Lucy Rees.

[Giveitago]

I am reading a fab book by the author Lucy Rees, Riding-The True Techniques. Really great riding lesson, all explained and very horse friendly. This book was first published in 1991 and shows that she really is one of the horse lovers of the world.

I was fortunate enough to come across Lucy's books when I picked up a bargain at my local charity shop for 50p, I think it was The Horses Mind. (loaned out at the mo)which contains great info on what tail swishes, grooming signals, foals, all mean/do.

Does anyone know of other titles by this great horsewoman, wheher she is still alive, riding, doing demos etc. From the pictures in the books I think she's only just old enough to retire and I think she is British.

I would love to know.

[carrieh]

Wow, there's a name from the past! I remember reading 'The Horse's Mind' back in the mid 1980's. I've done a quick Google and found a list of her books on her agent's website. You could always contact her agent and ask about her?

Agent: Pat Kavanagh
Assistant: Carol Macarthur - cmacarthur@pfd.co.uk

[Giveitago]

Yep, I tried the link, but cant find out where Lucy is now.

Does any one know her whereabouts and whether she is still doing demos?

[ambatt]

As far as I know she is living and working in Portugal, She gave a demonstration at SICAB (the big grading and Iberian horse get together) in 1998 but i can't find much since then.

http://www.thejoyofhorses.com/march99/rees.htm

[ambatt]

She is still around, this is from a speech she gave at an Animal Behaviour Conference in South Africa 2004, I think she would be mortified at being described as a Natural Horsemanship practioner - she is an animal behaviourist.

"Natural" training methods can produce results so spectacular as to be an exhibitionist’s delight. It is not difficult to render the horse completely passive and, in order to impress, work him to the point where he is no longer actively cooperating and learning but passively allowing himself to be pushed about. This satisfies some, but increasingly those with a critical eye see a dullness, a lack of interest, in horses whose imprint, Parelli or round pen training has been overdone. In any kind of training, one of the most difficult sensibilities to acquire is that of knowing when to stop. [...] Although it has been shown that in horses a) under natural conditions dominance hierarchies are so poorly developed as to be invisible, needing artificially created competition to develop, and b) in partially managed groups, the leader and the dominant are not necessarily the same animal, there is a reluctance on the parts of both trainers and some scientists to aabandon human attitudes about dominance. We live in a highly competitive society, where power hierarchies, status struggles and so on are heavily emphasized. A truly cooperative, non-hierarchical, non-authoritarian social structure is inconceivable to many, although we see it on a smaller scale every day. Thus many round pen trainers believe that the technique is a psychological way of demonstrating dominance over the horse, who is driven away every time he does not comply with what is wanted, but then comes to us for leadership and submits to our control. In the light of the above this is muddled thinking, which results, as my friend Amy Coffman (a thoughtful and experienced watcher of American ‘natural’ trainers) has pointed out, in a punitive way of using the round pen: the horse is made to gallop about until he submits. I, too, have seen this aggressive attitude in some pupils who have learned from others. The only round pen trainer I know of who differentiates between the roles played by dominant and leader is Mark Rashid, who probably (I am guessing) has not read the scientific literature but is an acute and dispassionate observer. It is a curious state of affairs when those who know that dominant attitudes repel horses fail to grasp its true significance: that horses do not obey dominants. They avoid them.

[Yann]

Like her style and she makes some very good points :) Will have to read more.

[janet hakeney]

She is currently living in Spain. A mutual friend went to stay with her earlier this year. She lives a somewhat 'alternative' lifestyle.

[Iron Maiden]

Did anyone see the TV programme she did a few years ago? She tamed & broke a wild mustang using her kind methods, while the local folk used their methods. First thing they did after catching the horses was castrate the colts with no anaesthetic:mad: . That was why she decided to work with a filly. Cut to the chase was she ended up with this lovely, well adjusted horse who adored her, unlike the others. Some of it was very upsetting but it was a fab programme & I have been a big fan of hers ever since. The Horse's Mind should be compulsory reading for all would-be horse owners!

[alfi-social]

I do so agree!! I have "Understanding Your Pony " as well as "The Horses Mind"
and that is very very good- sounds like its aimed at kids but its not- its for everyone!! Some lovely accounts in there of adventures with her ponies in Wales.
My daughter and I also read a novel by her, seemed somewhat autobiographical,
about a teenage girl growing up in Wales and her Welsh D stallion and this long
journey they did together. We loved it. I am a huge fan !
Alfi

[carrieh]

I've just read Whispering Back by Nicole Golding and Adam Goodfellow. Lucy Rees was a hero of Nicole's and once they both drove round Wales trying to find where she lived. In the book, Nicole describes how she did the intelligent horsemanship courses with Monty Roberts/Kelly Marks, and at one of those courses they had Lucy Rees as a guest speaker. In her conversation with Lucy Rees, Lucy didn't seem to be particularly struck by Monty Roberts' methods.

[ambatt]

See the quote from Lucy in my post - she certainly is not a fan of some methods/trainers...

[Giveitago]

Ambatt, thanks for the input.

The thread wasnt designed to upset anyone. I mearly wanted to find out if there were any other interesting books that I hadn't come across.

My appologies for not using the correct terminology for Lucy, unfortunately I do not know what everyone prefers to call themselves, and really, it doesnt matter to me whether they call themselves wonderhorse, it's the credibility of their writing and demos that I base judgement on.

[ambatt]

Personally I would stick with Lucy Rees. Eeek! I am far from upset I do not follow any particular school of NH or whatever, because it does not engage me particularly! However, Lucy Rees does appeal for her sound behaviourist principles and I think she makes some thought provoking comments especially about dominance and the round pen.

In fact you make me want to go back and re-read her books, it has been too long. Thanks for bringing her to the fore again Giveitago - Lucy Rees was doing a lot of exciting things before NH became a huge commercial venture.

I do remember the TV documentary now - I can remember the grunts of pain from the stallion gelded without anaesthetic, it was heartbreaking.

[ambatt]

PS I do have a sneaking regard for Mark Rashid...
My trainer has been on clinics with him and passes on his good sound common sense.

[julia gulia]

The Horses Mind by Lucy Rees was recommended to me by Chev and I can't thank her enough...I have now ordered two more of her books:) . Thanks Chev!!!!!

[Bling]

I have to add my praise for Luxy Rees! I bought a pony who turned out to be an attacker: teeth, hooves, charging, the works. After watching him from a distance (and I'd just gotten Rees's book) I tentatively diagnosed him as "neurotic" and decided I'd play it safe, but that I would NOT punish him for anything, only reward the good. IT WORKED! I kept everything simple and very, very consistent. It was a long, interesting adventure, and he became my very best friend. (His problem, I think: too smart, and previous short, intensive schooling that didn't carry through.)

[oldbushy]

You mentioned about the tail swishing.. I'd be interested to know what this reflects. My quiet gentle youngster sometimes does this when he's getting a light brush at tea time. I'm presuming it means " just letting you know I
still have ssssome authority" or something similar

[Skib]

Having read this thread, I noticed at a children's book meeting today, "Horse of Air" by Lucy Rees, Faber 1980. Is this the same Lucy?
The jacket blurb says she wrote a previous book for children called "Wild Pony".
I bought it anyway.

[Iron Maiden]

Thank you! Since posting I on this thread I've been trying to remember the book by her I read when I was a kid, it was Wild Pony! I absolutely loved that book, it made me cry but had a fantastic happy ending, I even drew my own pictures to illustrate it!

Maybe I shouldn't admit that in public....

[Brychen]

hello

had to post i have wild pony puffin books 1978 paperback. it is very very dog eared and I still read it if I am a bit down or upset ( the other one I resort to is pride and predjudice!)v. important for me as it is the main reason i own my Brychen as he is virtuall identical to the pony on the cover!!! he also has the same mind set as the pony in the book. the genral ethos was to have a pony that wanted to do what you wanted to do but still was itself at heart.

Theres a bit in the book where the pony outruns two fit riding hroses ( and then books the heroine off..) always makes me smile as my 14.3 hh welsh Brychen at 16 can still keep up and out trot eventers when they are cantering...

sad to say I am in my 40's as well...

[Giveitago]

oldbushy,

Tail swishing,

If my horse was tail swishing when eating I would leave him well alone. It generally means back off. You'll notice how a horse swishes its tail in displeasure and generally is one of the first warning signs. Watch a herd in the field and you'll see this happen alot.

However, it may be that he is just enjoying the grooming, Where are his ears focused?

I cant look up the tail swishing in Lucys book as It's leant out at the mo- acn anyone else help?

[Skib]

I am pretty cowardly about walking behind any horse and, walking directly behind a mare in my long lining lesson, worried she was swishing her tail.

My RI told me she was swishing off the flies. She had never kicked anyone. And indeed the horse did seem very relaxed and responsive. I think one can tell when a horse is. She is a horse one falls in love with. Even when her tail ended up the wrong side of the rope she just flicked it back over again.

So may be your horse is happy too?

[wedney]

Hi

I would just like to say I also love Lucy rees. I too have the True Techniques (and Wild Pony). True techniques was very influential on me and I did try her 'homemade' bitless bridle from a drop noseband and reins. My pony and I did everything in it.