What to do and where to go next?

[Drummers mum]

I shall try to keep this short and to the point but I read a thread about young horses earlier in the week and it has played on my mind ever since!!

He has come on loads in the last year but..........

Drummer will be 6 this year.
He hacks out in company but is quite spooky alone.
I have been doing some Parelli and other NH stuff with him.
I have also taught him a couple of tricks.
I can only get canter on hacks.
We have a brill relationship and he is fun to be with.
He can be very nappy/tail swishy cross and gets bored easily when schooling.
He is not very forward going.
He can't do trotting poles with me on board.

All these things are somewhere to start BUT I don't know where to go next. I realise he is still young and needs time to mature but how do I tell when to take things further? and WHAT do I do to take things further? I want to stay as NH as I can and was wondering about trying to find someone NH trained to help me with schooling etc. I am at a bit of a loss and it has suddenly occured to me that things could go very wrong if I don't know what I am doing.

I don't want an over schooled super pony but I would like to have a fun, balanced pony who listens to me (most of the time, lol!) and is responsive to my aids.

Any advice and help much appreciated!:)

[KarinUS]

I think you already kind of answered yourself, haven't you? ;)

Instruction. Shop around and find someone that can watch the two of you and give you feedback and direction. :)

[eventerbabe]

i hit a brick wall with my progress last year and only got going again when i started with regular lessons. i think if you have a young horse, regular lessons are essential to make sure you are teaching him properly and progressing in the right way :)

[Secret Smiley]

Just out of interest, why can't you do troting poles?

Maybe get some regular lessons and aim toward a dressage show?

Anyway he sounds like a lovely boy:) .

Cheers,
Kylie

[Jessey]

For in between all those lessons I found this book: '101 arena exercises for horse and rider' written by Cherry Hill (got it from amazon) it gives you lots of little schooling exercises, tells you how to do them (in plain old english) and what you should achive by doing them. Each one, start to finnish, will probably only take 2 or 3 minutes so my horse dosen't get bored as they aren't long enough (and I don't forget them). The book is written for both english and western riders but as the principles are the same for both she has combined it very well. It takes you right from balancing the walk to canter pirouetes and covers every thing in between, without knowing your doing it you are performing little parts of the advanced manoves then the simple little exercises link together and hey presto, I would give it a very high recomendation.

J

[shandy84]

He sounds like a typical native six year old :)

Does he longrein? if so that could help with learning to go out on his own and may be some hep in his canter and trot pole work, Shandy can now do trot poles o the longreins, she doesn't have me to unbalance her, this may be where the problem lies depending on what it is that makes you say you can't do trt pole.

Also walking out in hand will help establish going out on his own and less napping. If he is the type to get bored, make GW interesting, Shandy is the same and we longrein her over poles, through shapes, make her turn in boxes made from poles etc

Sound like you have a great relationship and an instructor can't hurt

[Drummers mum]

Thanks everyone.

Jessey: I like the sound of that book Its my birthday next week and everyone wants to know what to get me, I think I just found one!!

Secret Smiley: He just stops when I'm on him and stumbles over them but he's fine if I run over them with him following. I think its his balance and mine!!:o

Shandy84: I haven't tried long reigning, it worries me because he can be a little free with his back end if he doesn't like something!! I have lead him out several times and he will follow me anywhere without a care in the world, he's just not so sure when I'm on top.

My biggest problem sometimes is his lack of enthusiasm, he often naps towards the yard when I'm in the field and is slow going away and speedy coming back. He never openly disobeys me but tries it on all the time!

[shandy84]

I had the same worries with Shandy, you can actually run the back line over their back rather than around the bottom if you are worried he will kick - Esther is the best person to ask - but I can assure you that it challenges them more than lunging. Also you are never directly behind them, you are always to on side around level with the hip and as close or as far away as you feel you need to be.

It does sound like a balance issue, lik when you add you he can't cope anymore, have you tried introducing one pole at a time? If not that's a good place to start.

It also sounds like he doesn't take you as positive leadership when you re on board, are you generally a nervous or gentle and very quiet rider? If so maybe talk to him some more, if you long rein he'll learn to respond to your voice more and this may help his ridden work as you could be more positive in your voice and he would be used to taking instruction from you without seeing you.

If you wanted t try long reining there are some instructors that will teach it as well as ridden work

[Drummers mum]

I was VERY nervous after a bad fall (not on Drummer) but he has given me confidence. I suppose I am quite a quiet rider, I've never thought about it much, the YO says I'm too soft but I don't believe in smacking with whips and I TRY to be firm!

I am definately going to try long reining, my YO will show me how to do it properly. I did some parelli tonight and he was really listening and responsive, I have just got to transfer that to other things I suppose!

[shandy84]

I dn't blame you for being nervous and don't think that to be firm and loud and positive youn need to smack him, it's more t do with your voice, if you can get him trained e.g on the longreins to know what you mean by tone of voice, he'll know when mums not pleased and when mums happy etc.

Good luck let us know how it goes I'm sure you'll be fine, try not to be nervous and don't push yourself, I only spent two months long reining a walk because I kept getting my lines confused :rolleyes:

[Drummers mum]

Thanks Shandy84:)

[Colorado Sunset]

Does he lunge over trotting poles? Could you get someone to lunge him over them whilst you are on board, just hovering in jumping position all the way roung so he doesnt feel you much and then go on to rising to the trot as you go over them and then take the lunge off and have a go?

As for the other stuff- having a goal is good, like a dressage test.

Definately have some lessons, as your instructor can then asess your pony and they can tell you what excersises to practise which are good for your pony.

If he doesnt like the school, you can still do things like shoulder-in and leg yeilding on hacks. In poland, the instrucors would do piaf, passage, changes of canter lead every stride, half-pass etc during the hacks, the horses really enjoyed it and it kept them in control, thinking but having a good time aswell. (Although, i dont think all hacks should be this intense, the horse needs some relaxed fun time with you :) )


Jo

[notpoodle]

work on cantering in the school maybe? angel wasnt quite sure of that when i got her, but we are getting better and can now canter eggshapes and figures of eight with trot in the middle (no flying changes for us, hehe) :)

julia
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[laura jeanne]

Hi, I'm wondering what's going on that he stops at the poles. If they are the correct distance apart for trotting, just look out in front of you out of the arena and pretend they're not even there and keep posting and thinking "forward". If you look down at them, you will get out of balance and that may be causing him to stop.

I watched a great video clip:
www.horsecity.com
in the drop down menu called Choose a Category, choose Video Training Tips
Then choose English Riding Tips with Paul Eversole
Then look at Cavaletti I for spacing of the poles and Cavaletti II for someone riding them.

I watched this many times, especially with the sound off before I ever trotted over poles and by the time I got to that in my lessons, I could do it with no problem.

If you watch it, let me know if you think it's as helpful as I did.

[Drummers mum]

Laura Jean I can't find it!

Notpoodle, Canter is almost a no go area at the moment, He only just manages it in a straight line on hacks! I think I need him to be more balance first, which was why I was trying the poles!!

Jo, I might try the hovering thing it would mean I'm not interfering then! I do really think its a quetion of balance and maybe I'm trying too hard!

[laura jeanne]

What part can't you find?
Very close to the top are 4 drop down menus.
The second one is called Find It Fast Menu.
Maybe that's where I went wrong with the instructions.
Under Find It fast Menu, scroll down to Video Training tips.

(Sorry, mine had find a category showing)

[Drummers mum]

Ok, I've found the list of training tips but I can't see the one you mean, sorry:o

[laura jeanne]

Keep going down in the Find It Fast drop down menu til you see VIDEO training tips. The you will see English Riding Tips and click on See topics to Watch. Hope you can find it!

[Dizzy]

With the trot poles, did you start him with just one pole or with a few?

If you started with a few, he's probably finding it difficult to read the distances and keep going forward.

I usually start by lying one in the middle of the school. Then I lead the pony around the school at a nice walk, and do about 10 minutes inhand work. I mix in halt, walk on, halt, back, and also walk over the pole. I also ask him/her to halt immediately before the pole, halt above the pole with front legs one side and back legs the other, then I ask her to back up and walk on, or walk on, halt and back up over the pole.

Once he/she's relaxed and listening I'd get on. Then I start again in walk, asking for a nice forward walk, and spend a few minutes warming up mixing in halts, circles of varying size, fig of 8 and serpentines avoiding the pole at first, then I'd include it.

I wouldn't move up into trot over the pole until he/she can walk it with out altering her stride or head carriage. Once thats ok I'd move up into trot, and again I'd be looking for him/her to do it without losing rythym or altering his/her frame. This is also a good exercise to do in canter, it shouldn't be a problem for Drummer as you are still going in a straight line and it wouldn't compromise his balance.

Once you've conquered one pole, then you can add another and go through the same process.

With the not going forward, I'm afraid you will have to be firm him. What you must bear in mind is that there are very few riders who enjoy whipping horses, those that do are normally ignorant and do not have the ability to educate a horse.

The only way to teach a horse to go forward is to give an aid that is effective and praise them when they respond correctly. If the aid is ignored we must use a stronger aid until we get a response we can praise.

I always use in this order - ask politely with my legs and voice, ask firmly with my legs and voice, ask firmly with legs and voice, but back up with the schooling whip behind my leg and I don't think twice about it. But the split second I get forward I praise.

If you're aids are clear, firm and consistant you'll probably only have to insist 2 or 3 times. But if you don't, you'll nag away with your legs, your aids will be unclear, and he'll become dead to leg.

When we're teaching horses we must break the lessons down into bite size pieces, but be crystal clear with our aids and be very quick with our praise. They have absolutely no idea what we want from them, they have no idea about forward, rythym, frame or balance with a rider on board. It's our job to teach them, unfortunately some our aids have to be quite firm, but done correctly, our aids can quickly become a squeeze or even a thought. But the education has to be put in place first.

If he's a bugger in the school , you can introduce alot of schooling out hacking. Transistions will sharpen up his response to your legs, 10 strides walk, 10 strides trot. Then move on to 10 strides walk, 10 sitting trot, 10 rising trot and repeat. Then reduce the strides to 9, 8, 7, 6.

Hope this is helpful, good luck.

[Drummers mum]

Thanks Dizzy, thats very helpful, you make it all sound nice and simple. I will do what you said with the pole. I try not to nag at him as I understand about being dead to the leg, he's very responsive when he wants to be so I will try your 3 stages and hopefully he will listen!

Thanks for all your replies everyone, you have been really helpful, I'm starting to get it straight in my mind where I should be heading, don't stop with the replies though, more help the better!!

[Jessey]

Do you still get tense when you ride? thinking about his spooking when you hack out and that you know he can't do the trotting poles with you on board? I used to do all that and my poor ponie was soooo confused, I didn't even know I was telling him so many different things at once. When you trot try Humming in a low long note or make it a little quicker to match you trot, (I know it sounds really silly) what this does is forces you to breathe and your lower body to relax, try it you'll see what I mean, this then sends you pony nice relaxed seat signals to say 'everything is fine, don't worry, just keep doing what your doing' (my YO thinks I'm mad, always humming and singing when I ride) Also you could try a little Lavender oil (a few drops on you collar) before you ride, it will help you relax and enjoy it more. I know when I get tense I tend to bounce and bobble round more and this really works for me (now you all think I'm totally mad):D

J

[Drummers mum]

Laure Jeanne I found it at last and I watched all the clips, they are brill but you want them to go on longer!

[laura jeanne]

I'm so glad you found them! I really like them. I watched the trotting poles so many times til I could visualize it perfectly when I was actually doing it.

One thing, did you watch the Proper Lead at the Canter? He says to have your inside shoulder forward but my instructor would have a fit if I did that.

I also love the galloping video.

Don't you feel like you could just trot those poles like a pro after watching it?? and get all impatient while the rider is making his way around the arena to trot them again??

[Drummers mum]

Lol!:D

[Dizzy]

Hey I know it all sounds nice and simple;) , but I also know that some times it isn't. Know what you're aiming for, but keep your goals low, so that its easy for you to offer praise, and anything extra is a bonus.

Keep reminding yourself that you are his teacher, imagine that you have been dropped into a land where no-one else speaks your language, but expects you to understand what they want. At first the the language has to be quite abrupt, quickly followed by praise. As you start to understand the language it becomes more discreet - as your understanding grows.

Good luck with him, just be firm and consistant, take baby steps and believe me you'll get there.

[Drummers mum]

Hey Dizzy, thanks, I think that is the most encouraging simple piece of advice I have ever had!:D

[notpoodle]

angel is great with poles and things inhand. when i ride her over poles i worry sometimes that she will slip over them or stumble (ive seen horses literally fall over poles before ...) ... so it usually takes us 2 go's or so until we can ride over them nicely :) (angel is always a bit like 'wow, i have four feet i can LIFT ... isnt it nifty??')

julia
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