Any tips for unwilling pony?

[horsey_lass]

Hi

I help out with my local RDA group, and though most of the ponies are fantastic, theres one whos a bit of a problem. He's a small welsh pony, can be very sweet but also can be a pain. He's very reluctant when led, even in walk he has ears back and needs encouragement all the time. Trot is usually a disaster unless he follows another horse, as he just refuses to move. Pulling on the lead rein just causes him to pull back..hard!

He is led in a headcollar as he seemed unhappy with a bit in his mouth. He acts the same with or without a saddle, so I dont think ill fitting tack is at fault.

Can any one suggest anything to try and get him more willing to work? He doesnt do a lot of work, half an hours walking a week is about it. I suppose he could just be a bit stubborn, but he seems so unhappy being led that I want to see if we can do something about it. Are there any groundwork exercises that might work? Would lunging be a good idea? I have a bit of time to spend with him but just dont know where to start!

Thanks

Jen

[Pink's lady]

Having worked with loads of RDA ponies, I can totally understand where he's coming from.

RDA work is boring, there's not getting round it. Some ponies are lucky because they are ridden by the helpers and more able disabled riders, but the majority of ponies end up plodding round on a lead rope. It takes a very special horse to put up with that, day in day out

Combine it with the fact that many of the pony's riders will be unbalanced, and the ponies are often over-loaded (to side walk the pony needs to be small enough, so often tall or heavy riders are put onto small ponies), and turning and stopping and starting with an unbalanced rider is hard-work and puts a lot of stress on their muscles and jint, not wonder he's fed up!

If you're 110% sure his saddle is a perfect fit, and he's not sore, then variety will help. I don't know if you have the opertunity, but get him out doing other things - go hacking, do some fun schooling, a bit of jumping, play games, take him to shows, to the beach.

Getting him properly fit (which most RDA horses aren't) and working correctly will help as it will make his job easier.

If you can't do that, all you can do is be understanding ;)

[horsey_lass]

Thanks for the reply.
I can see where he's coming from too, it must be dull for him, but the problem is he's only 12hh ish and so its really difficult to find someone to ride him. He does occasionally get ridden, but as he's quite a difficult ride its hard for the girl who rides him to get much out of him I think. Wish I could ride him but I think I'm too tall to do much.
Are there any non ridden activities we could do to get him a bit more interested?

[Pink's lady]

Does he get to go out hacking much, or is it all school work. If not, he'd probably enjoy going to a walk on the lead-rein.

You could loose school him, which is more fun then lunging. Or jump him in-hand round little courses.

How about teaching him to drive, even if you never put him to a cart. Teaaching him to long rein and pull a tyre will keep you both occupied for ages.

Or how abouts doing some clicker training with him. If he's food orientated it will appeal to him ;)

BUt just spending time with him will help. Spend time just grooming him and making a fuss.

[horsey_lass]

Thanks, thats the sort of stuff I was thinking of. Clicker training is a good idea, as he is definitely food orientated! I know the basics of it, but can you give me any information on how to get started? Its not something I've done before but it sounds really interesting.

On the topic of food, pony has a habit of licking or nibbling anything that comes near his mouth. He doesn't nip as such, just wraps his tongue/lips round the nearest object. When being led he often grabs the lead rope, reins, neckstrap etc in his mouth and doesnt want to let go. Any idea what might make him do that? And how it can be gently but firmly stopped? Not only does it make him even harder to lead but I'm worried about him nibbling at the kids.
Thanks for all your suggestions so far, you've been really helpful! :D

[de_Stille_een]

I've been working with a few Rockies at work for the past few weeks, and have learned one thing about them- they're the most stubborn, balky horses you will ever meet. Of course, I'm sure some of them are perfectly well mannered. But most just like to stop.

And of course, since they pay us to fix their horses problems, we had to find a way to fix the stopping whenever the horses' wanted to. The solution? One person would ride the horse along the arena wall, and another person would follow shortly behind and to the inside carrying a lead rope. If the horse stopped and refused to move forward, the person on foot would begin to swing the end of the lead rope (the end without a buckle or clip) behind the horse (pretend you're swinging a lasso or that the end of the rope is the little tail on a helicopter- keep it moving in a very fast, continuous circle). They begin edging the rope towards the horse until he finally decides to start moving forward. Sometimes you have to tap the horse on your way- sometimes it's a very firm tap. Be sure that it's rhythmic- horses understand rhythm and consistency. Eventually the horse will move forward- sometimes it's sooner, sometimes it's much later.

You might adapt this to your pony at the riding center- Have one person lead the pony, and the other follow with the lead rope. You can tack him up and pretend that it's a normal ride, just don't put anyone on him- especially not one of the program participants- sometimes the horse will start moving forward with a jolt- which might unbalance an already discoordinated rider. Pulling usually won't work with horses, especially not stubborn ponies- like you said, he'll only pull back. Horses resist tension- for example, if you're trying to get a stubborn horse to step to the side from the ground, and you simply lean into his side or shoulder... he'll probably lean back on you instead of moving away from you. Driving a horse forward from behind is far more effective than a tug-o-war from in front.

Variety in the horse's life might also help. Perhaps the center would allow a talented young rider recommended by a local RI might be interested in gaining some extra riding time- the ponies might enjoy some stimulation and excitement in their lives.

By the way, a snap with the end of the rope on the hindquarters is NOT abusive. While I'll never say it's pleasant or comfortable for the horse, it's not undue punishment, nor is it punishment in any form. It's like a parent who never disciplines their children because they don't want to "hurt their feelings" or anything by grounding them or spanking them or telling them "no, you can't eat eight bags of Skittles before dinner." Their households are out of control, and when their children grow up, they are spoiled and selfish. However, if the parents either "discipline" their children for no reason, or too severely for the child's mistake, then the line is crossed into abuse.

Similarly, sometimes you must use some force in order to get a response from your horse. My rule is that you use the minimum to get the response- and since you never know how quickly and well your horse will react, you start with the minimum aid- the slightest nudge with your heels or the lightest tap on the turning rein, and if that isn't enough, be a little firmer, and if that isn't enough, a little firmer, if it's not enough, a little firmer, not enough, firmer... I was taught to "ask, tell, demand"- kindly and subtly ask your horse the first time. If they ignore, give them a clear direction as to what you want them to do. If they still ignore you, make it clear as aquafina that they cannot ignore you. It's very rare that a horse needs more than a "tell"- but if necessary, sometimes you need to demand.

If you let a horse get away with one thing, they'll do it over and over again, and expect to keep getting away with things.

[KateWooten]

and since you never know how quickly and well your horse will react, you start with the minimum aid

... just adding to that excellent and well-articulated response - the other reason that you always start with the minimum aid, is that you want the horse / pony to become 'soft'. If you're consistetnt with it, he gets an incredibly polite 'ask' for everything, and he learns to respond to that - else he knows for sure it's going to escalate into all that 'tap-tap-tap-TAP-TAP-TAP...' and he's thinking 'well, I'm going to have to move forward in the end anyway, so I might as well avoid all that tapping' ... 'consistency' and 'always return to the softest cue' - in an ideal world we'd have solved all the horse behaviour problems. Unfortunately, those 2 things are precisely what this pony's riders invariably lack which cetainly contributes to why he's getting more and more resistant.

Sounds like if you and another helper could implement de_Stille_een's training session a couple of times - even just for five minutes each, you might have a whole different pony for the 1/2 hour rides. Remember when you do it, that the instant that he responds by going forward - you drop all pressure and reward him by rubbing him all over and praising him. It's the release of pressure that all horses learn from, and in his case, he needs to know he's a good pony, else there's not really much for him to look forward too in these rides.

[Cheeky]

We had a horse simular at RDA .. but he was about 16(16.1)hh, solid, and was motionless lol! Great thing he didnt spook (we had a few bikes that shook a few horses up from time to time .. but it's all okay now). But when it came to trot, it was me who had to get him moving lol.

what I found that really woke him up and got him listening was to warm him up prior the RDA students. I dont mean ride .. just inhand. Walk him a few times around the arena .. then ask him to trot, next to me, up and down the arena a few times .. if he didnt do what he was asked, he would get a smack on the belly with the end of the really soft lead rope until he moved.

This really woke him up and he trotted (with LESS hesitation) with a rider.

Good luck

[horsey_lass]

Thanks for all your replies.
de_stille_een, your method sounds very interesting, not something I'd thought of. I can see that encouraging him forward from behind would be much more benefical than pulling him from the front. I'll certainly try that.
Cheeky - we do try to warm the ponies up a bit before RDA, but unfortuntely he's just as bad when not ridden and will refuse to trot, or even walk sometimes. He doesnt seem to respond to a tap with a whip, maybe a lead rope as you suggest would be a better idea. I dont like smacking him, I'll try using a rope as a softer, and hopefully more productive alternative!

[Dizzy]

You've already had some excellant replies on how to encourage him to move, but I noticed that you said, he doesn't do alot of work, only about half an hours walking a week.

So if you think about 1 week in hours (168 of them) he has approx 166 hrs of peace, tranquillty and pleasing himself . It could be, that he resents the interuption of work into his normal daily routine.

Unfortunately horses don't think like humans - if it were me - I'd think 'be nice, do as I'm told, and be pleasant, for half an hour, once a week and I'll be left in be peace'. But horses tend to think to think the opposite, they're creatures of habit and like routine, his 'normal routine' is inactivity.

It would be interesting to know, how old he is? Why doesn't he like having a bit in his mouth? And why is he a difficult ride?

He doesn't sound a 'happy chap' where humans are concerned. When my mare has to stand still in stressful situations (freeze branding, clipping, rectal examination by the vet) she bites/mouths anything she can grab, so his tendancy to mouth lead riens etc may be a reaction brought on by insecurity and nerves.

I've also helped with RDA, and its not the most enjoyable interaction a horse can have with a human, as has already been mentioned, he's not very big, so carrying an unbalanced rider will be hard for him, more so because he's not 'rider fit'. If this is his only experience of folk, you can't blame him for being unwilling and grumpy.

Give him regular work, especailly hacking combined with schooling, outside of RDA work. To develop willingness, the horse has to enjoy what he does, once you have a tiny bit of willingness, obedience follows.

I do agree, that sometimes we must 'insist' that they obey, you've already been given a couple of good suggestions, could I also add, when riding, a good whack of a schooling whip across your boot (doesn't make contact with the horse, but they see out of the corner of thier eyes, and the sound is a good instigator of forward) or carrying (inhand or on board) a supermarket carrier bag and giving it a good rattle.

Whatever method you use, praise forward motion, and don't restrict it, if its too fast, (onboard, praise the first couple of strides, then ask them to slow) if its inhand, praise and send them out onto a circle, and after a few strides ask for walk.

I'd just like to add I fully support RDA, and I know the horses I know that are used for RDA do too. They recognise when they are carrying 'special cargo' be it disabled folk, very young, or novice. But they also like nothing better than a good Ye Haa over the moor or a cross country event with a rider who can stir them up.

With him only being used once a week for RDA, it could be that his only connection with humans isn't very pleasant to him, and with him not being good to ride, indicates he's not very well schooled, and doesn't fully understand what's being asked of him, and because his handling is so infrequent, he doesn't ever build a connection with anyone.

[horsey_lass]

Dizzy, thanks for replying, what you said really makes sense. I guess if his routine is being idle, any interruption to that is going to upset him. Thats interesting about your mare chewing when stressed, it could be the problem when he's led but he also does it when he's standing still and seemingly quite relaxed.

I'm not sure exactly what the problem with his mouth is, they changed to a headcollar before I started volunteering. Apparently he seemed uncomfortable with the bit in his mouth, but then as he often mouths when led in a headcollar I'm not sure that the bit is the problem. I'd like to get someone to check his mouth out, but as he's not mine its a bit difficult.
I think he's about 10 years old, no ones really sure. Again, I've only been told he's a difficult ride, I havent seen him ridden or ridden him myself. I think he probably just does the same as when led.

I'm going to try and spend some time just messing about with him tomorrow - grooming him, paying him attention, doing a bit of groundwork with him. I'll probably try some of the excellent suggestions people have given me. I'd really like to try and establish a connection with him, as you suggest, and hopefully make his relationship with humans a bit better.