Backing questions

[Hollymead]

Hi guys. Holly seems to be progressing quickly now with her breaking in, and the rider is now sitting astride and upright, with a light rein contact. The rider is asking Holly to halt and turn with light rein and seat aids and walk on again with a very light leg aid. I am still on the ground, walking next to her and holding a lead-rope, but I'm not influencing her unless she spooks.
First question - from the moment the rider started taking a contact (very light) Holly has been stretching down into it and carrying her head and neck almost in a novice outline. Obviously I'm not going to dissuade her from this, but I'm gob-smacked that she's done it on her own. Is this normal?
Second question - Holly responds very nicely to the rein aids, but spooks or tenses up nearly every time the rider uses the leg aid to walk on. When long-reining she was used to things slapping her sides and moving about, I've also lunged her with the stirrups down, so it's not the movement that's bothering her. We haven't worked with the leg aids for very long, is it just greeness, and something that will come with time? Or do I or the rider need to do anything to ease her unease?
Thanks in advance for your answers! :)

[Perfect Pony]

hi, well firstly well done for getting this far and also well done for asking for advice as a lot of people dont and get the breaking horribly wrong!!!
I have broken in a few of my horses and it is very common for them to accept the bit and work in an outline, some do it more than others, if your rider can keep your contact light and she works in an outline then thats fantastic as she will build up the correct muscles and is learning to accept that way to work rather than teaching her that later on!
She will do this as part of the mouthing as she will have a sensitive mouth and sides so everything is new and scarey!!!
Make sure your rider is confident with Holly and is not worried at what she will do as this will transfer through to her, iv always found that once the horse is accepting you to be on their back start working slowly and find something that she likes and use that to develop her confidence, you say you walk with her and stand by her side, you could develop that so she is on the lunge and you start by her side with the rider on and gradually move away fom her so she is walking around, not in a small circle though and gradually so that you are on the end of the lunge rope, this is great for breaking as there is more than one person in control, also putting poles down will develop balance and keep Holly interested, even when walking over them, developing into slalems so that she can get used to the riders leg and hand contact and correct aids early on!!! Sorry this is a bit long winded, keep me informed on how she goes, id love to know her progress, hope this helps!!!
If you have many more queries im no expert but have done it a fair few times and never had a horse fail on me so feel free to pm me!!!
:D
Good luck with Holly, you will be so proud when she starts trotting and cantering!!!
carla xxx

[shandy84]

Well done Holly and you :) I'm glad you got over not being able to sit up :)

Bramble worked into a light contact when she was first backed and still does some of the time, but she likes testing now so doesn't tend to keep it up. The only thing to be aware of is keeping sessions short or she could end up leaning on the riders hands too much.

With regard to the leg, is she voice command trained if so maybe making that the biggest aid and just a tiny tuch with a foot if she needs it if not I would consider training her to the voice a little more, Bramble didn't understand what putting the leg on meant until you put a voice command to it.

Sounds like she is going really well hope you're proud of her :)

[intouch]

We have a little mare that is similar, goes in a lovely novice outline, W/T/C and jumping 75cms very happily & easily - but put your legs on and she gets really stroppy and goes backwards if she can! My daughter rides her and I am just around if she needs me now, (Helen says if she ever sells Briar she will have to sell me too.) I'm nor sure what aids she does use, she just sort of chirrups at her, but if anyone has an answer, I'd love to hear it.

[wildponies]

Echo what Shandy said about voice aids, they work a treat and can be transferred from lungeing to riding and combined with leg aids. Eventually voice aids can be removed. They aren't used to having pressure exerted on their sides. Has Holy been handled a lot on the ground? When asking her to move over in the stable do you lean on her sides or give her a poke to make her move over? Just simple things like this will encourage them to move away from the pressure so leg aids, something pressing on their sides isn't that much of a new thing to them! Just a thought. Outline is not unusual especially as they're reaching down onto the bit, she may have it for a while and get bored of the bit and contact as she gets more used to it and adopt a bit more of a 'lazy' outline, (long and low) but then again she might naturally carry herself like that as soon as she has a bit in her mouth and it might stay there for ever and ever amen!

[Hollymead]

Cheers guys for your advice.
Holly responds very well to voice commands - when led, on the lunge, and when long-reined. I was getting the rider to make the leg aid as I asked Holly to move on, but she then either leapt about for a few seconds (nothing too horrendous, she didn't try to bolt, buck or spin round) or walked on, but was very strong and tense for a few strides until relaxing. To be honest we've only used leg aids a few times, so I won't start worrying until she's been given more of a chance to get used to it.
She also is very used to moving away from pressure on her side on the ground - she can do turn on the forehand, turn on the quarters and leg-yield in hand fine. Could it be that it's pressure on both sides simultaneously that she's reacting to?
Re the outline it's good to know that other horses do it from the start, although I will be on the lookout for her leaning on the rider's hands. What made it more impressive is that Holly tends to go head high - she has quite a lot of muscle under her neck.
shadow_dancer - the rider is very confident, she's got that wonderful bravery that comes with youth (she's 13) and her own pony is a lovable loon at the best of times!
Shandy84 - as soon as I got off her back, and became the leader, she's come on leaps and bounds. I think, in her mind, I'd vanished and she lost confidence. She could hear me, but it didn't seem to be enough. As soon as she's off the lead-rein/lunge, then I'll get back on board.

[galadriel]

What's the rider doing with her legs when she's not using a leg aid?

Keeping the leg always on and using a light squeeze is much less startling than going from "off" to "on."

[Hollymead]

That's a good point galadriel, hadn't thought of that. Do you mean she should keep her leg resting against Holly's side at all times, or actually wrap around her, like you'd do on a fully trained horse? I'm not sure what the rider has been doing, I've been keeping most of my attention on Holly - watching her tension levels, and keeping her attention.