Thoroughbred Palominos?

[sheryl]

Can anyone out there settle a friendly dispute I have going with a freind?
I was told by the breeder of my Palomino colt that his breeding is 84% T/B and 16% Arab. My friend says he can't be just T/B and Arab because you need another breed in there for the cream gene to have come from. I know you can't get Arab palominos, but I thought you could get cremello and palomino T/Bs. Therefore you could get a palomino T/B x Arab. If you look on the internet you can find a lot of cremello and palomino T/B stallions at stud, but they all seem to be abroad. Am I right, or are the foreign T/Bs different from our own in Britain? Please help!

[jowyles]

No you cant get pure bred tbs with cream! But then again my sister has been told that the buskskin she rides is NF x arab and the nf was a bay! There is some very early buskin TBs but the line kind of died out they came from the 'dun arabian' I think but this is thought to be a barb or something else! Clear as mud that was!!

[horseygal90]

A Welsh/Arab cross can be palimino - But don't think you'd get a TB or Arab in palomino, not a pure bred at least.

[galadriel]

There are some modern day Jockey Club TB's with the cream gene. There are a lot of pictures out there if you look around. There is even at least one cremello TB stallion.

Here's a few sites of the cream TB stallions:
http://www.angelfire.com/on3/TrueColoursFarm/GG.html
http://www.hollywoodranch.com/
http://www.redfoxfarmtx.com/princecharming.htm
http://www.redfoxfarmtx.com/gpinfo.html
http://www.redfoxfarmtx.com/eldorado.html

They can't be *registered* as palomino; their papers say they're chestnut (probably). But you can also get a sabino TB who can't be registered as a pinot; they are registered as whatever their body color is. There's a few papered TB sabinos out there with tobiano-looking markings who're registered as "bay" etc.

Here's a "Paint" TB:
http://www.redfoxfarmtx.com/timelyinfo.html

[jenren!!]

El Dorado is stunning!!

Jenny xx

[chev]

Lots of palomino TBs (http://www.angelfire.com/on3/TrueColoursFarm/Dilute_TB_Palominos.html)! Tobiano doesn't occur in the breed, but if you browse that site you'll find sabinos, overos, dilutes, black, brindles and all manner of weird spotty stuff!

So while your friend is quite right that cream does not occur in Arabs, it does indeed crop up in TBs. Probably not that common, but it's there.

[sheryl]

Thank you to all of you, especially Galadriel who obviously did some research for me:) I had already seen the amazing colours of T/Bs on www.angelfire.com. It also has a picture of the first known palomino T/B! I'm especially glad Galadriel found the Jockey Club registered ones. Maybe this will convince my friend. I think they are obviously very rare. Maybe there aren't actually any in Britain. I can't see that the horse that they call a T/B in America is any different to our own, but I'm sure my friend will argue that point!
My Palomino also has Sabino markings. That will give my friend something to chew on!
P.s. Hollywood Ranch's "Sunny" is absolutely stunning!!

[horseygal90]

I stand corrected - I never knew you could get pally TB's.

[EmmaRotherham]

I was taught that you couldn't get a pure TB in anything other than bay, brown, black or grey... and that anything other HAD to have been crossed somewhere down the line with something else.. and (not to sound biased but..) it was mainly an american tb cross that americans 'pretended' was a 'pure' TB.. just the views i'd picked up

but hey.. learn something new every day! And i'm always open to change! (esp such a pretty one!)

[galadriel]

did some research for me:)

Ah, I'd visited the various sites before. I like the unusually colored TB's. They amuse me.

Recall that the TB isn't so much a breed as a mix that was made over many, many years. The original requirement to call a horse a TB was that the horse in question was a descendant of one of 3 stallions. The books are closed now so you can only get a registered TB from two registered parents...but before they closed the books, the TB was pretty much a horse bred for speed from ANY horse that the owner happened to want to breed. Got a nice mare? Breed her to this stallion...or that stallion...or the other... Thoroughbreds are, indeed, thoroughly bred...and nothing like a "pure" breed of any kind.

Unusual colors pop up in a lot of breeds where you wouldn't expect them. Only a very few breeds have absolute known color limitations.

[joey_olop]

There are some modern day Jockey Club TB's with the cream gene. There are a lot of pictures out there if you look around. There is even at least one cremello TB stallion.

Here's a few sites of the cream TB stallions:
http://www.angelfire.com/on3/TrueColoursFarm/GG.html
http://www.hollywoodranch.com/
http://www.redfoxfarmtx.com/princecharming.htm
http://www.redfoxfarmtx.com/gpinfo.html
http://www.redfoxfarmtx.com/eldorado.html

They can't be *registered* as palomino; their papers say they're chestnut (probably). But you can also get a sabino TB who can't be registered as a pinot; they are registered as whatever their body color is. There's a few papered TB sabinos out there with tobiano-looking markings who're registered as "bay" etc.

Here's a "Paint" TB:
http://www.redfoxfarmtx.com/timelyinfo.html


I like RFF Sun King from Hollywood Ranch he is stunning :)

[racing chick]

tbs and arabs are closely related