sport!

[DITZ]

Can't we talk about religion instead?

Or politics?

Better still, hunting?:D

[DITZ]

BTW (and hijacking) are you doing the Grove HT at Osberton in a couple of weeks?

[eventerbabe]

this is a well worn debate, as is reflected in the hundreds of posts on the subject. i think, when it comes to transporting your horses, you should make sure they are safe and that you are towing legally. No rosette or day out is worth risking a horses life for. people do do it, i'm always aghast when i see VW golfs and ford galaxies towing heavily laiden trailers. to the OP, it may well be worth contacting your local police or the DVLA for further clarification on the information on here :)

[Iron Maiden]

BTW (and hijacking) are you doing the Grove HT at Osberton in a couple of weeks?

Flynn's mum had mentioned it - when is it? I'm doing an EMDG xc clinic there with Mrs P on the 24th, I think we might be better off practising before we compete xc this spring because we haven't been near a xc jump together for months. Taking Flynn to do the BE 90 (pka Intro) at Draycott on 27 March ;) Can't wait!

[DITZ]

29th I think. It's on the pony club website.

[Iron Maiden]

Just had a peek, that would fit very well as we'll have been for a practise there the Tuesday before ;) Probably not over the same jumps because they have thousands of them all over the estate but at least we'll have got our eye in over some xc fences :) Are you going? What class will you do?

[poniesrule]

No rosette or day out is worth risking a horses life for. people do do it, i'm always aghast when i see VW golfs and ford galaxies towing heavily laiden trailers. to the OP, it may well be worth contacting your local police or the DVLA for further clarification on the information on here :)

Thanks for your input and other posters who have replied.

I would really think twice before using our tourer to tow, as i do not want to put my horses in danger. I will read further into the legal towing weights, but tis not the end of the world if i cant get out and about!

[DITZ]

Just had a peek, that would fit very well as we'll have been for a practise there the Tuesday before ;) Probably not over the same jumps because they have thousands of them all over the estate but at least we'll have got our eye in over some xc fences :) Are you going? What class will you do?

I'm going to have to wait until nearer the time to decide as Toby pencilled in for his heart surgery a few days later so will want to spend as much time as poss with him just in case - however hospitals are notorious for cancelling so who knows. Am thinking I'd probably only do the baby class anyway as it will be our first run and he's never been to Osberton either. As I recall there are very few small jumps so I imagine you would do alot of them again.