Need help with coloureds genetics

[Soot]

Ok, the owner of the coloured stallion who is sire to two foals on my yard simply does not understand the concept of genetics ...

I need to get some kind of diagram to show him WHY two coloureds can produce a solid foal - I tried explaining with differently coloured buckets as alleles but he didn't really get it :( ...

Anyone got a REALLY basic diagram or something that might help him understand?

[Palomino Mare]

my upload failed *sniffs* it was a poor diagram anyway and i'm not even sure its right LOL

[xloopylozzax]

did you use mitosis (or is it meiosis :confused:) so when the haploids are made they have either coloured or not coloured written on them.

to make a coloured you need just one copy i think, which is why a homozygous coloured will always produce a coloured foal (it always puts forward a copy).
if they arent homozygous, then they both still have the option of not coloured, so the not coloured could be passed on.

(but could be hidden and reappear in future generations :S)

[Palomino Mare]

I tried again

is this right? (excuse my artistic skills!)
http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w28/amydalgleish87/colour.jpg


what i was going for here is foaly has 2 copies of tobino and 2 of bay but the tobino hasnt been passed on here so is not showing.

i'm not sure if its right though as i don't have a full grasp on it myself!

[Soot]

Just ti make it clear ... the reason I want a picture (and I will draw one with circles if I have to, but would rather have something that looks better) is because this guy believe that if a mare has had a solid foal then she's spoiled for life and won't ever have a coloured again. I'm not joking.

[greasedweasel]

(but could be hidden and reappear in future generations :S)

Nope its dominant, so will show if its there. :D

Soot - would LOVE to have seen you with the buckets... I have tried the explanation with some of the older gypsy lads and eventually I end up tearing my hair out and they say " No lass, what will be, will be" :D

[Soot]

I'm glad someone understands! :p
Basically anything that looks like it might have come from me won't be accepted. If it looks official ... maybe!!

... Of course, everyone know if you mate them under a full moon then it will be a coloured filly *facepalm* ...

[xloopylozzax]

is that not true?



:p

[horsy]

Just ti make it clear ... the reason I want a picture (and I will draw one with circles if I have to, but would rather have something that looks better) is because this guy believe that if a mare has had a solid foal then she's spoiled for life and won't ever have a coloured again. I'm not joking.

Ha! I also know a coloured breeder who thought exactly the same thing.

[Thestral]

It's exactly the same principle as human eye colour genetics.

http://www.abpischools.org.uk/res/coResourceImport/modules/genome/en-images/eyecolour2.gif

In this case pretend B = tobino and b = bay

With two heterozygous parents (Bb) you get 25% chance of a homozygous foal (BB), 50% chance of a heterozygous foal (Bb) (so in real terms 75% of foals will be coloured) and 25% chance of bay (bb)

The exception is if one or both of the parents is homozygous then with a BB x Bb you will get 50% BB and 50% Bb (all will be coloured)

OR BB x BB gives 100% BB foals, so all will be coloured.

[Soot]

Ultra simplified, using the owner's own horses as examples ...
is this correct (or correct enough that it might convince someone)?

http://yard.spak.org/zp-core/i.php?a=missy&i=Coloureds.jpg&s=640

[4_white_socks]

Correct, I believe, except "Santa" should be tob/tob.

[Soot]

Correct, I believe, except "Santa" should be tob/tob.

But if Santa were tob/tob then his foals would all be coloured??

Or have I misunderstood something?

[4_white_socks]

Sorry, I mis-read it. :o
I thought that Santa, Hope and Malibu were all possible results, with Santa being the tob/tob example and Hope/Malibu being the tob/solid examples, but I get it now.
Then yes, correct. Sorry for the confusion.

Silly-socks! :o

[Sexy Sietske]

Have you tried explaining that tobiano MODIFIES the base coat colour. If you explain that all horses are either black or red (chestnut) then its a series of modifying genes that will give you bay, coloured, palomino ect.

Then explain that everything inherits mum and dad charactistics, and only copy of the different 2 each parent is passed on to the foal... so the stallion has 50:50 chance of passing on the coloured gene.

A punnet square might be helpful ;)

[Soot]

Have you tried explaining that tobiano MODIFIES the base coat colour. If you explain that all horses are either black or red (chestnut) then its a series of modifying genes that will give you bay, coloured, palomino ect.


HAHAHAHAHAHA
He wouldn't believe me, bless him :p

... I have passed on my diagram. We'll see what he thinks!
Thought I wonder what he'll do with the stallion when he understands it's not the mares' fault!

[Sexy Sietske]

The old fashioned kind I assume?

My YO hubby is a bit like that, they have a bay welsh D broodmare 'she'll throw coloured no matter what stallion you but 'er to!' :rolleyes: It's not worth explaining to some people... he couldn't grasp that nelson was born coloured and now isnt, but their hearts are in the right place :D