Really pulley...

[Aaron]

Hi there i am new and i would like to ask for some peoples advice,
Basically i have a 16hh gelding who'm 9months ago i bought for Showjumping.
not much idea of his past as is from a dealer.
Basically after you have warmed up, i.e in trot and canter he does nothing but PULL an PULL and try to like run off with you which is annoying cos it makes you feel really silly cos it's like you're pulling really hard on him all the time, i cant really put any leg on him as he will just get worse.
He jumps great has a lovely jump.
I however can't register him Bsja til this problem is sorted as it's giving me sore arms LOL
also when jumping he leaps and dances about like a fanny, and gives you sore arms and you can never really get a stride unless u hold hold hold.
that seems the only way you can ride him!
Sorry for the essay!
ALL help appreciated greatly. Thanks.

Aaron. :)

[Aaron]

Ohhh just borrowed a PERFECT quote from another topic....
This brings Jack down to a tea....
hypersensitive to the leg, going dead in the mouth, and generally difficult to ride. Due to past riders obviously, he has always been like this and i don't really have any idea what to do about it!

[kedwards]

Sounds like my boy when I got him. My solution was to let go of the reins for awhile. I gave up the whole season, forgot about showing, and taught him to maintain a consistent tempo on a long rein and to respond to seat aids for down transitions. I reintroduced jumping with trot-fences, simple grids, and other exercises that made him think about maintaining a steady tempo on his own. I did lot of our initial jump work in trot, but when we did canter work, I circled him before the fences if he grabbed the bit, only sending him over when he stayed relaxed and maintained his tempo.

This got us to a point where I could safely take him around a simple XC course, easily do gallop-canter transitions, and ride from canter to walk all on a long rein. I did eventually have to start re-introducing the idea of accepting and yielding to more contact, but it was much easier to introduce this once he learned to stay relaxed and maintain a steady tempo.

[Elvengirl]

I second what Kedwards has said. I also rode a very aggressive TB who would tank me around a course like a freight train. I learned that pulling back and getting in fights got, well, my arms sore and that's about it :p

So, I just left the reins alone and worked on getting him used to me using my leg and seat and not fighting with his head. This is how you should ride any horse of course (leg TO hand), but with one like yours it makes it all the more complicated. Another important thing is don't be afraid of him moving forward, in fact, tell him to move forward off your leg and if he goes cantering off or whatever, sit it out and wait for him to decide that going around like a loon is a lot of work (not sure if that makes sense but it's the best I can give!) Remember it's all in the seat and leg, not hands.

[AnneS]

Hi,
I had this problem too and I am still working on to sort it out. I ride my YOs Arabian mare. As soon as we started trotting or cantering she just ran off. My natural reaction was to pull the reins. But this is what it makes worse. The horse feels pain in her mouth when I pull the reins and so she wants to run away from this.

I am learning not to pull when she runs. I learned half-halts and I am still working on having a seat independent from reins.
Maybe you can ask a friend to look at you when you ride or to give you instructions? The YO helped me very much with this and gives me lessons sometimes.

Have you checked his teeth by the way?

[ragdoll]

maybe a stronger bit might help, he might have more respect for something like a kimblewick. my boy doesn't pull as such, but he speeds up when trotting and I'm making real progress by putting him on a small circle or changing direction whenever he speeds up as pulling on the reins makes the situation much worse. he is starting to get the idea that sensible means he gets to go forwards and silly means go in silly small circles.

[Aaron]

Hmmm i think to put a stronger bit in would make him go really tense again-he was ridden in a dutch gag :eek: before and looked really tense in it.
I kinda need him for showjumping this season ARGH!

It'll be really hard to ride him from my leg as when previous tried he'll just tank of at flat out gallot, it's like he RELIES on you with you're reins!
It makes me feel such a rubbish rider because i was ALWAYS taught ride into you're hands etc, but you just can't ride my horse the 'politically correct' way, well i can't seem to! Thanks everyone for the help!

[Est]

Echo the others - until you've fixed this, you probably won't enjoy the showjumping much!
Half halts (every few strides if necessary) will re-educate him to understand that your legs don't always mean "go faster". From there, you can start asking him to work with impulsion (rather than speed), and to carry himself a little more as a result.
But you have to kick-start the process by using your legs to half halt - as long as you avoid using your legs on him, there's no way out of this situation!
Turns, circling and transitions will also give him a clue about what you're looking for, as these will all encourage his hind legs under him and lighten his forehand a little.
I would also recommend starting slow (walk, trot), and only building up to canter when you are seeing real progress.
With the jumping, if you feel you don't have time to re-start his jumping training from scratch with polework and building up from that, a useful method of calming them down and making a jump less exciting is to have a few small crosspoles on the three-quarter line and diagonal across the school. Make sure they're small enough to walk or trot over! Every so often, just turn him calmly over one - circle away if he starts to charge around. Popping the odd fence as part of a schooling sessions is normally quite effective at cooling some of the hysterical excitement!

[Kate F.]

Hi Aaron!

I've recently posted on this topic on my website - have a look at www.harmony-project.net under the Bridling and Bitting article, also the Curing Rushing article that follows on from it. There is an easy to follow guide there as to how to retrain him to the bit, which I think should help solve this problem quickly and effectively.

Good luck!

Kate

[UnsettledDust]

Ditto everything that has already been said! The teaching of riding a horse between hand and leg/seat is important no matter what discipline you do! How about having a few flatwork lessons with a dressage trainer?

[kedwards]

it's like he RELIES on you with you're reins!

Well, he probably does. I know my horse certainly did. He still does, if he get's running and I give him something to lean on. Once he's supporting himself on them, your hands are like his fifth leg. If you dropped the contact suddenly, he'd likely become quite unbalanced. It's easier to start slow and keep him carrying himself, then it is to try to get him off your hands once he's leaning. In the case of the latter, it's possible, but not without leg and seat. Pulling more with your hands will only give him more to lean on, while dropping the contact suddenly, without leg and seat aids, will unbalance him.

I like Est's suggestion about throwing a jump in now and again during flat work. I've done that too with my guy. It's especially helpful, because it would keep him from getting into "okay, now we're hurdling" mentality. Instead, he found that small jumps could be just blips in the course of his normal routine.

[casey]

I agree with everyone who said he has to learn to carry himself.
Dont worry about the BSJA yet. You'd rather go around in style, with half a chance then your beastie dragging you around i'm sure. ;) :)

[lazylurchers]

Hi Aaron

I also have a horse which finds a new gear when jumping!! :( The advise on here is great. Your horse has to learn to accept your leg - hard though it may seem! Lots of circling helps when he pings off and really helps to slow things down! Certainly worth concentrating on the flatwork for a while.

Also dont worry ;) Some days I feel like my horse is the only horse in the world I cant ride!

[hApPiNeSs]

If you want him to slow down, MEAN IT! :D

tell him once, if he pulls relase your reins. Pick them up and ask again, harder, if he pulls, release the reins.

If he's still being naughty ride a tiny circle to bring him back down a gear. Dont turn your schooling session into a constant fight - you are probably unconsioucly training him to pull. He will soon learn ;)

[shandy84]

I know it souns silly but I rode a horse exactly the same last weekend out for a hak as soon as he picked up any steam it was so much weight in yur arms half halting quite firmly every other stride got him listening and I didn't have to do it so much after he got the idea.

Can I also suggest you may be causing some of the problem if you 1) enjoy jumping or 2) are slightly nervy of your horses strength as this will tense you up personally i would not consider jumping until I had this sorted which wuill take time on the flat and groundworking to solve

[Aaron]

Thanks for everyones advice!!
nah i don't tense up or worry when riding all my ponies were speedy little buggers! lol
I do enjoy jumping but i don't over do it lol

[shandy84]

Aaron there is always some degree of rider error when these problems arise from simple excitement and tension to possibly haing an insecure seat, maybe look to yourself first then try and figure out what to do with your horse, after all no-one's perfect :D

[caggie]

heya...

just reading about half halting here...i kno wat it is but somebody describe 2 me exactly how 2 do it and how this helps the horse?

my horse is like aarons...hes a trotter and prefers 2 trot rather than canter nicely with rhythm and blance. his head goes straight up into the air when trotting...iv already expalined this in another thread so i wont again lol...

thanks 4 any help!!!

C

[shandy84]

With Shandy I tend to just squeeze the rein as if I was about to take a little pull on them and stop and she knows to slow down at this feeling I also talk to her she knows the word steady and generally aid in the right rhythm it will help - sorr if that's not very clear maybe someone else could clarify

[Zingy]

To half halt from weight/ leg aids, squeeze your thigh muscles slightly. This resists movement in your seat and holds the horse back slightly. Some horses respond really well to it and it can help them become more sensitive to weight aids and less reliant on reins.

[Aaron]

Aaron there is always some degree of rider error when these problems arise from simple excitement and tension to possibly haing an insecure seat, maybe look to yourself first then try and figure out what to do with your horse, after all no-one's perfect :D
Oh god theres a hell of alot of rider error! but i know for a fact i aint nervous lol, i am one of the worst riders in the world i was even trying to insinuate that i'm a good rider or that it's the horses fault.
People have told me how badly the horse is schooled and had been ridden in the past, i just need to sort this out and believe you me since i have joined here i have taken in every bit of advice

[Rosieee]

how about spending a bit of time lunging and training your horse to voice aids, once he is very responsive to these, longreining or riding in a simple bit and in essence re-mouthing him, to start with mainly relying on voice aids then introducing rein contact as an aid in addition to the voice aid (only works when the horse responds to the voice aid alone otherwise he will react in exactly the same way as before) so stopping his reliance on your reigns. This may sound like a lengthy process but if it goes well it shouldn't be and your horse should remain showjumping fit from the lunging. I have retrained a similar horse (also a showjumper) in this way and the issue was more or less sorted within a fortnight so it is well worth a go but make sure you change your riding style as well so the horse doesn't revert back to relying on the reigns because you are still riding him in this way. good luck it's annoying when a horse has the ability but other people's poor riding prevents you achieving. I think your right not to just use harsher and harsher bits as he will only become dead to all these eventually and you will end up with no bit options left and a horse with a truly dead mouth with the nerves destroyed.

[Jojo_82]

Hi Aaron,

I can sympathise here... the horse I rode for about 2yrs (and am hopefully getting on loan in the future) is very much like that. She's a fruit-loop and has obviously been hammered into her fences in the past. If you try to hold her up into the fence, she bounces about on the spot like a tart, then launches at breakneck speed out of your hands over the fence. She has a fantastic, bold jump, however, it was starting to get a bit unnerving!

Stronger bits were a NONO!! I don't like whacking stronger bits in a horses mouth just because I find them difficult (unless they were physically dangerous without one), I managed to convince Lady's nervy owner to let me take her out of her gag and put a snaffle and flash on, much better for a start.

Then after a good few lessons with a really good sj trainer, we started to get somewhere. I found I had to come to a compromise with Lady. The more I held or pulled, the worse she got... so we got her going forward into a more fluent rhythm (to the onlooker, and the rider it would look/feel pretty rapid!!), this way I found she started to relax sooo much more, her head would become lower, she would start jumping rounder and more carefully (rather than renching my arms out, then galloping and flattening over the jumps) and I could actually check and release her a little. Lots of work over jumps at a more forward pace (along with HEAPS of flawork, lunging, gridwork, jumping out of trot too) really helped.

I know every horse is different, and the above methods might not help your horse at all, but sometimes, holding the horse back or trying your damndest to make him slower/steady up etc, just won't work at all.

Good luck anyway, hope that makes sense, i'm very tired and all over the place at the mo!! :o

Jo x