i'm 15 and i need help :D

[blonde]

i need to persuade my dad that the house i have seen is worth a good investment for the future:D

okay well this house is rather cheap for what it ahs to offer
20 loose boxes, 30 acres, internatinal size outdoor dressage arena, large indoor school with viewing gallery and a judges box, extensive cross country cource, planning permition to run a livery yard and to hold competitions and training. client facilites (dont know what they mean) horse walker, and post and rail paddocks
a detached 3 bedroomed house, and a detached one bedroom anexe (gooms acomidation) 2 lecture rooms, caffeteria, office,

my dad has told me to go away and think of a way that will make him enough money to warrent paying to buy it, (its more expensive than we hoped to buy for)
so i am going to have to come up with a sort of business plann at the age of 15 to show that a livery yard and a competiton yard is a great place to buy :D
if anyone want to give me tips of how to do it i will be more than gratefull, i love his place and my dad has not said no to looking at it. it has everything my mum and dad want in a house (house with land and some stables) and much more and everything that i want in a house (stables sandschool with good local conections)

its a big dream buy hey you never know. most likley it will sell but hey i can always hope.

[Howengold]

Can I have your dad if he agrees? My dad would just laugh at me and I am 36!

oh yeah well done on your GCSE's!

[blonde]

Can I have your dad if he agrees? My dad would just laugh at me and I am 36!

lol thing is we want to move it is just about 100k to much but it could be a good business venture as well so in my terms it is worth spending the extra money :D (has nothing to do with the fact that i want to be a riding instructor when i am older or a horse dearler and this would be the perfect place :p)

thanks i did better than expected as i did not even know i sat one exam and i got a b in it as well, gonna have to resit maths though as was only 2 marks of a b :(

[mikh]

hi hun is this ingledon???

[ragtime]

sounds like a good plan!
im 15 and a longg way from getting my mum and dad to get a house with stables haha!:p

[blonde]

hi hun is this ingledon???

might be do you know anything about it.
like where it is :D

[annareeves0]

There is loads of stuff on line giving help with business planning - one of the better one's is the Prince's Trust. Check out http://www.princes-trust.org.uk/need_help/the_business_programme/help_with_your_business_plan.aspx
Even if it never happens, it will be a great exercise, and if it does all pan out, you'll be set up for your dream job/home/future :D
Fingers and toes crossed for you!

[blonde]

sounds like a good plan!
im 15 and a longg way from getting my mum and dad to get a house with stables haha!:p

well i gues i have a plus of that we are looking to move anyway :D
you never knwo your parents might just say oh i wish we had a house with some land, thats what mine did :D (might have taken a few hints of oh seen i house i like, and i wish i kept the horse at home :p)

[blonde]

okay well i though i would start with the area that will make some money the livery yard

do you think considering the facilites that there is that
DIY £30 per week
and full livery £70-£80 while i am still at school only can allow 5 full liverys at a time
do you think those prices are cheap, resonable of expensive :D


even if i dont end up convincing my parents and their bank manager at least it is good practice, and i am sure my maths teacher will be amazed if he found out i was doing math voluntaraly out side of school for at the moment a big dream of mine

[eml]

Not to put a dampener on your dreams but it is very difficult to make enough money in any horse venture to justify purchase price.

At the most basic you need to find out the extra cost of just having the facilities such as Non Domestic Rates (possibly about £20,000 at a guess)and maintenance costs of land buildings and schools ( maybe about £15,000), add in a reasonable 'return on capital' for the extra money your Dad spends, say for example 5% of £100,000 ie £5000 and you have to make a profit of £40,000 each year, that is £2000 or £40 per week per box.


At the very simplest you could set up a DIY yard but by the time you paid insurance, electricity, water etc you would be having to charge something like £45 per week without any hay or bedding provided. It would have to be a very special yard.

[blonde]

Not to put a dampener on your dreams but it is very difficult to make enough money in any horse venture to justify purchase price.

At the most basic you need to find out the extra cost of just having the facilities such as Non Domestic Rates (possibly about £20,000 at a guess)and maintenance costs of land buildings and schools ( maybe about £15,000), add in a reasonable 'return on capital' for the extra money your Dad spends, say for example 5% of £100,000 ie £5000 and you have to make a profit of £40,000 each year, that is £2000 or £40 per week per box.


At the very simplest you could set up a DIY yard but by the time you paid insurance, electricity, water etc you would be having to charge something like £45 per week without any hay or bedding provided. It would have to be a very special yard.
there is already permission granted to the centre for it to havea livery yard if that what you mean

[carthorse]

The DIY rate would seem a reasonable figure to work from (but I don't know prices in your area).

I'd say that there's maybe not enough difference between your DIY & full. What, exactly, are you offering? Think of how much hay & feed a horse will eat in a week (some horses really do need a lot of hay & feed), add on your bedding, then take account of your time to do everything (rugs, turning out, bringing in, mucking out, holding for farrier etc, grooming?, riding?, tack cleaning? etc etc). Working on a rough estimate here to keep the figures simple, but say:
3 bales of hay @ £3 each
3 bales of straw @ £2 each
1/2 sack basic mix, say £3
1/2 sack chaff, say £2
Add to your DIY rate & that comes out at £50 per week with no allowance for your time. And some horses will eat a lot more than that, in bad weather my ID can eat nearly a bale of hay in 24 hours so add on another £9!

Bear in mind a lot of full liveries like to do DIY in the summer to save themselves some money.

I think eml is right when she says it's hard to make any money because overheads are so high. There's a saying "to make a small fortune in horses you need to start with a large one" & sadly it tends to be true.

[CurlyWurlyRach]

I feel really mean saying this and i dont intend it in a nasty way at all but i wouldnt put my horse on full livery with a 15 year old in charge. Sorry :o

[northern_rachel]

I agree with EML.
There's a hell of a lot more to think about than simply setting up and charging people what you think is right.
You have to think about profiting, Dometics ect.
It isn't simple as a childhood dream I'm afraid!
Though if it does happen...can I live with you pleeeeeeeeeease :D

[Raspberry]

I feel really mean saying this and i dont intend it in a nasty way at all but i wouldnt put my horse on full livery with a 15 year old in charge. Sorry :o

I have to admit I was thinking the same thing :o

[CurlyWurlyRach]

I have to admit I was thinking the same thing :o

phew! glad im not alone. I felt like a right cow typing that but i honestly would walk away no matter how nice the yard is.

[blonde]

I feel really mean saying this and i dont intend it in a nasty way at all but i wouldnt put my horse on full livery with a 15 year old in charge. Sorry :o

no i wont be in charge but i will be the one that does the turning out mailey my parents will be in charge ut as i will be having my horses onn the yard i will be doing a fair amount.
my dad said to show that i was comitted that i had to come up with a plan,

there would be no hope of me being in charge because at 15 people will not respect me enough, however i would be the peroson round the yard probaly most because of connor and hopefully i will have anouther horse so i will be occupied with that. we would probaly have to hire someone in to take charge of the place for a few years so will take that into account but most of the time one of my parents will be at home or around the yard as my mum wants to start working from home and it has its own office to do that with

my dad said if i come up with the basic figures of how much it would make on livery a year he would sort of the coucil and electrics and we will put that in and see if it is at all a good idea, it might only be a big hope but there is always a chance.

[NoviceNic]

At 16yo I doubt very much you have any idea at the cost or commitment to a large mortgage let alone a business...:confused:

[northern_rachel]

At 16yo I doubt very much you have any idea at the cost or commitment to a large mortgage let alone a business...:confused:

Ditto
Maybe it would be wise taking some sort of business course so you know what you're letting yourself into.
Plus, have you tried running a livery yard on yourself? It's a hell of a lot of hard work! I worked at a yard with 16+ horses and had to have them hayed/watered/out before 9am. I started at 8 and worked on my own.
I wouldn't dedicate my life to it either. I'd be looking at your education/future/job career...

[Rocador]

Aww - but don't knock her dreams! Yes, its a big step and I'm sure her folks won't let themselves get into anything they can't afford or justify. But go for it, Blonde.

Do a thorough job with the business plan - try to make sensible estimates of all the costs, and include the cost of your and your parents' time. Even if it doesn't come off it will be a great exercise and good practise for the future, and who knows - while it might not be a money-spinner in the short term it may just make enough to cover the extra purchase costs and if your folks see you're really trying hard they might just be willing to do it for you. Best of luck!

[vimto92]

It isn't just the initial cost though, blonde. It is maintaining the house, paying taxes (which I do believe are higher if you own a big house), and then mortgage repayments.

All the best though, whatever happens

[~*sugarlump*~]

I see two options
1) Rob a bank
2) Win the lottery

I dread to think how much it would cost!!

[blonde]

I see two options
1) Rob a bank
2) Win the lottery

I dread to think how much it would cost!!

if you mean the initall cost of the house it is not much at all for what it is
i have seen house's with no sand school four bedroom house 10 ares one stable that is litually falling down. and that was more exppensive, was amazed when i saw it.

[Mary Poppins]

I think that you should come up with as detailed business plan as you can and present it to your dad. Whilst it is always going to be his decision and I am sure that he isn't going to make solid decisions based on your projections, at 15 you are soon going to be leaving school and if you are going to have a future in any kind of business this is a good place to start. You never know, he might be impressed and go with it....

You need to calcaulate ALL you ingoings and outgoings.

Examples of outgoings will be: mortgate repayments, council tax, gas/electricity bills, maintence of the house (you say that it is cheap - does it therefore need work? Does it have central heating, carpets, double glazing etc.). You then need to include business rates for the stables (EML detailed theses), and maintence of the schools, padocks, stables, car park, lighting. If your livery yard is going to provide hay or straw you will have to purchase this first. Don't forget electricity costs and water rates here. Also if you need staff their wages will need to be paid. Don't forget insurance and training that yourself or your staff may need.

Then you calculate or incomings. This will include the livery fees you charge. If you plan to offer DIY, part or full livery then detail the costs. Could you grow hay on your land? How much could you make from this? Could you provide a 'show centre' with weekly showjumping or dressage comps? Could you hire out the arenas to external people? Would you local pony club be interested in hiring your land? Do some research on how you could make money from this. It isn't only livery that generates money on a yard. Could you rent out some land to a local farmer for cattle etc. Is there any opportunity to develop some kind of 'conference centre meeting facilities' for local businesses to use? Could you have a resturant on site?

When you have your list of incomings and outgoings, hopefully the incomings will be higher meaning that you can make a profit. Good luck. Why not post it on here when it's done?

[blonde]

I think that you should come up with as detailed business plan as you can and present it to your dad. Whilst it is always going to be his decision and I am sure that he isn't going to make solid decisions based on your projections, at 15 you are soon going to be leaving school and if you are going to have a future in any kind of business this is a good place to start. You never know, he might be impressed and go with it....

You need to calcaulate ALL you ingoings and outgoings.

Examples of outgoings will be: mortgate repayments, council tax, gas/electricity bills, maintence of the house (you say that it is cheap - does it therefore need work? Does it have central heating, carpets, double glazing etc.). You then need to include business rates for the stables (EML detailed theses), and maintence of the schools, padocks, stables, car park, lighting. If your livery yard is going to provide hay or straw you will have to purchase this first. Don't forget electricity costs and water rates here. Also if you need staff their wages will need to be paid. Don't forget insurance and training that yourself or your staff may need.

Then you calculate or incomings. This will include the livery fees you charge. If you plan to offer DIY, part or full livery then detail the costs. Could you grow hay on your land? How much could you make from this? Could you provide a 'show centre' with weekly showjumping or dressage comps? Could you hire out the arenas to external people? Would you local pony club be interested in hiring your land? Do some research on how you could make money from this. It isn't only livery that generates money on a yard. Could you rent out some land to a local farmer for cattle etc. Is there any opportunity to develop some kind of 'conference centre meeting facilities' for local businesses to use? Could you have a resturant on site?

When you have your list of incomings and outgoings, hopefully the incomings will be higher meaning that you can make a profit. Good luck. Why not post it on here when it's done?

thanks so much for the advise
its cheap because it was repossed i think, and went bust thats the story i have heard so far from my YO who was the one that suggested it to us he was looking at it but decided he did not like horses enough to buy that he said he is fed up with 6 stables let alone 20 :D its more his wife that enjoys horses.
my dad said he would help me calculate all the morgage repayments electrics and water becuase i dont know anything about that kind of thing but for all the horsey things like, maitanece of the school and so on it needs to be down to me looking at it,
however i really need to look at the place in person to get more of a idea IMO to see how much if any work needs to be done to the stabel block and school arena atm

annareeves0 : thanks for the website was looking at it earlier and last night and its really usefull :p

[huskyfinn]

you say your dad wants you to work out the costs of running a livery yard and he will sort everything else out?

if that's the case then you need to figure out what you are going to offer, diy/assisted/full livery does it include hay and bedding and even hard feed?
will you be allowing all year turn out, are they stabled at night all year or just winter?
would they have free use to the facilities? box parking?

once you have figured that side of things out you can then do a better plan of how much you could reasonably ask per stable per week.

you could hold shows at the yard (subject to permission) even dog shows. maybe you could do training days and things like that. again that is something you could take into account.
another thing you could do is go and speak to a yard that does offer that sort of thing and ask them what they did to get started and if they would give you an idea of costs.

[HJ]

If you need to persuade your dad that it will be worth his time/money and effort, trying to buy a "repossessed" house probably isn't the way to do it!

Why did they have it repossessed in the first place?

Also, at 15 (and no I'm not criticising you), would you really know what to look for with regards to what works needed doing?

You also say that you parents will be in charge most of the time? I suspect they mist have rather good jobs to be able to get a mortgage on such a place? How will they find the time whilst your at school?

One more thing, at 15 its a big commitment, are you sure you want to mucking out other peoples horses before and after school? What about your homework and GCSE's, you will never have time for your own horse unless your on the till 11pm every night

[stroppy-mare]

HJ, OP has already sat her GCSE's :o

[HJ]

HJ, OP has already sat her GCSE's :o

Oh ok, urmmmmm therefore my post is utter rubbish :p


Good Luck Blonde, although I do agree with others, I certainly wouldn't want a 15 yr old looking after my horse everyday and like I said, how will your parents be there all the time? Surely they work??

[blonde]

Oh ok, urmmmmm therefore my post is utter rubbish :p


Good Luck Blonde, although I do agree with others, I certainly wouldn't want a 15 yr old looking after my horse everyday and like I said, how will your parents be there all the time? Surely they work??

yes my parents both work we own our own business and have done for the last 18 years,
before that business my dad had anouther one of his business's (estate agent)
because this house already has a office my mum will work from home so she will be there to run the yard as well,
we will employ a groom as well untill i leave school after A levals

[HJ]

Ok, so lets come up with what you actually asked for

How many boxes do you have? and how many will you be using?

[dornrose]

ok so putting aside any objections as to your age and just answering your questions. You need to do a business plan. So you need to work out approx how much a similar livery yard charges for a diy livery, part livery, full livery and possibly assisted livery. Then work out the costings behind each of those, diy - you only provide the box/stable, will you charge extra for lights in the school for part and full livery - the costs are diy + the cost of bedding usually 1 bale of shavings per week + the cost of feed/hay - so you need to ring feed merchants and find out the price of basic mix and chaff and find out how much a bale of hay is. Some yards charge more or less depending on the size of horse/pony. Once you've worked that out you then need to work out how many horses you're going to have to have on part/full livery and work out the time it's going to take to muck out turn out etc you've then got to work out how many hours you'll be employing a groom for and will need to work out the wages, again not sure of going rate in your area. Also if you're going to offer assisted diy you need to price out the extras. Dont forget things like -tack cleaning, horse walker (if there is one) turn out, bring in.

Good luck with it all.

[blonde]

Ok, so lets come up with what you actually asked for

How many boxes do you have? and how many will you be using?
thanks there are 20-22 loose bozed and we will be using 15 of those some for livery
some for me to put myt horse (s) in and some for a emercency, you never know what will happen with horses

ok so putting aside any objections as to your age and just answering your questions. You need to do a business plan. So you need to work out approx how much a similar livery yard charges for a diy livery, part livery, full livery and possibly assisted livery. Then work out the costings behind each of those, diy - you only provide the box/stable, will you charge extra for lights in the school for part and full livery - the costs are diy + the cost of bedding usually 1 bale of shavings per week + the cost of feed/hay - so you need to ring feed merchants and find out the price of basic mix and chaff and find out how much a bale of hay is. Some yards charge more or less depending on the size of horse/pony. Once you've worked that out you then need to work out how many horses you're going to have to have on part/full livery and work out the time it's going to take to muck out turn out etc you've then got to work out how many hours you'll be employing a groom for and will need to work out the wages, again not sure of going rate in your area. Also if you're going to offer assisted diy you need to price out the extras. Dont forget things like -tack cleaning, horse walker (if there is one) turn out, bring in.

Good luck with it all.

okay we will offer tack cleaning as a service dont know how much the going rate is for that thoug because never had my tack fcleaned for me by someone else :D
there is already a horse walker there
for DIY you will have to pay extra for the horse walker slightly extra for lights in the school if you use them alot and extra for the xc cource depending on how much you use it,

we wont provide hay for the DIY they will have to get it them selves but we will provide it for the full liverys and it will be of no extra cost as hay, feed farrier and basic vet bill (checkups and vaccinations) will be paid for by us

[Helen000]

Tack cleaning at my yard is a fiver per set of tack (not that I've ever used it - I feel too guilty).

The paying for basic vet and farrier for full livery sounds very generous - I wish my yard did that!

helen
x

[huskyfinn]

if you are doing farrier and vets then you have to add that to the cost of the livery and make it clear what it is you will or will not pay for. a farrier every 6 weeks is about £60 for a full set. however some people want their horses shod sooner or even later. and also some people may not want to pay the rate of having shoes done if they only have their horses trimmed or are bare foot.
the vets visits might be a bit tricky too (and added complications), vets charge for each call out so if you are charging people for that call out then have 2 or 3 horses seen it wouldn't be fair. also some people may choose to use their own vets so you could end up with sorting out finances for 3/4/or 5 different vets and also have to remember to book the right vets for the right horses.

[Soot]

Why not check out other local livery yards to see what they offer & at what cost ...

At a glance , here are some within about an hour of Battle

YARD 1

Part Livery Service - £450 pcm
Incudes: Mucking out every day, turn out every day, hard feed, hay and bedding supplied plus basic grooming.

Full Livery Service - £520 pcm
Includes: Mucking out every day, turn out every day, 10 exercises pcm, all hay, bedding and feed supplied plus full grooming.

Schooling livery - £620 PCM
Same as full livery with exercise 6 days a week. Suitable for those who can't ride in the week but want their horse ready to compete at the weekends.

No DIY

YARD 2

DIY liveries £30 per week for stable and turnout and use of schools.

Hunter liveries: £150 per week which includes feed (two to three times), deep straw beds, hay/haylage, clipping, plaiting, tack cleaning, grooming, riding - roadwork, galloping and schooled jumping if necessary. We also have horses to hire if required.

Eventing liveries: we also specialise in eventing liveries, our own and livery horses have continued successes every season. Call for individual requirements.

Assisted DIY, part and full livery prices are dependent on individual requirements.

...

[chestnut mare]

I think you should scale it down as thats a big livery yard for first timers!
If you dont mind me asking how much is the property?

[Gruntfuttock]

hay, feed farrier and basic vet bill (checkups and vaccinations) will be paid for by us

I think you leave yourself open to problems with offering to cover vet care and farriery. It essentially means you are stuck with using one particular farrier and one vet, and what if people don't want to use your vet or farrier - would they then get a reduction in their livery?

What if a horse thats on full livery with "inclusive" farriery needs remedial shoeing? Will the owner then have to pay extra? How much extra? All of it, or just the additional cost ?

Its really all too much of an unnecessary minefield. I would much prefer to be at a yard where the managers offered to hold my horse free of charge for the farrier and for routine vet visits, than if it was all included and you were given no choice of vet or farrier.

What counts as "a lot" for lights in the school or use of the XC course? My current yard has sensors in the lunge pen, that turn the lights on automatically if someone goes in there, which i really like.

Don't forget you will have to factor in land management costs. 30 acres of paddocks is an awful lot to manage, and the XC course will need regular maintenance and inspection to ensure its safe. Will you be expecting everyone to poo-pick their own paddocks, or will you buy a poo hoover, someone will need to spray and top the paddocks to control weeds.

[northern_rachel]

It's a big project and will take a couple of years to establish too.
We're not putting a dampener on your project, just making it realistic! You could end up in a real mess if it all went wrong.

[nevilla]

Another thing to add to your costs is waste disposal. If you running any sort of business I believe you need waste transfer notes for disposal of any material produced. You may be able to do a deal as the waste material is useful to, say, a compost firm but you do need to look into those costs. I read somewhere the average horse produces 20kg of manure per day, add in bedding and with 20 horses, that is a lot of waste to dispose of.

Also add contingency for quiet times and unexpected costs. This needs to be at least 5% of total running costs ie running costs are 105% of the figure you generate.

I think it is a great thing you are doing to put together a business plan what ever might happen next, it will give you extremely useful information. There are plenty of entrepreneurs out there that started as teenagers.

One other thing to add: Remember there are many ways out there to make a small fortune ... into nothing at all! Underestimating running costs is a prime example.

[Trio]

make sure you factor in the NDR's , we just bought a commercial show ground /livery yard (we only have 12 stables though!!;)) and the NDR for just the stables (excluding cafe, show ground, schools etc) was nearly £5000 pa. if you factor this up for the rest of the property it would have been about £18000 a year so double it for yours !
fortunately we're not running it commercialy and have now delisted from a commercial status and rates- just wouldnt stack up economically even if i gave up my job and worked full time at it (and i'm an accountant)

[Sofi P]

I would suggest doing some research of local yards and what they offer/ charge. They will be your competition so you will struggle to charge much more than they do unless you are offering something extra too.

I would avoid including farrier and vets in the charge, maybe include holding for vet or farrier though in full livery as this appeals to people who work full time. But otherwise it seems like too much hassle to be worth it.

I would suggest you only allow your liveries to buy it from you. That way you dont have to worry about providing large amounts of storage space for each of them plus you can add about £1 only the price of every bale. It wont work out much more for the liveries as you will be able to take advantage of the economies of scale from bulk purchases.

Be realistic about the amount of time you are willing to commit and a proper business plan should factor in your wage too. Are you thinking of going to uni? even if you dont move away it'll still have a big impact on your time.

Your parents clearly have their head's screwed on when it comes to running a business so you're in a good position there. I wouldnt worry about potential clients being put off from that point of view. But if you're offering full livery you might find some put off by your lack of experience (I'm assuming here that your parents dont have any horsey knowledge/ experience, ignore this comment if they do!) because you'll be the one coping with things in an emergency.

Good luck with the plan, what a dream come true if it all works out! I remember at 10 my dad making me produce a spreadsheet with all the costs of keeping a horse before he'd buy me one. He kept putting me off for months until I was given a horse anyway and then he couldnt do anything about it! And even if it doesnt come off, it's great experience and pretty fun too - I love drawing up estimates and plans etc. But then I am a bit of a geek...

[NatalieR]

haven't read through all the replies, but to me it would seem far more sensible to find somewhere with only a couple of boxes for your horses and just keep them at home instead of buying a massive yard and having to make it pay for itself.

i'm guessing this is what you are looking at?

http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/561.html

[Soot]

Also be important to know why they got repossessed; i.e. what wasn't working about the business to such as extent as they had to let it go under! If it was a lack of demand, turnover, etc, you're stuffed really!

[NatalieR]

just as an example found these for a fair amount less than the EC that seem like a better idea:)

http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/601.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/569.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/556.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/304.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/541.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/474.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/576.html

just to show what you could get as your own yard at home type of property thing;)

[Stassy]

I wish you all the best if you do go ahead with your livery venture. I wish I had parents who would have backed my business ideas at your age! It will be hard work and you probably won't make an awful lot but it should be satisfying having your own place.

[blonde]

I wish you all the best if you do go ahead with your livery venture. I wish I had parents who would have backed my business ideas at your age! It will be hard work and you probably won't make an awful lot but it should be satisfying having your own place.
thanks i have to persuade my parents which will be very very difficult but as they said for what it is its cheap but they did correct me it not 100k to mucb its near 250k, but they said becasue of what it it they could put in as a business venture and expantion from the one they already have becuse it has office's luckley my dad has been round horses most his life and he does want to get into it. so he knows the genral running cost's. its going to be hard and o very very much dout it will ever happen (probs a 90%+ chance of it not) but it will give me good experiance for the furtre and help with what i want to do when i grow up. also it will make me realise how much it will cost (thats what my parents are hopign for anyway:p)
i showed them what i have so far tonight and htye said it aws very good considering i was only 15

[palmerlover52]

just as an example found these for a fair amount less than the EC that seem like a better idea:)

http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/601.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/569.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/556.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/304.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/541.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/474.html
http://www.ruralandequestrian.com/576.html

just to show what you could get as your own yard at home type of property thing;)

Oh my I'm so in love with that last one!!

[eml]

Good luck to you Blonde.

Just as an idea I have a 36 box, 40 acre place with indoor, outdoor, xc, house, offices, staff accomodation etc. There is no way that I could justify the capital cost (what it cost to buy/build) as a commercial decision. Running a horse business is definately a lifestyle choice.

[NatalieR]

Oh my I'm so in love with that last one!!

i like 4,5 and 6. 4 and 5 are only 30mins away from my aunt aswell :o

oh wells shall look at some in the best county and watch the price rise:p

[LisW]

Place you're looking at is lovely - if it's the one posted. I can dream that I will win lottery but don't buy a ticket so might be hard. I'd want to win enough to pay somebody to run it for me though & for it not to matter if it didn't make money.
Hope you get somewhere nice & your buisness plan is a good exercise anyway, even if it doesn't come off! good luck.

[LisW]

Oh my I'm so in love with that last one!!
Me too - I'm changing my dream now - loving that house!

[eml]

Just reread the posts. If Natalie is right I would not be setting up a DIY livery yard there and the whole commercial aspect needs examining.

Think about where customers come from and access as main criteria...this was a not very sucessful show centre because of the location. It is also in an area where horse owners tend to have their own facilities or need a top class full livery service while they work

[blonde]

:mad:well i am sad now we went to look at the house and my dad did not like it because of the house,
otherwise he said he loved it but he did not like the house so it was a no:mad:
he has seen anouther one that he likes more but i dont like at all:mad:
so if anyone see's any nice ones in the tunbridge wells wadhurst area that has land stables and a sand scholl (amount of stables does not batter just more the 2 would be ideal :D) please do tell me about it

[Pale Moon]

I feel really mean saying this and i dont intend it in a nasty way at all but i wouldnt put my horse on full livery with a 15 year old in charge. Sorry :o


Ditto this....

[Gruntfuttock]

That is EXTREMELY cheap for the area, the acreage and what it is! So I reckon EML is spot-on - it isn't a viable business proposition. Tis a big shame, because its actually rather lovely.

[NatalieR]

:mad:well i am sad now we went to look at the house and my dad did not like it because of the house,
otherwise he said he loved it but he did not like the house so it was a no:mad:
he has seen anouther one that he likes more but i dont like at all:mad:
so if anyone see's any nice ones in the tunbridge wells wadhurst area that has land stables and a sand scholl (amount of stables does not batter just more the 2 would be ideal :D) please do tell me about it

well then seeing as i have absolutely nothing to do today shall get googling :)

http://www.equusproperty.co.uk/site/propertyPage.asp?pid=1894&f=1&r=&county=1

http://www.country-property.co.uk/view_details.php?urn=1272

http://www.hobbsparker.co.uk/CF/bulletin.cfm?PageType=PropDetails&PropRef=E309&PropImage=3&Link=PropMedia

http://www.primelocation.com/uk-property-for-sale/details/id/SASV_193790

http://www.coverwood.com/equestrian-search-results.php?WCI=Particular&WCE=001119902

http://www.primelocation.com/uk-property-for-sale/details/id/HUTE001581

http://www.primelocation.com/uk-property-for-sale/details/id/SASV_177064

http://www.primelocation.com/uk-property-for-sale/details/id/WPSG15255

[NatalieR]

http://www.primelocation.com/uk-property-for-sale/details/id/SAHH_245052

http://www.primelocation.com/uk-property-for-sale/details/id/WPSG3463800

http://www.primelocation.com/uk-property-for-sale/details/id/BRWN1152514

http://www.primelocation.com/uk-property-for-sale/details/id/CORK4130712

http://www.primelocation.com/uk-property-for-sale/details/id/HPXE169192

[hot.to.trot]

firstly your gonna need some grooms unlees its going to be D.I.Y? maybe an instructor?

what id love todo with the place is have half livery and hallf loan ridign school type of thing.

have 2/3 children to a pony. all of them to around the same ability, and they share the days out equally. they come and muck out everyday clean tack once a week, pooh pick everyday inthe summer. they would each have to buy their own headcollar and leadrope groomign kit, numanh and flouresnet stuff. btu the pony would have tack rugs and lunging equiptment. hay feed and shavings would be included in the price and you wold be in charge of feed and you could rasion them to 2 or 3 bags of shavings a week. with a lesson per child per week. say charge each child 100 pund a month . thats £300 per pony a month times that by 15 its 4500 pounds a moth the add on livery ! youll be loaded!

[Gruntfuttock]

I wouldnt allow my child to participate in something like that, though, and i bet a lot of other parents wouldn't either. Why would they all have to buy their own headcollars, grooming kit and numnahs (unless they wanted to, of course)?

[northern_rachel]

I wouldnt allow my child to participate in something like that, though, and i bet a lot of other parents wouldn't either. Why would they all have to buy their own headcollars, grooming kit and numnahs (unless they wanted to, of course)?

Ditto.

[hot.to.trot]

I wouldnt allow my child to participate in something like that, though, and i bet a lot of other parents wouldn't either. Why would they all have to buy their own headcollars, grooming kit and numnahs (unless they wanted to, of course)?

why not? you would have help on the yard so the children wouldnt be on their own. im not talking littl children im talking 11-12 as the youngest. and as for the grromign kit etc to keep their costs down. and it gives the children freedom to choose what colour and have somethign as their own. I thought it was a good idea, for those parents who have teens who would love their own ponies btu maybe cant afford it and it gives them the chace to have some resposibilty, as weel as having to be kidn to thers sharign and workign in a team.

[northern_rachel]

why not? you would have help on the yard so the children wouldnt be on their own. im not talking littl children im talking 11-12 as the youngest. and as for the grromign kit etc to keep their costs down. and it gives the children freedom to choose what colour and have somethign as their own. I thought it was a good idea, for those parents who have teens who would love their own ponies btu maybe cant afford it and it gives them the chace to have some resposibilty, as weel as having to be kidn to thers sharign and workign in a team.

There's a lot to think about. The health and Safety aspect, turning your back on kids with ponies, how the pony will settle with different people and changes in routine...ect ect.

[hot.to.trot]

There's a lot to think about. The health and Safety aspect, turning your back on kids with ponies, how the pony will settle with different people and changes in routine...ect ect.

but normal riding schools round me let kids come down and work 7 hours a day so what is the difference? and there wouldnt be a massive change in routine none in fact. they would be all rounders safe ut with spark. for teens bored of riding schools and would like to have a little more choice and desicsions. it isnt any diferent than leaving you child to look after their own pony, and if there is grooms and other liveries on the yard with the owneres house on site, surely its safer than your child at a normal livery yard on their own with no help?

[Gruntfuttock]

Actually, i can't think of anything worse than asking 3 12 year old girls to share a pony ! The b*tching and back-biting would be horrific, plus there would always be one kid who didn't get a weekend day, so would never be able to take the pony to shows. What if all the kids want to jump - poor pony could be jumping 6 days a week!

[showjumper-09]

firstly your gonna need some grooms unlees its going to be D.I.Y? maybe an instructor?

what id love todo with the place is have half livery and hallf loan ridign school type of thing.

have 2/3 children to a pony. all of them to around the same ability, and they share the days out equally. they come and muck out everyday clean tack once a week, pooh pick everyday inthe summer. they would each have to buy their own headcollar and leadrope groomign kit, numanh and flouresnet stuff. btu the pony would have tack rugs and lunging equiptment. hay feed and shavings would be included in the price and you wold be in charge of feed and you could rasion them to 2 or 3 bags of shavings a week. with a lesson per child per week. say charge each child 100 pund a month . thats £300 per pony a month times that by 15 its 4500 pounds a moth the add on livery ! youll be loaded!

£100 a month! for a pony that isnt theres! It would just be too expensive for everyone to make it work.....

[S.J.C]

Actually, i can't think of anything worse than asking 3 12 year old girls to share a pony ! The b*tching and back-biting would be horrific, plus there would always be one kid who didn't get a weekend day, so would never be able to take the pony to shows. What if all the kids want to jump - poor pony could be jumping 6 days a week!

Hey, I was 12 not so long ago. :o It wouldn't have been a problem for me/ other girls to share a pony. I know 12 sounds very young but a lot of 12 year olds can be very mature. :)

As for the riding bit - yeah, you would have to limit the kiddos to the amount of riding they do ;)

Other wise, as you said. POOR PONY!:eek:

S -- x

[Gruntfuttock]

Also, you have to bear in mind that if this was such a fantastic, workable idea, other RSs would be doing it already. I'm not aware of anywhere that runs such a programme, so there is almost certainly a good reason for that.

S.J.C, i am sure you would have been fine to do something like this as a 12 year old, as would I (back in the Stone Age). However, I bet you can think of one or two girls you would NOT have liked to share a pony with...!

[hot.to.trot]

there would be a routine and they would have to say what theyre doing and when with the poniews own whiteboard. i havn't gone into details btu there woudl be a bullying policy and particular things like no jumping without an adult the pony woudl have one day off and they would have to organise between day so one week teen 1 would have monday and thursday teen 2 would have tuesday and saturday and teen 3 woudlk have friday and saturday, btu next week teen 1 would have tuesday and saturday teen 2 would havemonday and thursday and teen 3 would have friday nd sundy and the gaian a swap round and back to the beggining and so on.

[hot.to.trot]

£100 a month! for a pony that isnt theres! It would just be too expensive for everyone to make it work.....

thats 25 pounds a week :eek: ! this day and age you wouldt get a private hour lesson for that!

[showjumper-09]

ye but that doesnt include a lesson.
If i didnt go to shows and pony club, or buy my pony new equitment all the time (which she doesnt always need) or have lessons on her most weeks, in the summer i probably wouldnt be spending much more than £100 per month!
(i might try that actaully as a little challlenge for myself one month:rolleyes:)

[northern_rachel]

there would be a routine and they would have to say what theyre doing and when with the poniews own whiteboard. i havn't gone into details btu there woudl be a bullying policy and particular things like no jumping without an adult the pony woudl have one day off and they would have to organise between day so one week teen 1 would have monday and thursday teen 2 would have tuesday and saturday and teen 3 woudlk have friday and saturday, btu next week teen 1 would have tuesday and saturday teen 2 would havemonday and thursday and teen 3 would have friday nd sundy and the gaian a swap round and back to the beggining and so on.


So, how many ponies would have have for this? Who would enforce the "anti-bullying" policy? It's all far too confusing and too much for a 11year old. It's hardly cost effective and could keep my own horse for £100 a month.
It just isn't fianancially feesable. Sorry.
Like GF said, if it did work, RS's would have a system set up like it.
Btw, not being offensive, but could you please spell check before you post, it's giving me a headache reading all that.

[horseygal90]

I wouldnt allow my child to participate in something like that, though, and i bet a lot of other parents wouldn't either. Why would they all have to buy their own headcollars, grooming kit and numnahs (unless they wanted to, of course)?
I knew a girl who had an obsession with one of the ponies at an old riding school... She worked there one day a week and had her own grooming kit including show shine which she sprayed *everywhere* on him including under his saddle and on his reins (which he hated because he was only 4 and was scared of the sprayer!) :o, headcollar, lead rope, numnah and name plaque for him.

When he was bought by another client... she carried on treating him like he was her own :o

[Gruntfuttock]

Its a nice idea, but I think its just too complicated to be workable, really. I also think you'd make more money out of those 15 ponies if you used them for "normal" riding lessons and got your horsy-mad teens to come and do the mucking out for free!

Is it EML who's got the fantastically well-organised "Helpers Club"? Something like that would be just as good and much more workable from a H&S and insurance point of view. I would LOVE to see more RSs running Helpers Clubs, but i suspect it takes an awful lot of organisation and time.

[hot.to.trot]

errm but it does include a lesson day and a free day to hack or school or go to a show. as for anti bullying policy the stable hands would. i think riding schoold are about bums in beds and some ponies are doing 5 lesson a day so in reality they would be makign more money in doing taht, hence why they woudnt do it. good luck keeping your own horse at a stables with a menage and xc course, 2 feeds a day a lesson and 3 bags of shavings ! sorry about my spellign but im dyslexic and i actually dont have spell checker on this laptop its that ancient :rolleyes:

[showjumper-09]

i could probably keep Gemini for that, just not including the XC course.
who would be paid for teaching the lesson!
& who would go to/take them to the show!
sorry but it really would not work

[hot.to.trot]

i dont think you have read whta ive written there would be an instructor and some grooms/stablehands as the other 15 stables would be used as liveries.

[eml]

Hot to trot, you have however forgotten that it actually costs to keep and feed these ponies, provide supervision, insurance vets fees, farriers etc etc. Your £300 a month per pony won't go far.

My RS ponies work 2 hours a day five days a week, that is £200 per week. We still don't make a great fortune!!

[IrishDQ]

I think it's a good idea. As you 15, I don't think people (adults) would be willing/happy to do business with you, but if your Dad was handing that side of things and you were helping with the day to day running of the yard, then eventually, maybe you could take over the business side of things as well and perhaps train to be an instructor or horse trainer etc.

I also think you'd be better off trying to find a place with the land and build the stable yard and arena yourself as it would probably work out cheaper. Properties with ready made equestrian facilities tend to work out a lot more expensive than what they would be if you did it yourself. (except for an indoor arena/american barn type set up I suppose which apparently costs a bomb!)

I'd say, find out monthly costs, such as mortgage repayments, insurance, estimated feed/bedding costs for amount of horses that you want to accomodate, and figure out how many liveries etc. you'd need to cover all costs and make profit as well.

I think if you can do a combination of things (livery, lessons, sales etc) you have a better chance of making a success but I suppose it all depends on having the time to do it all really.

This is what I want to do as well as the way I've figured it out I could make a nice living out of it if my plan worked out (i.e. customers!) so hopefully all will go to plan for you. :)

[Kady A]

Its been an interesting thread - and I hope Blonde isn't too disheartened.
I work at large EC - its a comp centre with liveries and private horses. We closed our riding school 3 years ago - and you would have thought it would have brought the insurance down slightly ... it didn't! Business rates are astronomical as are all the associated utiltiies that go with it - water, electricity etc. Like everyone now we are constantly searching for the best feed and bedding deals and try to put on more competitions to keep revenue coming in. Its a very hard business to be in. We run a yard with generally forty horses in and BSJA and unaffiliated jumping and dressage and other events. We also try to do it with minimal staff to keep end costs down to our livery clients ... its getting harder to do. Our indoor arenas have been resurfaced this summer - money that really we couldn't afford but it had to be done.

It makes me laugh when competitors say to us after a show - "we ought to follow you to the bank with that lot". That lot disappears into paying the BSJA for holding the event, Judges, writers, course builders (some of whom are v. expensive), secretary, collecting ring and arena staff ... need I go on ... there aint much left when we've finished!

Someones I wonder why any of us do it ... for myself, I love it! I waited far too long to get into the horse industry, but twenty years of city law firms and I can deal with most things that invariably get chucked at me!

So Blonde don't be mad ut us if you think we have been down on you. Its an amazing opportunity but do you research properly, horses are wonderful but the horse industry is hard hard work :)