View Full Version : Novice owners or How are we supposed to learn?
3rd Dec 2001, 07:50 PM
New people at our yard. New owners and a bit stuck. Did anybody offer to help Did they heck!!!! Are they " the talk of the yard?" You bet! How are new owners supposed to learn. Hanging around on yards is aganst HSE rules. Not all can afford to pay fro "own a pony days" or PRT courses. Not everybody has horsey friends as mentors. So just how are novice owners supposed to learn. agreed it does not help when a dealer selles them a patently unsuitable horse but these things happen. We are supposed to be friendly helpful and non exclusive. Phooey! We have the reputation we deserve!
3rd Dec 2001, 08:04 PM
ooh, somethings hit a nerve here! Not sure whether you are refering to your own experience or someone elses? I know when i bought my horse (from the stables that i had lessons) and kept her on full livery for 3 mths, people were generally helpful, when i had my stables built and brought her home, my neighbour )who's in her 50's and has her own horse) asked my Dad what i knew about horses as she had won cups you know (whooppee!) - she has done nothing but try and cause me trouble and tell anyone who wants to listen that i'm just a novice ride ( who cares - my horse is happy and healthy!) It's attitudes like that that give horsey people the wrong name but i have to say mot people i've come across (experienced and novice alike) have been friendly and helpful
3rd Dec 2001, 08:58 PM
Goodness Mossy,have you posted on the right site?.
Many people like Amelia and I would love our own horse,and be able to afford and look after our own horses and have land for our horses,thank goodness for riding centres,at least most.
But when it comes down to helping others,I would say you are
absolutely right to be angry,there certainly is lack of humanity
in all spheres of life,but I honestly doubt the equine world has an exclusive on that. I would not like any one to witness some of the things I have seen on our roads and behaviour of drivers trying to clear off after causing carnage.
Take care and maybe a stiff drink will help you, I think that I can understand what you are getting at.
Best wishes from Fred.
3rd Dec 2001, 09:18 PM
I think you are right - there is a lot of snobbish type behaviour, unwillingness to help etc but I don't think it is exclusive to the horse world - I have seen it in other activities as well and certainly in other areas of life (work) etc. But you can help them - or perhaps point them in the direction of helpful people you know. Hopefully they will then come away with at least one or two favourable views!
Don't get me started on dealers though - I have knowledge of one particularly bad sale that really annoys me at the moment when I see the horse in question just stood in a field, alone, 24/7 because a sale was made without thought - don't get me wrong it is not abused as such -it is properly fed - but it is very neglected because it was a totally unsuitable sale. not much one can do about it though.
3rd Dec 2001, 09:39 PM
No I am not referring to my own experiences. Neither am I referring to "helpful "souls who rubbish anybody and everybody. They are a pain in the neck. I refer to a genuine novice owner who is being belittled by those who "know" rather than being in receipt of honest offers of "I am not sticking my nose in but if you want a hand I am here"
I think I may not have made myself clear. I am not lucky enough to own a yard. I wish.....! I am sure there are lots of very knowledgable folks who would love to own their own and I consider myself very blessed to own our two. I waited a long time for them. However I was also lucky enough to spend my childhood on a riding school stable yard working for rides and generally getting in amongst it. [I am not being rude about them at all - I now earn my horses' livings at one.] That option is just not open now. There are lots of unhelpful souls in all walks of life but that does not make them right.
I hope I have unruffled any ruffled feathers and I apologise if I was less than tactful but condescending arrogance makes my blood boil.
3rd Dec 2001, 10:55 PM
i know someone like you mentioned...she is 17 yrs old, had a hard life and got a hrose form her seperated parents, she had little expereince, was sold a horse to hot for her to handle and the horse in the first year of ownership was moved to 6 different yards and wasnt ridden, mainly ebcause people were soo mean to the girl, told her everything she did was wrong and didnt help her at all. I taught her as much as i coudl adn went and visited her 1-2 times a week.
All the people that thought they knew best had a horse that was at a higher level then they were and so all they knew about riding was pushing one button to go and one button to stop. So when it came to someone helping her train up her horse again to be ridden they completely ruined the horse. The horse is now back ats its orignal home and being trained again and is apparently coming along nicely but is up for sale because the girl has had enough of the horse world attitude.
4th Dec 2001, 07:33 PM
I had a simmilar experience when I bought Pageant as a three year old.
I was knowlegable enough to know that Green horse + green rider = bruises black and blue! And lucky enough to have a couple of very good, helpful 'horsey' friends at the yard I keep him at, but I was astounded at the attitude of the majority of the rest of the 'horsey' set around here.
The day after I bought him I was asked why I hadn't ridden him- not given long enough to reply that he had no tack- and was offered Ł300 to ' take him off my hands' because, apparantley, I had 'over horsed' myself and would never cope with a 'hot' three year old.
A week later one of my friends phoned to ask me why I had sold Pageant before asking for help or advice- apparantley it was the talk of the area that I had taken a tumble and lost all my confidence. It was actually a week AFTER that that I fell and lost my confidence!!
Needless to say, I hadn't sold him either and now, nearly 18months on, I have great pleasure in smiling and waving with a cheery 'good morning' as I ride quietly past the same people who said 'She'll never cope' on my well mannered, joy to own horse!
I did have my ups and downs, and expect many more, but thanks to the few 'good' horsey people I have met in the flesh, and the multitude of 'good' people I have met on this site, and all the help and advice I have received, I have no doubt that Pageant & I have now formed a lifelong bond!
Needless to say, the 'snobs' still look down their noses at me- and the 'Hot three year old' is now 'not exactly forward going'- well- hes not likley to be is he? He's a big fat hairy cob for goodness sake! And, by god, I love him!!
4th Dec 2001, 07:39 PM
Floppys' example just proves why some horse owners get their reputation.....speaking as a fairly novice rider I know that
it is extremely downheartening to have your mistakes pointed out as if they were obvious or silly. There is so much to learn about horses that you can't simply know it all, every now and then you need some guidance, which should involve friendly advice rather than being laughed at or left to fend by yourself.:rolleyes: I think it would do the snobs a lot of good to remember when they had their first horse!:D
4th Dec 2001, 07:53 PM
Oh yes, this is a subject very close to Frances and my hearts, not about horses in general but the obscure speciality which is the ICELANDIC enigma!
When I first started to enquire about them I was told I shouldn't go ahead and buy one because they were "different" I should pay out for lessons before I buy one. I'd NEVER manage to train my own, far too difficult for a "muggle" like me I'd have to pay thousands for a ready made one.
A) I cannot spend 3 days travelling to get lessons on one!
B) they are a horse the same as any.
C) I cannot afford Ł5000!
So I bought an untrained one and waved happily to all those who "KNOW" when I collected all my rosettes and came 8th in GB at the British Championships with my home trained horse.
Frances too was given such stick by some who phoned her to tell her she was beign irresponsible (how dare they) Now they are all as gelous as hell because Hákon is what they all want, fast, forward going, natural tölter with a flying pace to take your breath away.
Only one lass in the Icelandic horse society said "good on you, I'm on the phone if you want advice, go for it"
There is nothing special about training the gaits, once you know the basics and the feel the principal is the same for teaching a horse ANYTHING
7th Dec 2001, 01:55 PM
I have a woman at my yard who is always bragging about her daughter. She's always saying how good she and the pony are and when they win anything she's insufferable for a week.
She was extremely smug about the fact that my pony was in a riding school and kept going on about how 'ruined' she was.
When I took her on loan and had to give up my lessons she bragged about how you had to have lessons to be good and win things at shows.
I've ignored her and kept schooling my pony myself until I could afford a few lessons.
I had my first last week and the teacher told me how good she was, ie forward going, responsive, etc. I was pleased and very proud of her.
I never brag to anyone in my yard about how wonderful my pony is. I let her do the talking through her good schoolwork and jumping and her happy demeanour. She has always answered her critics.
I did find out on the grapevine that this lady had been told that my pony would be a perfect second pony for her daughter. However, she didn't act fast enough and I got her instead. It would explain the constant 'digging' at my expense.
8th Dec 2001, 12:45 PM
I thought I was the only one that got stuffed up by those sort of horsey people you have been talking about. Been ripped blind and told a lot of c#*p! This time round I have decided to do things on my own to a certain extent but since I am a novice rider training a 3yo I still have 'young horses not be beginners' ringing in my ears!! A few years back I owned another young horse who I had broken in by some of these so called horsey people and eventually to save mine and the horses sanity and confidence I sold. I never thought I would ride again but every ride now improves my confidence and peoples comments on how good he's doing etc are really encouraging and I'm really determined this time round to see it through how I think best. Been really discouraged this week when a farrier told me it wasn't his job to have to put up with a my 3yo that fiddles a bit when getting shoes. I thought chosing a profession with animals that it would not be expected that to have everyone perfect???
12th Dec 2001, 05:11 PM
I know what you mean.
At my old yard a majority of people were lovely and always there to give advice when you asked but there were a certain few that instead of helping simply slagged people off (behind there back) about how they looked after their horse(s), unfortunly they only did it to one particular person at a time - bullys.
There are some nasty, horrible, snobby people out there and even if you take there advice, it's never good enough and it gets to much and drives people crazy.
I'd always help someone but sometimes I think they know more so I shouldn't say anything.
As for getting experience..harder than it sounds even if you volunteer, there's so much to learn about horsecare, I read books for years to conpensate and you can learn alot from that.
Treat people how you would like to be treated.
12th Dec 2001, 05:41 PM
Hi i am a timid rider and i have found that so many people figure you know what to do.I have read a whole lot and learned so much from just reading but it is so different when you acctually try to do these things with horses and alot of the horsey people that i have run accross seem to act like everything is a big secret. I have a hard time being firm with horses and i still am yet to find the way to do it and make them my friend too i have no problem being kind but the firmness doesn't come easy and doing it the proper way
Still hoping for help:rolleyes:
12th Dec 2001, 06:15 PM
i have agian experianced the same "horsey" people hwo always no best i got my first horse a year an a half ago due to various situations which led to be being unable to ride it my father decided enough was enough and the horse was to dnagerous and not giving the enjoyment it should so instead we brought another horse hwo was perfect in every way and ten days later she had afoal (which i must add was missed by the vet) but all the people who own horses in my area this was hilarious a fairly novious teebnager having had all these problems very few actually offered there help and supposrt instead it was she'll never cope shell have to sell them both again but i was convinced molly was the perfect pony for me and 6 months down the line i have just started riding her again and i have a well mannered purebred highland foal in the field who i am sure will turn into a perfect horse. these people can be proved wrong and how ever hard it is try not to let them get at you just laugh and get on with it
12th Dec 2001, 06:23 PM
...for all the people who've had a sh***y time. Everyone has been so helpful, not condescending, but just gently offering advice and encouragement. I've even plucked up courage to help someone myself (she's heavily pregnant and her Ardennes mare is - sorry, was - a bit wild). OK we have spats from time-to-time, who doesn't, but everyone looks after one another - like if you're late, just a quick 'phone call will sort someone to do a bring in, and bed down. If the weather turns filthy like as not you will find your horse brought in - and given hay, too. Everyone shares kit and transport - when I needed to get Benny to Rossdales in Newmarket (45 miles each way) the yard horsebox appeared + a volunteer driver and someone else for company, with no charge accepted for what turned out to be a whole afternoon.
12th Dec 2001, 07:46 PM
Cathy -I wish I had my own yard! I don't have a pony anymore, I'm horseless now and have nothing more to do with them, but I'll be applying for jobs as a groom after my Gcse's solely to gain more experience, I'd love to try more of the Monty Robert methods.
well done Kay!!! sounds like your're doing great!
we all have the best intentions whatever we do and that's the important thing, although it's important that we admit defeat if it's getting tomuch, but your decision should never be influenced by what other people say.
Timid rider - guess how I learnt? even before I handled horses - I got a puppy for my birthday and took it upon myself to train him, I learnt through this that he listened to the tone of my voice and he knew if he'd be naughty if I said it in a deep, strict tone, so when I began handling horses it came naturally to do this, if I thought they needed it - otherwise it was all hugs & kisses.
I also did the same when I roded - my instructor said I was a sensitive rider - yay:D :rolleyes:
I think this is better than constantly screaching at a horse & smacking him for every little thing (hey no offence to anyone that dos that) but I can't stand it.
17th Dec 2001, 12:02 PM
I have been riding on and off for 12 years and I hate to say I have family who are in that 'arrogant horse set' they have a number of horses between them.
Well I stopped riding for a while - only went intermittantly after a bad fall when I was 13, then started again by sharing a 14.2 welsh about 2 or 3 months ago. We have had masses of problems and everyone down my yard is very critical of how I handle him - I know that recently someone else rode 'my' pony and BROKE a schooling whip IN TWO on him trying to get him to go forward and and not buck. I have been thrown by him once - when he bolted in the school about a week after the schooling whip event, but 2 weeks further on I have built up my confidence again (I couldnt even manage a trot for a week) and had a wonderful lesson with him on sunday. We even had a go at our first flying change.
We have had problems with him attacking me when I put his feed in - now solved. We had constant figiting when grooming - now corrected, and I used to get bitten HARD - this is now turning to a small suck on my coat. For someone who had never mucked out ever 3 months ago I think that I have come along way. I won't take him out again in the forest yet as my confidence isn't that good yet but for all the critics out there - if you can't say anything nice - go away and don't say anything.
I have had mountains of help / suggestions from the NR people I still have lessons weekly too. I am hoping that I can buy my own horse or pony at some point next year. 'My' pony is rumoured to be one of the most bad tempered at our yard - he is just really misunderstood. I was going to give him 4 more weeks after he threw a complete psycho fit in the forest and bolted continuously in the school - but next year if I buy my own I will probably 'break' and school him / her myself. I know it will be hard - but if I give him/her everything I have - my time, my patience, my perserverance (and my money :D ) then I can win.
I do know one lady who is now nearly 30. She had one riding lesson aged 19, bought a colt who was 9 months old - broke him herself, trainined and schooled him herself and he has been placed if he hasn't won in most of the shows they have entered.
Hows that for a novice?!
Anyone who wants a horse I say go for it - but only if you are going to put it FIRST in your life - ABOVE a partner, a job etc - a horse cannot feed itself or muck out - you have to take responsibility and if you can do that - which is no small task - then I wish you all the luck in the world!!
9th Jan 2002, 12:20 PM
I am sad to hear everyone putting down people who can ride and look after their horses properly. I used to keep my horse at a yard where the girl had been riding for 6months and her parents had bought her a pony and a yard. The pony was too much for her, throwing her and galloping every where. My friend and i tried to help her with the pony, but, we were told not too politely where to go! As a result the pony was beaten and galloped on the roads. When he was ridden into a sweat he was put in a stable to stand and freeze. After 6 months being there I couldnt stand it and left. I am more than willing to help others with schooling and or general horse care. I have helped school many horses with problems too big for their owners but there is many novices out there who think they are experts. These people you cannot help! I have tried so I now think twice before offering to help. So please dont class every knowledgeable rider out there as unhelpful, some people are just sick of having to watch others like the girl mentioned above! I have also helped novices people that really do want to learn but i do take care before offering advice!
Alison + Rio + Cassey
ps. The pony is now locked up 24hrs a day because she cant catch it so she leaves it in so she can ride it. There has also been a compliant made to the RSPCA.
9th Jan 2002, 12:52 PM
I think Alison is right about some people - there are some novice riders/owners out there who think they know everything and don't want to take advice, and as a result get into all sorts of difficulty with their horses. I'm sure there must be a lot of good young horses that are ruined because of their owners' lack of experience and misguided actions.
I am very much a novice when it comes to horses, and I am only too happy to get advice from more knowledgeable horsey people - I'm lucky in that there are plenty of helpful, friendly people at my yard, and there is always someone to give me advice if I need it. As for being given advice when I haven't asked for it.....well, if I was doing something which was likely to be detrimental to the horse, I would rather be told about it than go on making the same mistakes.....
9th Jan 2002, 02:22 PM
I'm very much a novice, especially at the stable management side of things. Owning a horse is a dream goal for me - I take weekly lessons, but the people at my yard are a lot younger than me and can be a bit cliquey. I'm of the attitude of 'if you don't know, ask!' but after a few frosty replies at the yard, I tend to ask my questions here instead. Earlier last year, I was asked what HOYS was like, and got told 'There'd be no point in someone like you going because you wouldn't know what you were watching!'. Well, I did go, and a very good & educational time I had.
I wasn't fortunate enough to have years of childhood riding lessons, but I don't feel this should disqualify me from learning about it now, but sometimes I think other people think it should! Okay, I don't have an encyclopaedic knowledge of horses, but I am passionate about them, want to know as much as possible and I know I can get questions answered here!
This board is vital for people like me because I can ask what I want without being made to feel stupid or intimitated. I can benefit from other peoples' experience and advice, and BEST of all, when anyone posts about lack of confidence or feeling down about their riding, they get support, encouragement and sympathy!
17th Jan 2002, 01:10 PM
I had lessons around the age of 12 and have ridden occasionally over the years until after the age of 30 I could finally afford my own horse. Having ridden a friend's aged arab in a few LDR events (at which he excelled), I was convinced I wanted an arab or arab cross for my first horse. I went to see lots of horses in my search for a sensible-ish arab X suitable for the first owner - a few months and several hairy test-rides later I realised that there is no such beast and bought myself a 15hh Dales mare! People fell about laughing when they saw her the first time, she was hugely overweight, unfit, very hairy and of course, not an arab!
5 months later we are much fitter and doing 20-30 miles and loving it - being a Dales she can out trot most things and happily keeps up with one of her arab chums whilst he canters daintily along beside her.
Being a novicey first time owner can be frustrating, but the sense of satisfaction when you make some progress is hugely rewarding!
21st Jan 2002, 05:45 PM
Okay, I thought this posted before, but I must've done something wrong:eek:
I bought a horse just recently. I still haven't even compiled all the tack yet, but should be done this week. Anyway, I have had people make me feel inferior and stupid for not knowing all there is to know about horses. Right after the purchase, I went home and cried because a person insinuated to me that I was irresponsible and unfair to a poor horse for buying it and not being an experienced horse rider/owner.
I just got back from a week vacation (the barn has daily turnout included in board rate), and when I got home I hurried off to see my boy, and when he saw me (or heard my voice) he came right over to greet me! I swear he missed me! Anyway, I may be a beginner rider; but my skills will come with lessons. In the meantime, this horse will be loved and well cared for. And THAT is what is important to me.
Steph - aka RD's Mom!
25th Jan 2002, 07:17 PM
First of all, you can get bad novice riders, bad experienced riders and bad famous riders. But you can get good novice owners, good experienced riders and good famous riders.
A lot of novice riders have successfully bought on youngsters, because they ask for help and give it a good shot. I say good on you if you have proved people wrong and have risen up to the challenge!! It take guts and a brave heart.
But there are also novice riders who completely break a horse down until it seems like murder, and usually these have very different attitudes to the ones I have previously mentioned.
It's also the same with experienced riders. I just wish people (of all levels!) would be nicer and not be so hell bent on destroying peoples confidence and lives.
I lost my baby after a complete b?!*# drove me to the point of where I broke down sobbing my heart out in the yard, after she smacked my horse, screamed at my mother and hurled abuse at us. In the end I had no choice but to let her go, how can people be so cruel? Why is it that we are either looked down upon, ignored, or suffer abuse like I did. If you're one of those people. tell us why you do it. Have us humans really lost compassion, understanding, love and common sense?
I have nearly been put off the horse world by horse people. But don't get me wrong, there are some fantastic people out there, I just wish I could gather them all together and stick them in a yard!:D
28th Jan 2002, 11:43 AM
Was my post a conversation stopper or something? Is it really that shocking?
Anyone out there???
29th Jan 2002, 08:30 AM
nono i think we are still around :D
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