Suber Pad

[Yann]

I know they're very popular under treeless saddles, and Heather Moffett is even making her saddle with panels made from the stuff, but they were originally invented to use under treed saddles.

I bought one a couple of months ago as I like the concept, they're basically a bean bag full of cork granules which goes between the saddle panels and the horse's back moulding to a perfect fit between the two. In theory a middling saddle fit can effectively be made into a perfect one every time, and changes in the shape of the horse through the seasons can be accomodated without having to alter the tree or flocking. The cork filling is also shock absorbing and absorbant.

I'm pleased to report that this is one of those rare bits of gear that does exactly what it says on the tin with apparently no unexpected drawbacks or problems. The pad is quite thick when you tack up, almost alarmingly so, but as soon as the weight of the rider is in the saddle it settles by about 50% as the granules are redistributed. You also lose remarkably little feel compared to a soft foam or fleece type pad as the granules lock together and so don't absorb much energy which is what feel is. The saddle also becomes very stable front to back and laterally.

I don't know whether it would do much good on a saddle that was too narrow, but it certainly works a treat with one that is slightly too wide or right. To a large degree what you seem to be getting is the best of both worlds, the support and weight distribution of a treed saddle and the perfect fit of a treeless every time. Well worth a look, and the bloke who makes them is a real gent:)

Details at www.davidahnequine.co.uk

[Bay Mare]

Although I've only used it once I have to say that I wouldn't buy one. I felt perched and unstable though it did settle down a bit as I was using it. I wasn't impressed with the lateral stability at all, I felt like I had a lot more 'side to side' movement.

I'd be interested to see what other people think as I seem to be in the minority from what I've read on other boards!

[Yann]

Was that under the SBS? I can't remember if you used any other pads / numnahs with it as well?

I know that when I've used it with the Fitform treeless it's made that a lot more stable too, so much so that I survived full speed swerves round trees in it with what turned out to be a very loose girth:D

[lexi]

I think they're brill too, and definitely make the saddle more stable. I always use mine wet though, and put a bit of shelf liner between the saddle and suber as the sbs hasn't really got anything to 'dig in' to the cork, and mine has a smooth leather underneath.

I can mount from the ground with mine, and like Yann says, have found no drawbacks so far. I can tell Madame appreciates the extra comfort too. A big and unreserved 'thumbs up' from me!

[NuttyMare]

Glad to hear you like it :D Must be good for horses bulking up then?

[Yann]

Yes definitely, it's not directly related to the pad but Rio has gone from wide to extra wide in the last month whilst we've been using it and fits her saddle once more:)

[NuttyMare]

I get a feeling I'll be nabbing myself one :p

[~Perdita.M~]

Yann, do you have any pics of it under your fitform? I bought one for sham as a going away present, didn't get a chance to check it myself before he went.Charlotte says it slips alot, and feels like its pressing down on the withers and lifting the saddle at the back. I asked for pics and she sent some today, and it looks blooming awful! Pad doesn't even protude from the back of the saddle, so I guess its just too small, and where its underneath the saddle at the back as opposed to surrounding it, its lifting it up. Typical, teach me not to check these things myself first. Dont know what to do with the silly thing now :rolleyes: I'll see if I can put the pics on she sent, any advice please? :o And if it is indeed much too small, as I guess it is, and ideas on to what else could go underneath with the normal fitform numnah?


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v294/fenellamaxwell/backview.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v294/fenellamaxwell/frontview.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v294/fenellamaxwell/sideview.jpg

[Yann]

I don't have any pics of it with my Fitform, but I assume your pad and saddle are roughly the same size as mine anyway. If there's a bit of overhang at the back it doesn't really matter as very little weight at all is being transferred by the time you get to the back of the saddle, try sliding your hand under. The pad will distribute the weight over a wider area all the same, but only in the area under the rider when there isn't a tree. I don't think the pad is designed to offer wither clearance, I just give it a little tug to lift it slightly when I get on.

One thing that might be worth trying is to thoroughly soak it in a bucket of water for a little while and let it drain off overnight. The pad does work at its best when damp, and dampening the surface before use makes it more grippy too. How long was it ridden in? It does take a few minutes for everything to settle down and you do need to girth up more once this has been done. Rio does have quite a bit of shape for the pad to mould to, if Sham is a bit round it won't help matters:)

If you can't get on with it then a prolite pad between the sheepskin and the saddle works well too, but does give more of a perched feel (or did me anyway).

[The Original Crazywoman]

Perdita M - I bought a Suber Pad for my Freeform saddle via Goldfinch - they asked David Ahn to make one specifically for this saddle. Mine is plenty long enough to protrude at the front and the back of the saddle, and is great. It doesn't have side flaps though, and I have been using it in conjunction with a Polypad.

However, I've just received a conventional suber pad with the side flaps direct from David - haven't yet tried it, but he assured me it would be long enough to use under my Freeform.

I'm sure if you wanted to sell on your Suber Pad there would be lots of people interested and you would get a good price. I nearly gave up with my Freeform at one point, and lots of people wanted to buy the suber pad when I was thinking of getting rid of it!

[Pink's lady]

Ah, this is a perfectly timed thread :D Was just searching through the threads for suber before I put up my on. And low and behold....... :D

Anyways, I'm swithering between a Suber pad and Korrector (flair type, which I can get of ebay). I much prefere the idea of the suber, but the limiting factor is - how much (roughly) are they?

I could get and almost new Korrector of ebay for under £50, but no-one ever sells a suber (probably because they're better :rolleyes: )

The other reason I'm interested in a Korrector is that it will even out the unbalance in Pink's wintec saddle (when it's wide enough, it's balanced too low at the front).Can the suber pad help even out the balance? It's not hugly tipped because she's so fat at the moment, but it makes jumping difficult as she lands deep.

I'm not willing to buy her a new saddle AGAIN (she's too fat for her Maxam that fits lovely when she's skinny :rolleyes: ) and I can keep it (Korrector or Suber) for when I eventullaly get my own horse.

Once I have a rough idea of price, I can make desisions ;)

[Yann]

They're £65 including p&p.

I initially bought mine to make up the difference between a narrower horse and wider saddle, and you do have a fair amount of scope to use it to that way. They also allow the horse to muscle up easily. I've not used a Korrector myself but have heard a few comments about them being fiddly to adjust and leaking. The beauty of the Suber pad is that it's self adjusting, give or take a bit of extra plumping.

[cvb]

Yann

I had a question which you may be able to ask. I had a loan horse with a Stubben saddle. A back person told me that these saddles (the cheaper stubbens) had cork in them to make them cheaper and lighter - and that the cork did not absorb shock very well so it was quite common to get sore backs with them (the horse's back that is).

But I figure thats going to be chunks of cork not granules ?? Do you know ? Is it the dampness that helps with this ? or the fact they flow ?

I'm not about to get one purely as my saddle is too narrow, so it wouldn't help :(

So its pure curiosity...

[Yann]

I can only think it would be solid cork, if it was in there to reduce weight, in place of heavier wood? Not sure where, or how, that would affect the give in the panels, unless it was to save on flocking somehow :confused:

The granules in the pad initially flow and then lock together under load, but there does still seem to be a certain amount of give and sponginess in the structure. When you get off and take the saddle off the pad will tend to keep its shape pretty much until you give it a shake to loosen everything off again.

Using it damp bulks it up slightly and increases the squishyness, the granules swell up a bit and become less free flowing. I would guess this also improves the shock absorption too.

[Pink's lady]

Thats less than I expected them to cost. Everything equestrian seems to be sooooo expensive - mention 'horse' and the price is doubled..

But at £65, thats affordable. Will definitly be having a serious thing about it.

[cvb]

Yann - yes, the Stubben cork thing means less flocking, rather than less "tree"

And solid cork disnae have much give to it... yes its compressible (like in a bottle neck), but that doesn't mean it absorbs concussion in the way a horse needs.

I was just curious that if you got the granules packed into place, it might start behaving more like a solid piece of cork, which then might lead to problems....

[Yann]

Ah, I follow now. Wood instead of flocking...hmmm.

No, even when the pad is being compressed it doesn't go 'solid':)

[princesaysneigh]

If the saddle fits just right (is not too wide) will the addition of the pad make it too narrow?

[Yann]

It doesn't seem to, because the pad isn't a fixed thickness you don't end up with pressure points in the same way, it just moulds to the shape of the gap between the saddle and the horse.

[princesaysneigh]

Thanks! Is there a website? (do you get paid for the advertising? ;) )

[SarahZ]

just wondering if anyone knows if he has an email address? :)

[entreat]

Ooh - yeah.. these look great! gimme gimme gimme (oh no... I thought moving to the middle of no-where would stop all the spending... I forgot about mail-order!! :( :p :D )

[Yann]

He doesn't have an email address, all orders are taken by phone, and you'd need to post a cheque to him - not ideal if you're 'down under':)

[Pink's lady]

Just bought a Suber pad and love it :D

It looked a bit too thick and chunky when I first tried it on and the saddler (had her out yesterday) didn't like the look of it at all for that reason. BUt when I rode Pink in it for a while, what a difference. It bedded down well and corrected the inbalance of the saddle (stupid wintec design fault :rolleyes: ) and, most importantly, IT DIDN'T SLIP :D Woohoo :D

I've fallen of Pink so many times because her saddle has slid off and it's become a major issue. But with the pad, it stayed totally central, even in canter (when it slips the worst). I'm really pleased with it.

All I have to do now is buy a longer girth :rolleyes: (she's in a just-long-enough girth to help prevent slipping)

[Tiber]

Could this help with my problem?

My pony has a slightly wonky back (lack of muscle under one side of the saddle at the back), and this makes her saddle slip. It doesn't matter how much I try to keep it straight, it slips. I got her a new saddle (a wintec cair one) which has made it a bit better and allowed her to muscle up a bit, but now the saddle slips in both directions!

I frequently have to get off and re-settle the saddle while I am riding, and I'm sure it is making her uncomfortable as she is a bit better bareback. I'm trying to progress with her training and it isn't helping!

Do you think the Suber pad would help? Is it worth the money?

Does anyone in the Bedford area have one that I could have a look at? ;)

[Yann]

They do help a lot with saddle stability, I can ride with a relatively loose girth and it doesn't budge. I would imagine it would help with a slightly uneven horse too as the contents of the pad could be made to bed more on one side than the other and keep your seat level.

Even though the pad can make up for a so so saddle fit I'd still look to get yours checked out - if you're getting an epidemic of slipping and your horse is going better bareback then it does sound like something isn't right.

I think it's worth the money personally, as my horse tends to change shape through the year and the pad will mean that I can be sure she's not uncomfortable as a result.

[tasha]

Perdita - I would be v. interested if you decided to sell yours!

[Tiber]

Me too! Me too! If you decide to sell...

[~Perdita.M~]

Have pmed both of you :)

[Janette]

How visible are the Suber pads? I want to use one under my leather saddle which now fits again (thankgoodness) but will be showing with it. Although I don't suppose it should make that much difference...............

[Yann]

Here are a couple with it in, though not specifically of it. Bear in mind that the pad squishes down a fair bit once the rider is on board. It's also available with built in flaps as with a regular numnah to make it look even less noticeable and keep the saddle clean:)

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y177/YMatthews/riosaddlepad1.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y177/YMatthews/riosaddlepad2.jpg

[Janette]

Looks very suitable. I think I'll ring and ask if they do them in black.......

[Yann]

Just to add that Rio has just had her 6 monthly physio check and her saddle area was completely free of any soreness or tension, this the day after a 5 hour picnic ride. It definitely works:)

[Drummers mum]

Dooes it help give your fitform a bit more twist? Just something I was pondering!

[Yann]

Maybe a little, but only in terms of it dropping away more under the thigh where the pad ends, it doesn't really make the seat area any less flat if the horse is:)

[tasha]

Just tried the Suber pad I bought from Perdita. Initial thoughts are WOW! I loved it! Feel-wise it gave my SBS more of a twist and my legs were wrapped around Kal more. I also had no loss of 'feel' through the seat either.

But the best bit - I now have a long striding dressage horse!! Kal broke into an extended trot which then turned into a canter - I was going to bring her back when I realised something - my horse has a bum, and she was using it! No lovely outline or anything but the canter was much more uphill than I have ever felt before (actually exclaimed out loud at this!!).

So I think it is worth every penny, whether you are paying full price or can possibly find one second-hand, like me! The only critiscm I would have is that it seemed to push on Kal's withers a bit, but a) I dont think I pulled it up enough at the start, b) Flexion SBS saddles have this problem anyway and c) Heather is designing a pad especially for the SBS which I will probably invest in when it comes out.

This is just after one ride, so it could just be a 'honeymoon period' but so far, so very very good!

[~Perdita.M~]

Oh brilliant, glad it seems good so far! :D

[Yann]

Good to hear it:) I'm surprised it made so much difference under the SBS though :confused: I'm sure what you got is what you'll continue to get though.
It doesn't really sit off the wither under a treed saddle either, but I don't think you end up with much pressure there, it certainly hasn't been causing us any problems anyway and it's had lots of use here so far:)

[tasha]

I'm surprised it made so much difference under the SBS though

Its probably to do with the fact that Kal literally no muscle over her withers and I was just using a thin HiWither numnah before. So the effect Im getting now is what I should have got when I first bought the SBS! Glad to hear that the wither pressure shouldn't be too much of an issue. It wasnt as bad as it was with a standard numnah so hopefully it wont be a problem.

Giving it a go in the school tonight - will report back later!

[Yann]

It certainly isn't for us, I checked a couple of times out today and could easily get my fingers under it. That is under a tree though, I don't know how much difference the lack of structure would make, though it seems plenty of people on the EE site have been using them without any problem. Nice to hear it's working for you, it certainly spreads pressure well and enables muscle to build if my experiences with it are anything to go by.

[Tiber]

Heather is designing a pad especially for the SBS which I will probably invest in when it comes out.

If you do decide to get the new one, and want to sell this one, let me know! :D :D :D :D :D

[Foxfold]

I've just bought a Fhoenix FA Suberpanel GP saddle from Heather, mainly because I've heard such good things about it.
I'm hoping that it will be the last saddle I'll buy for quite a while, as my OH thinks I'm totally nuts to buy an 'accessory' for a horse that costs more than the horse :eek:
When it comes and I've ridden in it for a while, I'll post and give a 'revue'