Tennessee Walking Horses ridden as yearlings?

[GarnetFox]

I've been browing on the internet and came across a large and well known breeder of Tennessee Walking Horses.

They have pictures of yearlings being ridden by fully grown adults, and the majority of 2 year olds up for sale say that they have been started under saddle.

The horses do look quite sturdy, but I've been taught by NR and books etc that horses should not be ridden until they are mature enough, usually at 3 years plus.

So, is there a specific reason why TWHs are started under saddle so early?

[love4horses]

ONE YEAR OLD!! That is very irresponsible. I have a Tennessee Walking Horse, and we started her under saddle when she was 2 1/2 years old, but she was very tall and sturdy. She is now almost four and doing just fine... but when I said I started her under saddle we were only doing it at about once a week. She was very willing and by early fall I could set on her bare back while she ate grass. That is very much like starting thoroughbreds at one so they can race in the Kentucky Derby, etc... over here in the U.S. I have never heard of anyone riding TWH over here at one year, and I live in the heart of TWH country, in Tennessee. So this place is the only place I have ever heard of starting TWH at one year.

[GarnetFox]

I'll PM you the link to the page. :)

[Katie_85]

Could you post the link please? It's not that I don't believe you, it's just that I've never heard of anyone actually doing that. Even in our (the Walking Horse world.) I've heard of some idiots jumping on their colts at 16, 18 months, which is still utterly stupid, but never at 12. As far as breaking them goes, do a forum search for posts by me. You will see a thread where the breaking of Walking Horses was hashed out already. If you have any questions I'm always here to take an educated guess! :p

[GarnetFox]

Here you go Katie, I was hoping you'd reply! :)

http://www.walkerswest.com/Stalls/stall3.htm

[Just.Jump]

Only the money mongers and irresponsible start horses before at least being two years old- I don't agree with starting a hors euntil they are three and then keeping them put away until they turn four. (Light horses only)

Is that a site for *one* farm? I didn't bother looking for the place they are, but I'll jump and say they are in the US, where seemingly everyone raising western and pacing horses like wlakers likes to hop on asap. I'm surprised- he doesn't look like a yearling to me (he does look young, but the ridden picture makes him look alot more mature to me)- I'm also surprised that they have a rider of that weight on his back at only one, when his bones aren't done growing and joints are probably a long way from finishing closing.

So my only way to answer is that A) these people are idiots, and B) they have 31 horses for sale- they sound like a factory, not responsible breeders/trainers.

[Katie_85]

I know of these people actually. And yes, this particular horse does appear to be a year and a half old. Bloody irresponsible. Not the best representation of the walking horse world.

[chev]

Would be as well to remember that it is just one place though; Walkers are generally started a bit early for my liking but having been through this on a previous thread with Katie already ;) I also know that when Katie talks about starting them early it's very slow and light work she's on about; not what that site shows.

I think (hope) that this place is just one of those cases where one trainer gives the whole industry a bad name. :( Unfortunately it happens in all walks of life; you only need to look at the 'Irish horses are headshy' thread to see that. :(

[GarnetFox]

Cheers for the replies!

I've done a search and read through the Chev & Katie85 debate on breaking! :D I've decided that I know absolutely nothing about either way of starting young horses so I am going to keep an open mind. :D The majority of sites I've seen haven't started horses as quickly as they have on that site.

Oh, and I'm in love with TWHs now and need to earn loadsa dosh so I can import one or three. :D

[ajhainey]

Crikey - shes not exactly a lightweight either? I could understand someone chucking on a lightweight yardhand to do some basic breaking and schooling just so they can demonstrate the horse will go (not that I agree, but I can see why it might be done), but that lady would (IMO) be big for that horse even if it were fully grown...

Horses are lovely though - I'd like to come out to the US and ride one sometime...are they countrywide nowaday or still mostly in tenessee and surroundings?

aj xx

[Katie_85]

ajainey- That horse would take that lady's weight jut fine if it were fully grown. They are up to quite a lot of weight, quite a hardy horse, really. TWH's are pretty much everywhere, if you watch an old Western you're liable to see them. Everyone always assumed they used Quarter Horses, but the majoirty of them were walking horses. So what the untrained eye thought was a trot, was actually a gait! Cool huh?

[ajhainey]

Good news for me then if I plan to come ride one someday Katie (I am considerably bigger!) - just looks so fine around the lower leg! I guess it's all in the bones right, like arabs ;)

aj xx

[blackhorses]

Have just looked at the site and am horrified!! :mad: I wrote a stinking comment on thier guest page, they probably won't put it on!! :D
I do not start youngsters off until the end of thier second year and I don't back them until they are 3, they are not physically or mentally capable of a rider until then, no matter what breed or how mature they look on the outside! I hope you all have emailed them too!!

[Katie_85]

BLACKHORSES- What exactly is the point of e-mailing them nasty comments? You know nothing about them, their horses, or even the breed itself. I will not agree with riding a yearling, even if it is just to gauge gait quality. But I also won't presume, even with my bit of knowledge of TWH's, to tell someone how to raise their youngstock.

[Just.Jump]

Big farms like that won't listen to someone anyway. The only people you can really advise on when to break a horse is someone who is asking, and therefor wants to hear other peoples opinions.

For instance, my moms boyfriend sent over an envelope with her enclosing a picture of a nice little paint yearling, and on the back had something stupid along the lines of the horse needing breaking before its being sold for $400 dollars. Freaking idiots all around the globe these days.

[blackhorses]

Katie 85, I think anyone who rides a yearling is commiting animal cruelty, this was a known fact even a century ago when racehorses were ridden as yearlings people realised that it didn't do them any good and it was outlawed. I think if these breeders are made aware that people do care it might make a difference, you don't kwnow if you don't try, if enough people complain rather than just saying I'll keep out of it and leave people to go on doing things like this then nothing will ever change.
I don't know about anyone else but if I see an animal being mistreated then I can't sit by and do nothing with the excuse that it's not my business. The fact they have put thier horses on the internet brings it to public attention and I would hate people who are just learning about horses to see this and think this is a normal and acceptable practice.
I think yearlings should never be ridden under any circumstances.

Sorry having a bit of a rant! I work in a vets and see animals being badly treated regularly and it makes me sooo angry!

[walkinhorsechic]

i've been working with walking horses for years and train some of my own. the walking horses develop quicker than other breeds, i.e. arabians and quarter horses. to start a colt at only a year old is; however, completely irresponsible and cruel. the customary time to start a walking horse is at 18 months to two years, depending on how quickly the colt is coming along. hope this helps!

[Katie_85]

18 months is hardly customary for the smaller barns trying to produce a quality horse. 2 years, light work until 2 and a half, then light riding. But 18 months?! :eek: I've admittedly seen a few that have been broke at that age, but for a change, I won't attempt to validate breaking early. I know in the high name training barns that they will sometimes start a colt at 18 months, but I wouldn't consider this the rule, especially in the smaller circuit areas.