struggling with my stops - HELP!!

[Jessey]

Hi, My chap is coming on quite nicely now and he is really trying to stop(from a lope), really tucking his quarters down etc. But I cant sit the stops! I either lock my legs to hard and catapult forwards when he stops or I concentrate on keeping my knees soft and end up bouncing and slapping on his back ( he's stating to dig in a bit so am going to talk to farrier and when I can next have a lesson talk to the trainer.)
I would really appriciate any advise you can give me on sitting these stops well, the last thing I want to do is hurt my horse by poor riding or he will start to run through stops again.
thanks

J

[Harry Hobbes]

Make a concerted effort to turn your toes up and extend your legs (and heels) down, when you sit down to cue the stop. This puts you deep into the saddle and should feel like you are sliding down around the barrel of the horse. It also lowers your center of gravity into the saddle, helping you to stay in the saddle.

Get good at this at the walk, then trot, and finally the canter.

Also, make sure that you are not pulling on the reins to cue a stop, as you may tend to pull yourself forward. Reference this post for the starting and stopping with just a seat cue: http://www.newrider.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=45969

Best regards,
Harry

[TBs N QHs]

Originally posted by Harry Hobbes
Make a concerted effort to turn your toes up and extend your legs (and heels) down, when you sit down to cue the stop. This puts you deep into the saddle and should feel like you are sliding down around the barrel of the horse. It also lowers your center of gravity into the saddle, helping you to stay in the saddle.

Get good at this at the walk, then trot, and finally the canter.

Also, make sure that you are not pulling on the reins to cue a stop, as you may tend to pull yourself forward. Reference this post for the starting and stopping with just a seat cue: http://www.newrider.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=45969

Best regards,
Harry

Ditto.

[Jessey]

I'm gonna try this tonight (and I suspect for the next year or so!!)
Will let you know how we get on, Thanks

J

[BrokenSaddle]

Harry, Jessey is going to be in Montana in the fall and she is looking for tack can you help her?

[Harry Hobbes]

Harry, Jessey is going to be in Montana in the fall and she is looking for tack can you help her? I surely can.

Edit: I presume that she will be shopping for tack when she gets to Montana.

I can advise her regarding most western tack (saddles, bridles/headstalls, bits, ropes, etc.), equipment and accoutrements -- including what to wear so as to look like a real cowboy (rather than a "Hollywood" or "dude" cowboy). I can also point her to a variety of saddle shops, tack outlets/stores, and also a variety of web sites dealing with western tack and equipment.

Jessey,

Let me know what kinds of tack/equipment that you are interested in, or what you want to accomplish vis-a-vis tack, and I'll have a better idea how to respond, and where to point you.

I'm in south-western Montana (Bozeman) and am most familiar with various suppliers in this area, but can provide some limited information regarding other areas of Montana.

Also, "TNT" is up in the Great Falls area, and may be able to render some assistance for that area.

Best regards,
Harry

[Jessey]

Thanks Harry, Heres the run down, I compete as often as I can so I am gonna be looking for a saddle that is hard wearing but still good looking as it will have to be used for my everyday riding aswell (unless you know of some good second hand shops, then I could get another saddle for day to day, OH probably won't like that tho). I am gonna be kiting out my filly she is chestnut with a flaxen mane and tail. She is QH X paint/TB, she has a QH body and a pretty TB head. She is very wide across her withers so I think she will need a full QH bar but I will take tracings to bring out with me. I want to rein with her but she will do pleasure and trail classes aswell. To give you an idea, I have a Circle Y roping saddle for my other horse. What I love about it: Deep cantle, very simple tooling makes cleaning easy, Light tan has now gone a kind of russet color, really stands out on a dark bay.
Basically I just love pretty things for my pretty ponies!
I will also be looking for good value day to day stuff, bridles, reins, cinch's, pads etc., Oh and I love looking smart for showing, I usually wear black jeans a white shirt and a black waist coat with a pretty bolo and buckle - I don't mind a few sparkles but don't like to look like a christmas tree! As I am sure you have gathered by now I am really excited and can't wait to go shopping, jess will look so posh when we take her out in 2006!
Thanks again
Jessey

[Harry Hobbes]

Jessey,

I assume by your post that you are competing in Western Pleasure and will be buying a saddle and headstall (bridle). Correct?

The "second hand" saddles are typically custom saddles sold on consignment in various tack shops, and tend to be more expensive than new production saddles. Production saddles do not hold very much resale value, so there are few in the tack shops; these are usually sold in pawn shops of via the classified advertisements in the newspapers.

When you trace your horse's back, transfer the tracings to heavy cardboard (or better yet: 1/4 inch plywood) and cut out the outline in pieces of cardboard. Then you have a model of the curve of the withers and back to compare to the underside of any saddle. Bring the models to Montana.

You should make four models, so that you can take the "shape of your horse" with you to Montana:

1. Crossways over the withers. This shape is used to match the opening (width and height) of the gullet and front of the bars in the saddle.

2. Crossways over the back where the cantle will set (approximately eighteen inches aft of the wither curve, assuming a fifteen inch saddle). This shape is used to match the shape of the bars at the rear of the saddle.

3. Length-wise from the top of the withers back along the horse's spine for twenty inches, but offset laterally four inches from the top of the wither/spine line, so that you have the shape of the back where the bar will sit - not the shape of the spine between the bars. This shape is used to match the "rocker" of the bars in the saddle.

4. The inside of your horse's current headstall (bridle) from the poll down to the bit, so that you can find a comparable size in the USA. This should be an oblong oval in the shape of your horse's headstall, which will be shaped to your horse's head.

I will be surprised if your filly truly requires a full QH tree, as that is a very wide horse, and your filly is a cross with lighter framed horses. But, the measured width of model number one above, will help you determine just exactly what she requires. The general gullet width measurements for tree types are:

1. Regular - 5 3/4"
2. Semi-quarter horse - 6 1/4"
3. Quarter horse - 6 1/2"
4. Extra-wide Quarter horse - 6 3/4"

But take these measurements with a grain of salt, because other sources list slightly different widths.

The other thing to do is to determine the type and setting of the rigging for the saddle. There are three basic types of rigging (in-skirt, plate, ring), which you choose to achieve different objectives. You choose type of rigging based upon the type and severity of work (and stress on the saddle) to be done with the saddle independent of the horse. If you're doing heavy roping then you should consider flat plate; else you can use any type.

The setting of the rigging is of particular importance and you should determine this on your horse prior to buying a saddle, because if the setting is wrong for the horse's shoulder/wither conformation, the saddle may shift forward up onto the horse's scapula when the cinch is tight. The best way to determine this is to borrow saddles with different rigging positions and try them on your horse. Nowadays, the 7/8's rigging position is prevalent because of the general conformation of the modern horse; but it's not unusual to find horses that require "full" or a 3/4 position rigging. Reference item number one of my post on 24 October 2004, at 3:47 P.M.: http://www.newrider.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42015
…for instructions on how to check the setting/alignment of the rigging position for any horse.

Probably the best research that you can do this winter/spring/summer is to visit the production saddle manufacturers web sites and peruse their pictures of saddles and equipment. That way, you can narrow down your search to a specific style/look. Also, the catalog houses have web sites with pictures and descriptions. Then you can contact outlets/tack shops in Montana in advance to ascertain whether they have what you want, or will get it in for you.

Also, let us know what area of Montana you will be visiting, and we'll pass along the names, location, and telephone numbers of various tack shops in those areas. (Montana is a BIG state.) Then you can contact them in advance and determine if they have an assortment saddles/tack that meet your requirements in stock for your viewing when you arrive. (For example, Bozeman Saddle Outlet (http://www.coveredwagonranch.com/Saddle%20Outlet.htm) carries over 500 saddles in stock.)

For general tack shopping, again, what area will you be passing through/staying? If Bozeman, there's Murdock's Ranch and Home, Four Corners Saddlery, Bozeman Saddle Outlet, Three Forks Saddlery (30 miles up the road), and a few custom saddle and leather shops to have custom chaps/chinks (or whatever) made for yourself.

Best regards,
Harry

[Jessey]

We are gonna fly into Billings and rent a car and travel round for a week, gonna visit both MT and WY, were not going to book anything just drive where we feel like, depending on where we 'landed' the day before. Thanks for your advise on taking the measurements for the saddle, I'm going to have a go tonight so that I know what sort of bar she will need for definate before I start searching the web. I like the Circle Y saddles but have found the new reining saddles tend to have loads of tooling on and I like something simpler (easier to clean!)
thanks

J

[cvb]

I compete as often as I can

US folk - don't assume thats a lot as we don't HAVE many comps to go to in UK.

(and even less in Scotland !)

Jessey - what do you use to clean your saddle(s) ?

I posted a similar question ages ago when I first joined NR and didn't get many answers. I know we're limited to what we can get over here - but just after any tips !

( I vary what I use - either just normal saddle soap, or a leather balsalm I found in Sainsburys ! But don't use the balsalm on latigos etc or they go to soft and sticky :rolleyes: We have a spray (RagFork) which I've also found quite useful to get into the difficult bits on a western saddle)

[Jessey]

I manage to compete almost every weekend between april and october, admittedly we cover some miles to do it.
I tend to just wipe over with warm water to get all the dust, sweat and stuff off then use neatsfoot oil to sofen and shine up. I was told something ages ago about the US saddlers treating saddles with something different to those in th UK so our saddle soaps aren't the best thing to use - can't really remember.

[Harry Hobbes]

We are gonna fly into Billings and rent a car and travel round for a week, gonna visit both MT and WY,
Jessy,

I suspect that you are also interested in some of the local sites of interest (such as the Custer National Battlefield, Yellowstone, etc.), so I'll include a list (with locations referenced) within an assumed radius of Billings. Also, I'll list the "scenic" routes where the view is better than the interstate highway (our equivalent of the"M" routes). It'll be a couple of weeks or so before I get this together.

Best regards,
Harry

[Jessey]

Your'e a star, inside info can really make a difference on these trips.

thanks again

J