new problem mounting youngster

[stella]

Have a 4 year old 14hh gelding who has only been backed 3 months and has never been very good at letting you get on him, but fairly ok if you get on in his stable. Absolutely fine once you are in saddle and fine when you get off. Yesterday decided he was not going to be mounted and backed himself back into corner and reared up. Help!

[wildponies]

before you mount him put a bit of pressure on his back, just by pressing down, if he isn't bothered lean over him, if he still isn't bothered then jump on. try doing this every day cuz some newly broken horses tend to go backwards and kick up a fuss over the silliest of things!

[Showjumper]

Before I ever got on Dolly, I taught her the Stand command, and used it frequently, praising her each time she stood. Then I started asking her to Stand, did something (eg jumped up and down still saying Stand) then praised her. She soon got used to the fact that she would get praised for standing, but would get double the praise if she kept standing whilst I was doing something else.

Soon I was able to start leaning over her while she stood, and eventually to get on without her moving because she was waiting to be praised.

This worked excellently for Dolly, but if your little man doesn't take to it, just ask someone to hold him, and just get on and off (I presume you're using a mounting block as if you're mounting from the ground, you could be pulling his saddle over which is why he now doesn't want to be mounted) until he realises that being mounted isn't scary and just stands still.

[ggabby]

i allways insist that my riders take a leg up when mounting youngsters, its important that there is someone on the ground to help, i would go back to leaning over him a few times before you get up on him, if having a problem when training allways gp back a step for a little while.

[stella]

Thanks, girls for your tips. It's my daughter's pony and I am always there holding him, reassuring him, holding down offside stirrup etc whilst she gets on.
I think it's just a case of patience really. He will tolerate pulling the saddle around, leaning over etc but is still wary of it and has till now allowed my daughter to get on but got himself into a right state last time as I reported & I'm sure my daughter will be frightened to get on next time, fearing the worst.
He is generally not very good at standing still, e.g. for washing legs so I think we will have to start from the ground up & work on praising him for any little bit of standing still he does.

[Big Ears]

Guess you just have to persevere and get him a little more confident - perhaps saddle him up, walk him out in hand, attach some feed bags to the saddle, just to get him more used to movement/noise. Perhaps try in the sand school getting on and off several times, just leading him a couple of circuits, then off and on again, just to build up his tolerance of it.

Would be a bit wary of getting on him in the stable, as if he panics you could all get hurt.

[stella]

Thanks, Big Ears, for your help. Reason daughter has been getting on in stable is that pony always steps back when you try & get on & the idea was that at least he knows the size limitations of his stable & therefore he can't get very far.

I'm hoping that the backing himself into the corner & rearing up incident was a one off & obviously we are aware of that possibility now so hopefully we wont let him get to that stage again.

It was my daughter's lesson & the instructor had lunged pony first in sand school & he was as quiet as a mouse. Then instructor decided to get on him in school before letting my daughter on him & he just kept backing up so I suggested we went back to stable to mount up there. However, pony was not happy. I don't think it helped that yard was quite lively at that time and 3 of us in stable hassling the poor pony.

Ended up just lungeing him some more & noone riding him.

Think I'll go back to doing a bit of ground work with him this week & leave riding for a week.

[Mehitabel]

what i'd do is to find the limits of what he is happy with - ie - her leaning over, putting weight in one stirrup, hopping up and down beside him etc, and just do that until he is no longer uneasy. if you do the whole thing when he is already uneasy, it makes it worse in his mind and he will only get worse.
getting on in the stable is treating the symptoms, not the cause - and as you've found, it won't make him any less scared, all he thinks is 'i'm scared and can't get away'. you need to take away the fear in the first place.

. He will tolerate pulling the saddle around, leaning over etc but is still wary of it

just work on this for a bit - don't take anything further until he has lost the bad associations with the earlier steps. when he's happy - properly happy and unconcerned, not just tolerating it - with you or her hopping up and down next to him, then move on to puttign some weight in a stirrup, them get a leg up and lie over, then leg over but lying on his neck, and only then sitting up. he needs ot be absolutely happy with each stage before you move on, otherwise it will build up and come out later in worse ways.
good luck with him!

[intouch]

Unashamed bribery. Have someone reward him with food while he stands - leaning over, whatever, till he is steady, then take over from the saddle, then gradually drop the reward and he will accept a pat as reward. Nowadays called positive reinforcement, but it has worked for me for many years! Takes about a week.
I'm sure you've checked that the saddle is not uncomfortable.

[Mehitabel]

i'm not terribly keen on bribery for mounting - after an experience i had once. i was backing a young stallion for someone, and she insisted on feeding him loads whatever was being done. the first time i got on, she was there stuffing his face as i did all my leaning over and sitting up, and he didn't notice what i was doing as he was so busy munching. as soon as she took the food away so we could ask him to walk on he went bananas as he suddenly noticed i was on his back and sitting up and he hadn't noticed any of the intermediate stages.

fair enough a little treat after he's been good at the end of a session, but since then i don't reward wih feed in the middle of a session.

[stella]

Es, I think you've summed it up with the "I'm scared and I can't get away". I'm sure that's what he was thinking. There was me, my daughter and her istructor all hassling him.

I've been working on his standing still problems generally. For example he was never very good at letting you pick out feet but is now almost perfect and wouldn't stand still to let you hose legs but again has become a really good boy these last few days. I think it's just early days and we have to earn his trust.

I'll report again when we get to the mounting stage but we are leaving that for a couple more days & just concentrating on ground work at the mo.

[intouch]

I think the point you made, Es, that the stallion didn't notice what was happening, is the difference between positive reinforcement and getting one over on them! Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.