Old fashioned sayings...origions??

[eml]

I am being 'persuaded' by some of the parents of kids I teach to commit some of the happenings /funny stories to writing with a view to doing a hopefully amusing account of my teaching experiences...from the pony that steals the kids in the viewing gallery's crisps to the whole ride of five year olds who fell off while standing still...yes seriously!! (I think they all wanted the 'falling off bravely' reward having seen one do it!)

Anyway it occurred to me that I use a lot of old phrases without knowing their origion so I wandered if anyone had knowledge...todays example was 'butcher boy seat' . Well obviously legs well in front of seat (to avoid panniers?) but why the butchers boy. Have stories for most of the funny things I come out with but perplexed on this one!

[Little Dolphins]

Perhaps, only the butcher could afford a pony and boy for the deliveries. The baker's boy had a handcart, and the poor old candlestick-maker? Probably a pack on his own back!

Is there a saying: "Sit up, you've got candlestick-maker's back!"?:p

[Whatanejit]

Sorry, no help from me I'm rubbish at that sort of thing.

xx

Dee

[Skib]

eml, I love it that you will write a book.
But about the butcher's boy. Is this really a standard English usage I wonder, or just a local expression among a few class conscious riding teachers, e.g. in the miltary? It is not in the Oxford dictionary.

I am doubtful about it because the seat which is now considered acceptable is very different from that which was used in the 19th c. or up till the First World War. And expressions like armchair seat and hunting seat are used quite loosely today. Next winter I had intened to post some pics of my grandfather's horses and ask about conformation. And I was told by a historian of riding that a groom sat on a horse differently from its owner, in order to show off the horse's body for a photo or for its owner's admiring friends.
My other doubt is that butcher's boys (in general) rode a horse. As opposed to driving one. In Black Beauty the butcher's boy is "bad" as he drives too fast. You can see on this website
http://www.enotes.com/black-beauty-text/80842

Tradesmen, small farmers and market gardeners, used carts. To take their produce into the local town to market, or to deliver to individual households. OH's father as a boy (born 1901) was sent out to catch the horse every morning, but then the horse was harnessed to the cart to take cabbages into Wakefield. For individual deliveries, a bicycle was cheaper than a horse.

I suspect the historians on this Board may be on holiday till the winter? But it would be interesting to hear from them.

[breeches]

it all started in the 1920`s when a butcher was a respected businessman. young boys would start in the butchery at a very young age , wrapping and delivering meats to the local villagers. in those days everything was slauterd and hung in the butchery for up to 2 months to ensure the tenderist of cuts. carcasses were used gradually , when a particular cut was requested , it was hacked off and delivered.
one Famous butcher that was a king amongst butchers was Harrold Skollob, he had a butchery in Manchester, one of the biggest for miles. He had a dozen young boys delivering his wares.
Ham was a popular meat and bacon was fast becoming popular for breakfasts, one saturday, demand was so intense for this new dekightfull thinly cut meat, that he completely ran out.
An order came in for a pound of streaky from a local politician, Harrold being the businessman that he was , feared loosing anyones custom, so instead of loosing face, as he Harolld Skollob always delivers, insted took a slither off each of the delivery boys rumps and sold them as unsmoked streaky.
This obviously effected greatly the comfort of the Butcher boys and made cycling quite a chore for a number of weeks, thus the saying Butcher Boy seat was born........
:D

[Little Dolphins]

As you said,Breeches: Mr. Skollob! :rolleyes:

[RustyMary]

As you said,Breeches: Mr. Skollob! :rolleyes:

Well done Little D - I missed that the first time I read it :D

[bexj]

I got that one too:D Good story though!:D :D :D

[breeches]

anymore sayings that need clarification, im ready to research some more.

[Mimi + Me]

anymore sayings that need clarification, im ready to research some more.
Have you not got any work to do? ;)

[breeches]

Have you not got any work to do? ;)
i am very good at time management, i could say the same for you.!!!!

[Mimi + Me]

i am very good at time management, i could say the same for you.!!!!
:D :D :D I can minimise my screen in 0.000002 seconds ;)

[teabiscuit]

:D :D :D I can minimise my screen in 0.000002 seconds ;)
:D :D
quickest draw in the west :D

[breeches]

:D :D :D I can minimise my screen in 0.000002 seconds ;)
i dont take long to do most things.....:(