Bum in the saddle?

[tasha]

Will you be marked down at local level Prelim dressage for cantering in jumping position?

[virtuallyhorses]

Yes, you will be marked down but given how few marks there are for the rider it theoretically it won't make that much difference to the total.

However... the judge looks at the overall picture in every movement - if they see you cantering in forward seat, every canter movement will be marked down and every transition (up or down) plus of course the quality of your trot after such a canter will potentially be marked down as you adjust from forward seat to trotting. It's really not going to be a good move... sorry

[tasha]

Thanks! Was just wondering as Ive been having some success with Kal canter using the forward seat. Im planning to eventually put more and more weight in the saddle etc but just wondered whether in the meantime if it was viable to enter a few prelim comps or not.

[Tangle]

Now I'm a little confused! My understanding that was in "normal" dressage comps marks are awarded for the horse's performance - the rider's performance only really featured in the collective marks :confused:. I might well have got the wrong idea though - has been known on more occasions than I care to mention :o

On the other hand - would you loose a huge amount by starting to take her out, even if you do get marked down? The pair of you would still be gaining experience and you'll get feedback on other areas you need to work on. I'd probably want to find out just how "frowned upon" it was before I tried it, though ;)

[augermoon]

After breaking my back 2 years ago, I had to get back into riding very slowly and for a long time couldn't canter at all. But everything else was reasonable and I wanted to get out and do some Prelim tests. So I just did them but trotted the canter work. I just had a word with the judge as I entered the ring and found that they were all very understanding. Means you will lose marks (mine varied between judges being very generous and giving me 5's and 6's despite not cantering and others giving me 0 - which is only fair really.) But I still got placed on a couple of occasions as my other marks made up for the low ones.

Why not try that first and see how you get on? At least that way you can get out and have a go??

[IrisSilverMoon]

Now I'm a little confused! My understanding that was in "normal" dressage comps marks are awarded for the horse's performance - the rider's performance only really featured in the collective marks :confused:. I might well have got the wrong idea though - has been known on more occasions than I care to mention :o

On the other hand - would you loose a huge amount by starting to take her out, even if you do get marked down? The pair of you would still be gaining experience and you'll get feedback on other areas you need to work on. I'd probably want to find out just how "frowned upon" it was before I tried it, though ;)


yes the horse is the one being judged in dressage, but there are rules the rider has to follow as well...one of them being that all canter work is to be done sitting. I would imagine that you would get errors in your test results for this.

definately not a good idea.

do you guys have any tests that are specifically walk/trot? they have those for the US tests sort of as an introduction of young horses and newer riders to dressage.

[No_Angel]

If it doesnt matter if you got marked down or not on your first outing you could just have a go and see :) If you went out and did it and got marked down youll know for next time and practice your canter before you go out again.

[tasha]

Im going to a very informal dressage on Sunday, doing a 'home-made' test (one the RC made up!) which Im quite happy to keep my bum in the air for, as it is so informal. But walk/trot tests seem to be hard to come by round here, and Im not sure about skipping the canter section of normal tests - to be honest Ive never seen it done round here and I know people will tell me to just do it anyway.

Think Ill stick with my RC "Have A Go" Dressage comps until I eventually sort her canter - although 4.5 years on and its still not sorted :(

[Ginger Thing]

If its only local prelim I wouldn't worry. I have struggled with my back and hips and my position is never going to be 100%, so I do canter in a lighter seat (not quite a forward seat but bum slightly out of the saddle) and when you've got a show jacket on it doesn't look too bad! Just don't lean forward like you're going xc!

Don't listen to people telling you it's not the done thing - I will never ever compete if I wait til I can sit canter painlessly, so I just get out and do it! Honestly, at unaffiliated prelim it's very casual - when I got carted bucking out of the ring once at RC show, the judge very kindly said come back in and do the test again! Now, that's probably not in the rules either, but they are human! They want to encourage people to have a go, not put them off. I have decided not to worry about it any more, just to enjoy my horse and have fun, and it's only one bit to get marked down on - if the rest of the test is accurate and she goes well, you may find you do quite well. After all, you pay your money to do the test, if you choose to trot all the canter work and get marked down for it, its your choice (as I would if the ground was very hard for instance, but I would still be interested in my marks and comments for the other movements).

I have never actually had it commented on either, come to think of it, but I have had comments about wrong leads or breaking the canter - when I ride the way its comfortable for me, I ride the canter better, so we get better marks for it anyway. We get correct lead and don't break the canter - surely that's worth more than a few collective marks?

Go on, do it!

[virtuallyhorses]

Yes, you are quite correct that there is only one 'riders mark' that's why I put the two different comments.

Having worked as a judges writer I can tell you that 'theory' and practice are quite different from how I imagined dressage was judged -overall appearance during each movement is very important. A very 'still' competent looking rider can make a lot of difference to how the horse appears and vice-versa so although the judge is primarily looking at how the horse performs the movements - how the rider rides is also part of that mark - if you get what I mean :) It can even depend on how the judge is feeling on the day, how 'snobby' they are etc . You might strike a judge who is so horrified at a rider doing dressage in forward seat that they give you low marks regardless of how well the horse does.

As others say, if you just want the experience go for it - just don't pick up your test marks at the end of the day.

[Tangle]

VH & ISM, thanks for the clarification. Although at the moment I'd be in the walk/trot school, regardless of what the test sheet shows :o:p One day..... :D

[tasha]

Nice to hear that not everyone uses 3rd gear!

Ill see how tomorrow goes and then decide. The thing is canter does hot her up in the other paces despite making her step through better, so it might be better to just trot the canter section or only enter walk/trot tests for a while.