its not colic is it

[No_Angel]

ive just been up to see the horses. maddie kept lying down and standing back up, so i went to see her. shes very hot and has sweaty patches on her neck and shoulder, she has no rug on and is a thin skinned tb. my other horses are fine, not sweaty and not particulary hot.
she kept lying down, i sat with her a bit and stroked her then got her a carrot, she eat the carrot and she was eating grass. she then lay her head down on the floor so she was flat out. she also has been doing flemham (sp?) alot lately, ive never seen her do that before, she was doing it alot today.
she kicked up at her stomach once but i think that was from a fly as shes swishing her tail alot aswell.
she doesnt look in pain or distressed, but im worried about her:( she hasnt been looking at her stomach at all, she just lookd dopey and tired.
could she have something wrong with her?:(

[cvb]

tasha

that does sound rather colic-like - I am guessing she's out so its less easy to tell if there are droppings coming through or not ?

They can just get mild colic - our fell has done it a few times in the past (fingers crossed, touch wood - not for a while).

[No_Angel]

forgot to mention that, she did a poo, looked normal, and had a wee just as i was leaving.
oh no, my poor baby:( do you think i should call the vet?

[Scarlett 001]

I am no horse health expert but when Skeeter had colic he stamped his feet a lot, stared at his sides, wanted to roll, his nostrils were flared out, he did not want to eat - not even a carrot or anything. I think he had pretty classic symptoms. On the good side, he was still pooping and had stomach gurgling noises, which I was told at the time was a good sign as in bad colics I have heard they do not poop or have stomach noises.

Anyhow, I don't know what else it could be, but if you are worried I'd keep a close eye on her until she seems more herself. So hard to know when to call a vet out, isn't it? I won't even make a suggestion on that one since I am not there.

Maybe a mild colic as suggested in another post here?

Best wishes to both of you.

[Mehitabel]

patchy sweating and flehmen are classic signs of pain. call the vet, even just to describe symptoms and ask if she should be visited now or whether you shouild monitor her for a bit longer and see if it passes.

[Scarlett 001]

flehmen are classic signs of pain

I did not know that. Interesting information to know for future reference.

I agree then, best to call the vet and talk to them on the phone and see what they think.

[Mehitabel]

yep - it's one of those things that varies from horse to horse - if your horse does it whenever it has a polo or just randomly, then you can ignore it, but if a horse who does not do it normally starts, then pain is the first thought.

[galadriel]

Colic just means "stomach pain"; you can have colic without the absolutely typical signs. A horse who's demonstrating discomfort (by such things as lying down and getting back up again, patchy sweating) could well be colicking.

Gut sounds and passing manure are good signs, but don't mean that the horse isn't colicking. Kat had a bad colic; mild for 3 days, with no frantic rolling or typical colic symptoms. She had gut sounds and did pass manure the whole time. After the 3rd day it got quite bad and we ended up having to take her to the hospital. (She'd already been tubed a few times by then, had been getting lots and lots of banamine, so it's not like we spent the time ignoring it.) Even a mild colic is important to catch and treat quickly.

[No_Angel]

i went up again straight away to check on her, shed taken herself into her stable and looked worse, i called teh vet and he thought it was colic so came down, checked her all out and couldnt find any thing wrong inside, so gave her an injection to see how she was after that and she seemed fine, so i watched her for a bit then came home.
im just going to eat and then go back up to see her.
spasmodic colic i think he said it was.

[Mehitabel]

hope it is all OK - let us know.

[bexj]

Hope he feels better soon:)

[becs]

Our old cob has had 2 episodes of benign spasmodic colic - he was v. sweaty, restless, stamping and off all food (not like him, at all). But it was all over in about an hour both times. And bouncing about the next day as if nothing had happened...

The vet said that this type of colic (eg like bad wind, NOT complicated like obstruction / torsion of bowel etc) is common and often occurs when they're on their own without us realising it, as it's usually self-resolving. She gave an anti-spasmodic injection anyway. We were also advised to watch for 1/2 hour to an hour next time before rushing to vet call-out, as many start to improve in that time.

Colic is (as said above) just tummy ache; a symptom - the cause can vary & may be very simple (eg uncomfortable wind) or very serious (eg bowel obstruction).

Hope she's well on the mend now!

[Scarlett 001]

Hope she is feeling better soon. Good for you to call the vet out, just to be sure.

[galadriel]

The thing about spasmodic colic--gas colic--is that it can turn bad in a hurry.

Interestingly, this year I had 2 of my horses gas colic at the same time (my vet thought perhaps the new grass coming in, though we didn't really think much had come in yet). Kat, who went through a 3-day impaction with nothing more than simple lying down and looking sorry for herself, was trying to thrash and roll with this one. Fantasy was also--and Fantasy had a more-or-less chronic stress colic that lasted a couple of *weeks* when she was injured a few years ago. Yet both of them, with this "mild" and "benign" colic, were trying to thrash themselves into a torsion colic.

Consider. A torsion is when *something* happens in the bowel that makes it twist. When gas is in the bowel, it can affect the way the bowel sits, rather like inflating a balloon. That puts the bowel in a dangerous state, one which may lead to torsion since the bowel may be less stable/less set in its usual alignment.

I had a boarder who brought her horse to me when he was recovering from colic surgery for a torsion. His colic had been frightening. It had started out mild, seemed to be only a little gas colic. They called the vet anyway...which turned out to be a good thing, because throughout the vet's visit the horse didn't improve. They eventually ended up trailering him to the nearest university's large animal hospital, and just barely got him there in time (and probably the horse would not have lasted even that long, if their local vet hadn't already been treating him).

No colic is benign, really. Anything which makes your horse uncomfortable can lead to something much worse. And without the education/experience of a horse vet, owners/handlers are not really in a position to judge what's harmless and what needs a vet's attention.

And even when I think what's going on with my horse is mild, just needs a bit of banamine, I *still* call my vet to run the symptoms past her and make sure she approves.

[Scarlett 001]

Is your girl ok now? I hope so.

After a gas colic episode, that is if they start eating again and acting normal, does it usually pass - or can it come back again later that same day or evening?

When Skeeter colicked he was stomping, nostrils flared, would not touch food. It passed after a few hours (we had a vet on call just in case and were talking to him), and I stayed on at the barn another few hours after it passed and he was eating and acting happy again - but I did have to go home in the end (it was middle of the night by then - stables manager was going to be up at 6 am - a few hours later - to feed horses and put outside etc.). Just curious how long one should hang around after a horse seems better to monitor things etc.?

[becs]

Perhaps there are varying vet's views, particularly across the pond? The term "benign" was that used by the vets, in our case. Perhaps my vet is too laid back? Hmmm.. Maybe it's another area where there's still conflicting data coming in, to come to a definite conclusion.

trying to thrash themselves into a torsion colic.

I understood this view was out dated now...if the bowel is going to twist, it will anyway and wasn't "benign" colic in the first place; that rolling isn't the prime cause of torsion. Isn't that why we're now told not to force them to walk around when they want to roll, as they used to suggest; just protect them from external injury?

I hope I didn't put across the view that colic wasn't to be taken seriously; as a qualified nurse, I'm aware of the consequences of "acute abdos" and bowel surgery. All my point was to try and put a broad perspective on it to allay panic - yes we must monitor carefully and act quickly, but many colics are spasmodic and relatively mild and self-resolving (75% according to BHS Vet Manual). I understood the current view is that they happen quite a lot when we're not there to see - the same as you and I may have tummy discomfort after a strong curry / constipation etc, then are okay hours later.
Before we kept ponies, I thought colic was always a surgical emergency. After our steep learning curve, we now realise there are many types of various causes and severities. Sorry if I gave the wrong view here.

how long one should hang around after a horse seems better to monitor things well I fretted about this too; making notes 1/2 hourly! But the vets implied that after that simple type of colic, it was unlikely to recurr immediately (all signs now being normal eg passing wind etc) hence after a few hours not to worry. Luckily they live at home so I could still pop out anyway.

[No_Angel]

Maddie seems fine this morning, back to her old self.:)

[becs]

Glad she's better now! It's horrid when they're poorly.

[No_Angel]

yes it was awful, i was shaking so much and nearly in tears:( yesterday must have been the worst day, i broke up with my boyfriend in the morning then my baby gets colic:( :rolleyes:

[becs]

Sorry you had such an awful day - I know how you feel, when I rang the vets I was almost choking in tears as I requested the call-out. Felt such a jerk after but I guess they get it all the time and realise what our babies mean to us!

[Scarlett 001]

yes it was awful, i was shaking so much and nearly in tears:( yesterday must have been the worst day, i broke up with my boyfriend in the morning then my baby gets colic:( :rolleyes:

Tough day for you. Glad she is herself again. :)

[teabiscuit]

sorry you broke up with your bloke, but very glad your horse is ok :)

[galadriel]

I understood this view was out dated now...if the bowel is going to twist, it will anyway and wasn't "benign" colic in the first place; that rolling isn't the prime cause of torsion. Isn't that why we're now told not to force them to walk around when they want to roll, as they used to suggest; just protect them from external injury?

It's not that rolling itself makes the bowel twist. But getting excited and stressed does bad things to the innards. If you've already got a gas pocket, then the clenching of the stomach/gut that happens when a horse exercises or gets stressed can pinch off the gas pocket and can make the colic worse; think twisting one of those long balloons that clowns make into animals shapes.

Stress colics (spasmodic, gas colics) can lead to torsions. Even if it looks minor, there's still the possibility that it'll get worse. It's not so much that rolling makes it worse, but that the gas in the bowel creates a situation that can lead to torsion. Thrashing can definitely make any colic worse, whether it's just making the colic worse or helping the colic become something else.

Now, everything I've read is that lying down or gentle walking etc is okay, even lying down and rolling over once or twice--but that thrashing rolling should still be prevented. I haven't seen anywhere that frantic rolling should be allowed.