Couple of questions!

[MadMumInKent]

Hi all,

Pumpkin's going wonderfully - no news is always good news, and the fact that I haven't posted for a while means I haven't been having any problems ;)

Just a couple of things though... I've developed a sudden fear of hacking, it makes me VERY uncomfortable. It doesn't help that the horses I go out with tend to play up a fair bit, and I start to panic that Pumpkin will do the same (he never has, he's steady as a rock generally). I absolutely love schooling him, but I really do have to keep in mind that, coming from a riding school, he really needs a break and he must feel like he's been grounded at the moment! Its been a couple of weeks since I last went out on a hack :eek: Any ideas to get over my silly fears?

Second question... When I school Pumpkin, he really is a bit of a plod, but I can get an active walk going when I ask for it. However, today, bearing in mind the above fear, I decided to take him for a very short walk out of the yard and down the side of the field. (Sang all the way, but still nervous as anything!). Anyway, he was really striding out. When he's walking properly, the movement is very obvious. He has a BIG movement, which causes my seat not just to wiggle around side to side, but to go forward and backwards too! Its lovely, though it took some getting used to :) Anyway, my point (finally) is how can I get this walk going in the school? When I ask him to spark up his plod in the school, I get a faster walk, but not the same striding out that I get when he's out and about. Any ideas? I do have lessons on him, but we've had other issues to sort out, (steering - now got a fulmer, WHAT a difference!!), cutting corners - now much better etc etc. I really want him to stride out properly as he really needs to build some muscle on his back end.
Any help much appreciated, Pumpkin says hello and thanks for helping mum out ;)

http://www.tammaro.co.uk/pumpkinnov.jpg

[chickflick1066]

Sorry Jo, can't help with the useful part:rolleyes:

Just wanted to say, Pumpkin is great, I'm a huge fan :D

[Tangle]

Glad to see you back, and glad to hear things are going well with Pumpkin :)

Re. the hacking - are there any sensible horses you can find to hack out with? Alternatively, is there anyone you can persuade to walk out with you on foot? We're just trying to get our mare hacking out (came from a very Dressage background, so we wonder if she's ever been ridden out of the school before :() and having someone on the ground is great as a physcological saftey net ;)

For getting him striding in the school, are you 110% certain that you aren't doing anything different depending on where you're riding? Failing that, how do you try and encourage him to walk on?

(btw, that picture just made me :D)

[MadMumInKent]

Awww thanks :) He's the favourite on the yard, everyone loves him, though he looks like a bit of a donkey in that picture I posted ;) He saw one of his mates coming back in from a hack and he was all perky so I got the camera out :D
I had my 7 yr old and my 9 yr old on him last week (not together!) - that's how much I trust him :)

[Pink's lady]

Awwww, he's just so cute:D

Firstly - nervous hacking - can you find someone to go out with you who isn't silly? Or even just someone on foot. But ultimatly, the only thing that's going to improve your confidence is practise. You will have to force yourself to go out. Just keep it short and sweet (a 5 min trip) and do it regularly. Try to go out after every ride in the school. Maybe ask your instructor to go with you. Never under-estimate the power a confident person with you has. Over time it'll become less scary and you'll be able to go further.

As for dawdleing in the school - that hard to get because only him WANTING to will allow him to swing through his back. And if he's borded and fed up, he'll never give it.

So maybe that could be your key to hacking out more - that Pumpkin needs it, even if you don't want to. If your wanting to build up his quarters then, as you said, that swinging walk is an excellent way of doing it. And so you HAVE to go out hacking. Think how much he enjoys it - it'll be an incentive for you to go out.;)

[MadMumInKent]

Thanks Tangle :) My YO has offered to come out on foot with me, but she has so much to do I feel a bit bad using up her time. She offered to come out this morning but then I got all courageous and went on my own, as I said. Sensible horses... well, there's Ollie, a 17hh thoroughbredy thing who has lately decided its better to gallop home :eek: Then there's Jazz who's very highly strung and tends to have a bit of attitude at times. Ace is a sweetie, but last time we were behind him he bucked and nearly hit Pumpkin in the face :eek: And then there's the new boy on the block, Dru, who is a stunning Andalusian. Not sure what he's like as I haven't been out with him before. I might ask his owner if I can join her one day for a short hack, see what its like :) Its only a small yard, but I love it there and I am learning so much, watching how everyone copes with there different problems.

The only thing I do different from being in the school is I tense up :rolleyes: He just really perks up when he's out, its like he wakes up and realises that life CAN be interesting (when I let him out) :rolleyes: ;) I get him walking on in the school by squeezes, tongue clicks (he responds really well to those), and a light tap with the whip if he ignores me, which is rare these days.

Pinks' Lady - You may be right... I must get over this stupid fear. I tend to go out feeling all tense, until we're on the way home, which is when I relax and start to enjoy it. I shall try again tomorrow... just 5 minutes mind!!! ;) Anyone know any good songs? ;)

[CMR]

First of all, Pumpkin is very cute. :D
To get him to walk like he does when he's on a trail ride, I'd push with my legs and hold back with my hands. It's hard to really explain this, but this is how you get a horse to collect, and lengthen. You want to really push him up into the bridle with your legs. While you don't want to get much faster at all, you want that feeling you had while on the trail ride.

[Luxie]

MMIK - lovely to hear from you again, and glad things are going well with Pumpkin (lovely picture!).

Thing one: nearly all horses have a bit more zip to them when they're out and about as opposed to being in the school; I think it takes time to be able to develop the same energy and impulsion in a schooling situation. Sorry, that's not much help, is it ...

Thing two: you say hacking makes you worried in case he imitates the sillier companions who are out with you - how is it going out on your own? I'm often happier by myself, as I know my horse is as sensible and trustworthy as they come (which sounds like Pumpkin too), and we just enjoy ourselves together without having to worry about what anyone else may be doing.

[MadMumInKent]

Hi Luxie :) How are things with you?

Pumpkin is a big wuss, he gets very nervous going out on his own. Today we went along the side of the orchard, which is parellel to the school, he could see the yard and the fields the whole time, and he was on his toes the whole time. He has come on really well, but still lacks confidence with the unfamiliar. In time, I am hoping he'll learn to trust me, but all the time he picks up on my hacking nerves, that won't happen. It appears I'm a big wuss too, we make a great pair ;) One of us will have to face our fears - either him regarding solo hacking, or me regarding group hacking :D

[MadMumInKent]

First of all, Pumpkin is very cute. :D
To get him to walk like he does when he's on a trail ride, I'd push with my legs and hold back with my hands. It's hard to really explain this, but this is how you get a horse to collect, and lengthen. You want to really push him up into the bridle with your legs. While you don't want to get much faster at all, you want that feeling you had while on the trail ride.

Thanks - I shall try this tomorrow. When my YO gives me lessons, she's always telling me to get him to collect in trot - possibly for the same reason... Still so much to learn :rolleyes:

[Tangle]

If you're sure you're more relaxed in the school than on hacks (which it sounds like you are ;)) then it does sound like its him. Do you think he's a little dead to the leg, especially given he was in a riding school?

One way to make him more sensitive to your leg is to only use as much as you want to (so if you want him to move off a nudge from your calf, never use more than this). Ask once. If he doesn't respond, then ask again (no more strongly) but reinforce with the crop with enough "intent" that he will move on. Sorry - this sounds like an invitation to beat the cr*p out of him, but it's really not. It might well be what you're already doing :)

The other would be something like clicker training. We once had a horse on load that was very lethargic. Once he'd learnt that forward = click/treat, he was much more enthuisiastic :p (If I was doing this again, I'd start with target training so that they learn you're asking something and when they do something correctly they get the click/treat).

Fingers crossed the Andalucian is a little more steady - doesn't sound ideal at the moment :rolleyes:. Could you come to a "trade" agreement with the YO? She'll walk out with you for 15 minutes and you'll help her out on the yard for the same time? I know Madam gets a lot of security from having someone she knows beside her - but her dependence is reducing quite quickly over time.

Not disagreeing with the logic of asking him to listen to a collecting aid, but I'd make it primarily from the seat rather than the hand ;)

Good luck :)

[nicolaj]

Glad to see things going so well!

To get Fatty more responsive have been doing canter work with him. Sounds a bit mad, but asking for canter and even if we get a few strides then trot, make him go forward then in trot, and this has really helped him learn to swing through his back and be nice and active in his trot.

I also find doing lots of trot/walk transitions tends to help with making the walk more active, kind of wakes up the horse, loads of rein changes, do a 20 metre circle then go large and then another in the middle of the school, all the time do something different so he doesn't just anticpate going round and round.

This just keeps him thinking 'oh what's mum doing next?' and I have found it does work, has taken time, but Fatty is really beginning to work well now, starting to 'outline' in walk & trot, not all the time, but does start to come 'round'.

Fatty does quite enjoy schooling now, he really wants to do what you ask him. Not so good on hacking, but again like you Mad Mum, it's ME!! I used to hack out loads round the village on my own, but now I don't, the 'what if'. What if actually never happens, but you reward yourself by staying home and not going out for a hack. Think will ask OH to walk out with me.

Keep going, it will work in the end, he is probably unfit but you are doing well by the sounds of it, this time next year he will be 110% better for you!

[Big Ears]

Rosie only does the really swinging walk when she is hacking out and generally when she is on the homeward stretch.

Could you lead him out in hand every day, for anything up to an hour or so, just take him in hand all the route you might go? So he knows where he is.

Hard as it is, it is better i think to hack out alone than be with horses who are going to be unreliable and may wind him up more. He is quite young, but if he is generally steady, he should get used to it - start riding him short distances then each day add 5 or 10 mnutes and extend and extend.

What he might do best is give him a good 2-3 hour hack to tire him out! When Rosie was a bit fizzy a week or so ago, I took her up a 2 mile hill.....as part of a three hour hack - she came back pleasantly tired and quiet.....

The not working in the school is just laziness, he is probably a bit bored with it all, which is why hacking him out more to freshen him up mentally and stimulate would also probably assist in the school - cos if he has been in a riding school and doing 3-4 hours a day with lots of riders, he has every reason to be a bit cheesed off with it, so he switches off mentally when he sees the arena and says oh no more of this....

Or do you have someone who is a more confident rider who could ride him out for you and YOU walk with him so you can observe it and it would give you confidence in him to see him do it?

[Luxie]

I would agree with Tangle about approaching your YO. If she's even actually offered to go with you, I really would take her up on it - it needn't be for a marathon excursion or anything!

Shame you're not a bit nearer us - my horse is such a calm and laid-back character people often ask me to go out with them as he's a good influence on more 'reactive' horses. I must admit I do sometimes do a bit of 'what iffing' and wonder if he'll pick up flightier ways from them, but so far it hasn't happened :)

Sadly I've currently got rather severe time constraints, and can only manage two or three times a week, but he takes that in his stride too!

Hope things go well today, both in the school and out :D :D Do let us know ...

[Peanut]

I haven't anything useful to add; but just want to say what a Pumpkin fan I am. Lucky he's not mine as I'd never get anything done - would just cuddle him all day long!

[pedantic]

Cant really add much other than try to keep him from getting bored, Polo is better in the school if he is interested, someone dumped some large road cones on the lane so I took them and use them down the center of the school to weave in and out, plus some poles to trot over, a small couple of jumps now and again, he works better as it keeps him interested and guessing a bit.

[momofsix]

He is so cute!
I can't help much with your problem. I have the opposite problem. With the cooler weather, I have been riding less and I can't get Sauvy or Abby to slow down. All they want to do is run, run, run. I wish I could borrow Pumpkin for a day and just plod along for once instead of trying to convince my lovely TBs that it is not race day.

[cazrider]

Hi MMIK:)

Its funny isn't it. I've heard of this happening so much, and its happened to me too. You buy a perfect horse, and then start getting nervous hacking. I don't think you know really what to be nervous of until then.

I agree with pink's lady, I'm afraid, you do just have to force yourself, as it really does get easier with time. It did work for me. I do know, that after a while I found I was getting ready to hack on my own and I wasn't feeling sick, or shaking. It does take a while, and i really understand where you're coming from, but you can overcome it. I've tried singing, which really does help, but looks a bit soft if you're with other people.:rolleyes: I'd also continue with hacking by yourself, even if its only round the orchard, then you can try the singing thing.

Anyone know any good songs?

There have been a few threads on this. I've been working on Christmas songs, as there is a small "do anything to a Christmas song" competition on the yard coming up, so i've been trying to find one which matches Sennie's walk and trot.;)

I'd also echo the others, someone on foot makes all the difference, or a quiet riding friend. At the moment your riding freinds don't sound ideal;) And i do know how difficult those are to find, as since my friend moved from our yard, i've had to hack mostly by myself.

[MadMumInKent]

Thanks for all the responses. I will perservere, when I get around to it ;) Just got back from the yard, but Pumpkin was alll unsettled as his routine wasn't quite right today - he had to wait in for the farrier, so hadn't had his morning munch on the grass. Its amazing how their routine is so important to them. It was also very windy, and I don't like going out in the wind as I don't know a horse who is not unsettled when its windy - yes, i know, excuses excuses ;) We did a bit in the school but were getting nowhere as Pumpkin really was feeling put out, we would have achieved nothing today so I left it.

Interesting comment from the farrier today - it appears Pumpkin has had laminitus in the past :( Will have to keep a close eye on him come the spring. He said it doesn't look like it was very bad at all, but still something to watch for. Chatting to my YO about it, and she said it could be a number of things that may have brought that on, not just too much grass, it could have been a stress thing too, and Pumpkin does get stressed and worried quite easily, so it could have been around the time he was moved from Germany to the UK.

Anyway, will let you know how I get on during the coming week :) Thanks for all the advice!

[Big Ears]

Pumpkin sounds a little bit like my Molly, she is very upset by any change to routine. she also was very quiet to begin with but once she felt more settled, she then become more neurotic if you see what i mean. working in a windy arena would be a no for her totally unless you wanted to take flying lessons.

If his laminitis is stress related, which it could be, then hopefully it will not re-occur, but just in case it isn't watch he isn't turned out on frosty grass as that can trigger it.

I am just hoping that now that he is getting a little more settled, you aren't seeing more of the true Pumpkin. Let's hope not. Key thing is try to get him into a routine and get some work into him, as he is probably doing less work than he is used to.

[Trewsers]

Pumpkin rocks!!!! heehee, what a cutie. Can't offer any advice apart from as somebody else suggested, could someone walk with you for a bit of moral support? I am rubbish at hacking out - but my mare is known for being potty and I knew what I was getting into when I bought her:rolleyes: Just keep your hacks short and sweet and as long as you feel safe you should be able to build it up gradually.:)

[MadMumInKent]

Hi Big Ears :) I didn't know about the frosty grass, I shall keep an eye on that and mention it to my YO.

I think today was just a one off with Pumpkin, he is normally good as gold, does everything that I ask of him, has lovely manners etc, so he was just feeling a bit unsettled. His mind was on other things, like the grass, and his friends ;) I plan to take him out on Monday, hopefully with my YO on foot... the longer I leave it, the more prancy he'll be, so may as well get it over with :D Pumpkin's interpretation of prancy isn't that of a normal horse, its more like an active walk, maybe a jog if he's got the energy, perhaps a little jump to the side if there's a strange noise...

I know all is well with our relationship as when I dismounted in the school, I held his reins very loosely , and walked in front of him, zig zagging around the school, and he followed me, every one of his footsteps echoing my own, so I'm still herd leader :D

[MadMumInKent]

Thanks Trewsers :) I'm planning to ask my YO to walk out on foot with me on Monday (I don't do weekends, that's Pumpkin's time off as I have the kids to attend to!). I wish I knew why my confidence went down, when poor Pumpkin has done nothing wrong, bless him! :) Its the old "what if.. what if... " :rolleyes: We'll work on it though!

[Tots N Dots]

please can I ask what a YO is? thanks Bev

[MadMumInKent]

YO = Yard Owner - the lady that owns the yard where I keep Pumpkin :)