Giving up the lessons?

[hApPiNeSs]

The prices have gone up again, and I am still de-improving. Last year. we used to do a warm up in the inside arena, then go outside and jump a small course of jumps (i know thats probebly nothing to you but im a slow learner!)

now we just do gymnastic grids and they are so BORING

plus my instructer met happster and was very rude, saying she was ridiculusy small and scruffy (she only puts me on the 16hh+ beasts)

so i have decided to give up, seeing as i am never happier when i tear around the countryside finding 'shortcuts' (ie obstacle courses :D ) for me and happy to hurdle along.

happy loves it to, and cant get out of the yard quick enough

so do i really need the lessons? im not a brilliant rider, but i know the basics and am a gentle rider (or so im told)

my mum thinks that my riding will get bad if i dont go to these boring lessons? but if i practise on happy without my stirrups every so often, do u think i will get worse???

[eventerbabe]

You do need lessons, i'm of the opinion every horse owner should have lessons as we never stop learning. but i think you definately need to find a better instructor. a good instructor should never put you, or your horse, down, and they should gear the lessons to what you want to do. do you have a freelance instructor come to you or do you go to a local riding school? i have a qualified friend come in and teach me at home, but i tried many instructors before i found one i was happy with.

[cvb]

at the risk of sounding like a mother here

Gymastic grids are actually really good for the rider... and without a good foundation you're not going to handle courses in the longer term.

It'd be like trying to do an exam without ever doing any learning :rolleyes:

Even Olypic riders have lessons and coaching - so you figure you're better than that ???

I've been riding for 30 odd years (some years odder than others ;) ) and a few years back I went to Sweden. Well I HAD to ride so found myself an "advanced" group to ride in. It wasn't really what I would call advanced, but with the language barrier, and the difficulty in getting into groups - I went for it.

But what I did was always set myself tough targets within the exercises the instructor was asking us to do.

So say we did lateral work - she accepted "ok" results, but I would keep on working to get it better. And so on.

Can't you do the same ? So even if the grid work is "boring" - think about what YOU want to work on e.g. is your lower leg secure, is your release just so, is your fold correct and on time, do you always land on correct lead, do you get the striding right every time or does the horse have to stretch or shorten ?

There's a saying something like

"amateurs practise till they get it right, professionals practise til it can't go wrong"

well how about doing the "professional" thing ??!

(p.s. and yes, I'm still having lessons, and learning, and improving)

[Bay Mare]

Another vote for lessons. Another vote for grids. The grids aren't just good for you they are also good for your horse, look at it that way if you really really hate them.

It's not just about riding without stirrups, it's not just about being gentle. You need to have lessons so that you don't pick up bad habits and so that you improve your riding, surely that's better for you and your horse? IMO the basics are the hardest things to lean and you can ALWAYS improve your basics. The better the basics are the better the harder stuff.

If you really don't get along well with your instructor then maybe look at changing but be aware that any good instructor isn't going to just let you hare around the countryside!

[cvb]

Happiness

I was thinking about this conversation this morning as I came to work...

and a couple of points came to me

- I commented about "Olympic riders" having lessons. Well yes, but they get their lessons from even better coaches/trainers.

I do think ongoing lessons are a really good thing - but it has to be with an instructor who can add something. If this is instructor has really come to a "stop" for you, perhaps you need a change ?

- so to the next point

I realised that there is a turning point in most people's learning when it stops being "reactive" learning. i.e. that someone else sets the pace and content and speed, and starts being "active" learning i.e. you go out and seek the learning yourself.

And I know you're going to tell me this is tough in a lesson BUT - I also know people who go out and find other ways to learn - books, videos, etc - to back up their "formal" learning experience.

What is interesting is that this change from reactive to active almost always gets a response from the trainer. Yes - in some cases they simply can't cope with someone who is active asking to learn ;) but in a lot of cases they respond to it postively and start to speed up to match you. Even within the lesson and with other learners, they will ask (and expect !) a little more from you.

It IS a double edged sword as more will be expected from you, and you can't hide at the back of the class :p but it can be quite exhilerating. And it WILL take you to a whole new level.

My suggestion would be to try a new approach with your current instructor first. Consider telling them how you feel, ask them what they think you need to work on, and so on. i.e. ENGAGE them, don't just sit back waiting to be taught something ;)

Learning is supposed to be a 2-way process.

[cvb]

p.s. and yes you WILL get worse w/o lessons. There is clear evidence that not practising a skill leads to a reduction in skill. And w/o an instructor there will be skills you are not practising.

Doing the odd bit of "no stirrups" will not help you in that.

[Mehitabel]

:raises hand: you definmtiely get worse with no lessons. madam was off sick from last april - september, and is just now fit enough to begin schooling again. i've been breaking in babies all summer, had no lessons. my lord have i gone downhill...
i know what i ought to be doing, but my position has gone to pot, my legs won't stay where i put them and i am just a terribleterrible rider. now having a lesson a week and really suffering...

[notpoodle]

i LOVE having lessons, but unfortunately i cannot afford to have a lot of them at the moment :rolleyes:

i am painfully aware of how rubbish my riding is and i also know i NEED lessons in order to get anywhere ('anywhere' not being competitions, but just a happy horse and a happy rider!).

julia
x

ps: @happiness: it may seem pointless but it WILL help, especially with brakes and general 'listening' skills :)

[shirley]

Why don't you join a riding club or something similar. Having like minded people to meet up with quite frequently will be quite stimulating.
If you do not like your present instructor, by all means have a moan, we all do, but change them to someone you enjoy having lessons with. Someone who will work with you and your horse, not give subjective opinions about you at all. Read, look at videos and then talk to your instructor about them.
I have recently joint a riding club and they do walk and trot dressage tests, so we put in for one of them, got 53%, not brilliant, but we had a go, got out for the day and had a good time. But with that score sheet it gave me and my instructor something to work to etc. Next outing, doing the same test I got 67% - not again brilliant, but I had improved and that was what I was after. You do not have to spend everyday in menage - by boy would certainly get really bored with that, but perhaps 2 -3 times a week at the most and then the rest hack out, have fun, jump and gallop to your hearts content. Also you can make your own schooling sessions fun as well.
The key really is getting the right person with whom you click and can get the best from you and your horse to improve you both.
Good luck and happy searching!!!

[jinglejoys]

Or you could try a differant type of riding like Western? You may like it better.

[westley_jacobs]

where in cornwall from happy?

[hApPiNeSs]

Even Olypic riders have lessons and coaching - so you figure you're better than that ???

blimmin heck i didnt say that!!!! i said im quite happy to ride around the countryside on my pony! i dont think im a very good rider and never will be!

phew, that was a lil bit harsh! :(

[hApPiNeSs]

@ westley_jacobs - lanner - kinda near redruth

[No_Angel]

I dont think lessons are necessary, and they are an expensive thing to keep doing if your not enjoying it.
I dont have lessons, Im not olymipc standard, and I never will be, but it doesn't stop me competing or enjoying my horses. Im not a bad rider, and a few people have said that, even my boss who competed at Burly and rode to Intermediate level eventing!
Why dont you have the occasional lesson when you feel you need it, on your own horse! Riding other horses does help you, but theres nothing wrong with riding your own horse excellently and riding others a little less excellently! :D

[cvb]

Originally posted by hApPiNeSs
blimmin heck i didnt say that!!!! i said im quite happy to ride around the countryside on my pony! i dont think im a very good rider and never will be!

phew, that was a lil bit harsh! :(

ooo - wasn't meant harshly honest :(

was meant as a genuine question - a lot of people seem to think ridings like driving lessons - once you've learnt you thats it :rolleyes:

The thing is that riding around the countryside is actually quite a risky thing which requires good feel, connection, balance, control.

Not necessarily cos of you or your pony, but cos of all the nutty things that happen - like bin days, or shoots that think its ok to let a gun off real close to a bridleway, or loose dogs, or scary plastic bags, or big lorries and double decker buses - etc etc

so actually you need to keep up a certain level of competence just to be reasonably safe in what you want to do.

Sure - to hack you don't need to do piaffe, passage etc (tho you might without meaning to sometimes ;) ) - but you do need to have a secure, confident, independent seat and hands.

does that make more sense ? not suggesting that you need to be an olympic rider - we just want you alive as a happy hacker :p

[amandal]

I can totally sympathise - I'm having real trouble with lessons this year, in fact since buying my horse and moving from the original yard, which wasn't perfect but I did have access to lots of different instructors.

I went to the 2nd yard, v well respected locally, great reputation. First lesson I had there I asked a question about why the instructor was asking me to do something and was told that I shouldn't argue with her I should just do what she said ! That was bad enough but her comments after the lesson were the most destructive criticism I've ever heard.

So stopped using her, had 2 other lessons with 2 different instructors one was ok although I got the feeling that she'd spoken to the 1st instructor and just tried to give me that lesson again, one was good but horse was lame so only lasted a little bit. Then I decided to move - to get my horse of working livery and so that she wasn't taught by the isntructor I'd disagreed with - I really wasn't happy with her way of teaching.

Moved to 3rd yard, great yard and got an old instructor from 1st yard out to see me a few weeks ago. Lesson went ok although he did tell me to polish the saddle in canter which was a bit worrying. Tried to book with him again as he knew my horse before I did and I've been having group lessons with him for about a year and a week after the phone call he still hadn't responded. It seems to be very difficult for me to get lessons but I'm not giving up. There's a rider for a dressage competitor who gives lessons and is a friend of the YO's son so I'm going to try him next.

Lessons give me something to focus on in my schooling, I know what my faults are but lessons seem to give me the impetus to keep going, I love hacking too but want to ride my horse as best as I can so will keep trying to find an instructor who welcomes questions, teaches constructively and returns calls !

[JOJOBA]

I think lessons are important but only if you enjoy them.
I dont have lessons on my own horse any more - mainly because he drives me mad and I get off wanting to strangle him, so where's the fun in that? I have lessons on other horses, and then translate that through to my schooling of my own horse. It also took me several attempts to find an instructor I liked. The first one I got on with left (but is still trying to buy my horse off me! :p), so did the second one, the third one who I had for ages eventually got on my nerves, I didnt agree with his teaching methods so I had a bit of a paddy one day and pointedly quit. :rolleyes: Recently Ive been having lessons with our YO, usually on her horse or one of the livery horses. Ive really enjoyed this and so booked a lesson with her on my own horse. Disaster. Couldnt see in the lesson due to the tears welling up in my eyes! (Im a wuss).
So I didnt enjoy lessons on my horse so I dont do it. I dotn enjoy hacking, so I dont do it (someone else hacks my horse for me). I dont really enjoy jumping much and my horse cant jump anyway, so if I want to jump, I borrow my old pony. Taken him x-country a few times :), wouldnt dream of it on my own.

So, in summary :p, although I think it's important to have some lessons at least, if you dont enjoy them then mix and match and move around until you do. Ride different horses, do different things, if possible try different instructors until you find someone you like (although if youre tempremantal like me that may be hard!). We ride to have fun and enjoyment, and as long as you can ride well enough to keep you and your pony happy and safe then thats fine. If you dont want to be an olympic dressage rider then fine too (I want to be one :D).

xxx

[hApPiNeSs]

i see your point

anyway i have decided to change schools instead of give up. its worth a try

[cvb]

there is ONE thing that I think I feel about more strongly than people having lessons - and thats what Jojoba has said.

The one thing that really REALLY annoys me is when people go along willing to learn with an open mind - and get a rubbish lesson :mad:

So when I say I think you should keep up with "lessons" - I should be absolutely clear that I am talking about a positive and supportive enviroment where you can practise and maintain the skills you need.

There is something that happens with learning where you feel like you are not progressing - like a "plateau". In fact you are consolidating your skills before you move on. But at the time it is often frustrating.

My initial read of your post was that you might be on one of those "level" stages before you move on. But reading it again I have more doubts - bad mouthing your horse isn't exactly a positive supportve thing to do ! (even if intended in jest - she's laughing AT you and your horse not WITH you :mad: Gentle teasing is ONLY ok if the person being teased realises its teasing and can cope with it. Can't comment on your instructors intentions - but you certainly didn't FEEL that it was meant in jest/teasing !)

But a really good test will be having a lesson somewhere else :)

DO let us know how you go

(and I hope I'm forgiven ?? )

[Yann]

I'd have to differ here. If all you want to do is pootle round the countryside then lessons aren't essential once you have a decent grasp of the basics.

What is important though is to have an experienced eye to check now and again that you haven't developed a habit such as leaning to one side that's going to be detrimental to your horse. If that's in a lesson so be it.

[cvb]

I'd have to differ here. If all you want to do is pootle round the countryside then lessons aren't essential once you have a decent grasp of the basics.

What is important though is to have an experienced eye to check now and again that you haven't developed a habit such as leaning to one side that's going to be detrimental to your horse. If that's in a lesson so be it.

Vive la difference n all that...

The dilemma I always have is the number of people you see who are in happy ignorance not realising e.g. that they have developed a habit such as leaning to one side...

(Cycle of learning -

Unconscious Incompetence - I don't know that I don't know something
Conscious Incompetence - I am aware I don't know something
Conscious Competence - I am aware and I can do it
Unconscious Competence - I do it without even realising it)

I guess what I would really advise is that people have a coach or mentor who does what Yann says and acts as "an experienced eye to check now and again ". This may result in needing a session to work on something, or it may not.

Or your own goals and targets may change and generate the need for lessons.

And so on.

I just want horse and rider to be safe and happy :D

[Yann]

Vive la difference n all that...

Absolutely;)

I don't think I'm alone in the fact that I went through a stage where I stopped enjoying lessons and decided to pack them in and just enjoy having a horse to ride.

I have however been having lessons with Rio weekly for the last 18 months, but that's because I find them enjoyable and satisfying. If that changed for some reason though then I would probably wouldn't bother. I'm firmly stuck at the conciously incompetent stage and likely to remain so:)

[ali cat]

i agree with yann on this one----have lessons if you want them-can afford them-and enjoy them


if any of the three above points don't apply then don't have lessons

you can improve your riding while hacking if you wish


as long as you are you don't do anything to hurt your horse while riding -and as long as you ahve control on roads etc that's ok by me!!


i had lessons when younger-now 48--and hated them--so when i bought ted i decided he was for my enjoyment(and his own) and i would not do anything i didn't really want to- 2 years later we're still fine


ali

[hApPiNeSs]

cvb - was u talking about me when u said i was bad-mouthing my horse? because i wasnt...

sorry, im getting confuzzled here...

have booked a lesson at goonbell for saturday! :)

[JOJOBA]

I think cvb was suggesting the instructor shouldnt have been bad mouthing your horse, not you :p

xxx

[cvb]

absolutely definitely about the instructor !

You said plus my instructer met happster and was very rude, saying she was ridiculusy small and scruffy (she only puts me on the 16hh+ beasts)

And I just think thats negative and unsupportive.

I once had an instructor tell me that the best thing for my pony was "lead between the ears" :mad: I was about 12 at the time - luckily I'm a bolshie git and it just made me more determined to prove her wrong.

[hApPiNeSs]

ooooooooooooooh. yeah, well she was always a bit of a snob!

its my lesson tomorrow! wish me luck! :D

[Wobblydeb]

"Luck"!!!! :D

[Angiebabe]

Go find yourself a new instructor/riding school. Ther's no point at all in having lessons if you are losing confidence and getting fed up. And no way should they be making disparaging remarks about your baby. Lessons are great but only if you enjoy them and learn something.

[hApPiNeSs]

cant go to goonbell nay more because the times for my group dont fit in...


HOWEVER am tres excited because i am taking happy to cornish riding holidays in 2 weeks and am going to get some help with teaching her to jump

yey!

ps - my lesson at goonbell went great. i did a xcountry jump for the first time! was so great!

[AppleJacks1988]

i gave up lessons and i own two horses... i was so misrable. angry and really really really moody. i didnt like my trainers all that much. try finding a new one?? but i plan to take them again and i get a lot of advice from friends and here and im doing just fine i watch lots of videos and read a lot and expermint and im doing just fine. but once in awhile its good to get a lesson or two just to make sure your up on things. just my opion.

[Ella2004]

I dont think that you necessarly need lessons, i hav'nt had a lesson in 6years and all i have done is improved. By riding bare back has improved my position over the years greatly and by having my own pony and going to diffrent events we have come on leaps and bounds. My friend gave me a small lesson on helping me slow my pony down while jumping the other day and she said me position was great and neeed no improvement and all i had to improve on is steadying her down while jumping.

If your not happy with your lessons why pay money for something your not enjoying, or why change instructer and see how it goes.
But i dont think that your riding will get worse at all.

Good look in whatever you decide to do and let us know how you get on:)

[hApPiNeSs]

quite a while since i posted this!

im having fortnightly private lessons at chiverton riding centre, and am preparing to take my stages 1 +2 later this year :D

[Lindsayanne]

Here's my .02, find an instructor you LIKE, then do PRIVATE lessons. It might cost an arm and a leg, but if you do it just once or twice a month, the cost will be about the same and that hour or two of one-on-one instruction may benefit you more than a month of private lessons. Also, when you're in private lessons, you can be sure that you are always working at your level and being challenged.

Lessons are important, I think, I know people who have been riding for decades, having had little or no lessons, and are just dreadful.