What do you call this colour ?

[KateWooten]

What's the name for this colour ?

http://www.equinecolor.com/photos/buckskinsmutty.jpg

[Shadowlark]

red X in a white box...

LOL sorry - couldn't resist! The link isn't working ;)

[RobaDob]

same here...just a x in the box

[CurlyWurlyRach]

yup im getting a red X too.

[KateWooten]

oops ... I'll find another ...

[julia gulia]

I thought it was a trick question:p

[jowyles]

looks sooty buckskin to me

[julia gulia]

looks sooty buckskin to me

Are you doing that via mental telepathy?????:D

[KateWooten]

here ...
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f135/joePony/buckskinsmutty.jpg

[palmerlover52]

Buckskin :confused:

lol *calls* Chevvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv!!!!!

[Holly B]

WOW, he's GORGEOUS! Sort of a dappledy half bay half dunny kind of thing... yes, I am an expert, and those are the correct scientific words... :D

[KateWooten]

hmmm.. it shows up for me both times too now ... odd. Anyway - sooty buckskin ... is it a nice colour ?

[KateWooten]

Sort of a dappledy half bay half dunny kind of thing Ezzzzzackerly what I'd have called it too ! (highly technical aren't we) ... it's the closest I can get to the color of this little welsh-type mare I'm thinking of ... is this a color that is even possible in a welsh pony ? Well, to give you an idea how expert we are over here at British natives, the pony I'm thinking of buying (and that's not a picture of her) is being sold as a Connemara - well, she's not like any Connemara I've ever seen ...

[RobaDob]

looks like a dunny/bay/dapply colour :rolleyes: lol.

[Mehitabel]

'pretty'.

[jowyles]

Yes you can get welshies in sooty buckskin! Its lovely!

[Herbie's mummy]

chocolate dun :)

[julia gulia]

Sooty Buckskin.

[Herbie's mummy]

That horse has a long back for the size of the pony LOL.....sorry random:)

[chev]

Sooty or smutty buckskin. Basically a dark bay with teh cream gene, and yes, both Welsh and Connies can be that colour since both breeds carry cream. :)

It's not dun. And neither Connies nor Welsh carry dun either :D

[CanadianRider]

Gorgeous, I think that the little mare that I'm riding is that colour, I'll have to get some pictures, she's a little different though.

[Lot1983]

I'd say it was a bay, looks like it's in very bright light which will cause all the pattern in the coat to show up, kind of irrelevant but we had a cat with a similar colour, very pretty!:D :D

[clarejones]

my connemara stallion is similar in colour to her his coat changes colour in winter he goes a lighter shade in summer darker he is down as a dark dun but i think the proper wording is buckskin in his case and he is carying the creme gene as we have had him tested his off spring tend to be golden dun he also has really nice amber eyes www.claresconnemaras.com

[Shanik]

I had a little Connemara x mare who was similiar in colour when I was a teenager, not a great photo but its an old one and she did show quite a lot of connemara characteristics and personality

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d195/Lioness1970/Horses/2006-03-04-1448-36_edited.jpg

[Shanik]

I meant to say there is a reddish tone to the photo which is due to it being enhanced, she had more of a buckskin colour to her lighter parts.

[KateWooten]

Now .. .not to change the subject too far ... but when I was looking for the color, it was because I'd seen a tiny horse in a field who was just beautiful, and I came home and tried to find from memory a picture of a similar color. Well,... you know how these things are... I didn't get a very good match, and one thing and another .... the tiny horse is now in my barn :) SOooo......... the real question is what do you call THIS colour .....?

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f135/joePony/littleDoll.jpg

It's a buckskin, right ? But a dark one ? I'm used to buckskin looking like pale yellow - like palomino yellow - only with dark points. This is kind of mixed colours all over - all different browns all in together, and then the fawn colors on her flanks etc. (feel free to say 'ahhh ... what a little doll' all over again cos she's such a little sweetheart ... something about having a tiny pony - it's like having a newborn baby - everything about her is cute and little :D)

[xXSundanceBayXx]

It's not dun. And neither Connies nor Welsh carry dun either :D


does that mean jimmy is a buckskin?? :D

[skewpie]

Isnt "buckskin" the American term for the english "dun"

[Hallmarked]

I would have said chocolate dun.

Sooty or smutty buckskin. Basically a dark bay with teh cream gene, and yes, both Welsh and Connies can be that colour since both breeds carry cream. :)

It's not dun. And neither Connies nor Welsh carry dun either :D

I had a TB X connemara that I always thought was dun.:confused:
As dun is supposidly extinct in the TB I assumed he got his colour from the connemara side.
All my paperwork for him said dun - does this mean I owned a horse for over 12 years and didn't know what colour he was?:eek:

What is the difference between dun and buckskin? I thought buckskin was the American name for dun as well, like sorrel and chestnut. I understood that dun was a black or bay horse with a dilution gene. How does the cream gene work?

If it's any help my horse had dark chocolate points, rather than black, but did go very dark when he was changing his coat in the spring. I would post photos but I haven't got the hang of it yet. Sorry if I'm hijacking this thread - but on the same theme:D

[Herbie's mummy]

You can get dun connies:S?....

[bubblegum]

I have a Buckskin TB x Conn mare, creamy yellow with black points. When clipped she is an amazing chocolatey minky colour.

I thought "true" Duns had to have a stripe?

[Herbie's mummy]

A dorsle stripe?

[bubblegum]

Dorsal stripe, yes. Runs along the back to the tail. Mine does not have one. Passport says Dun, but a friend who is into colour genes (currently studying to be a Vet) insists she is only Buckskin.

[Herbie's mummy]

I know a ton of duns with no stripe?
duno!!

[bubblegum]

I don't understand too. My mare had a Dun foal, and her own mother was Dun or Buckskin or whatever. Either way I love Duns:) (or Buckskins:D )

[Herbie's mummy]

I ardore duns!

[chev]

Ok.... :D Let's try and clarify this a bit!

First off, buckskin is not the American term for dun, no. Dun is caused by the dun gene, and can be present in absolutely any colour (not just bay and black) and buckskin is caused by the cream gene. Dun and buckskin are completely different dilutions caused by completely different genes.

The confusion in the UK arose because of teh way we used the term dun; anything goldenish with dark points was called dun. So there are thousands of Welsh and Connemara ponies registered as dun when they are not; there is no dun gene in either breed. They are indeed misidentified buckskins.

A buckskin is a by horse with a cream dilute gene. One cream dilute gene causes red coat to become golden in colour, but has very little or no effect on black pigment. So on a bay horse, cream causes the body to go golden and teh points to stay black. On a black horse, it's very difficult to see the effect of one cream gene, although many do go a dark chocolatey colour. On a chestnut horse with one cream gene the points (which are not black!) are also diluted; they are palominos.

Two cream genes has a very different effect. It's teh same gene, but when a horse carries two copies, it dilutes coat and skin to near-white and pink, and the eyes are blue. These horses are cremellos, perlinos, and smoky blacks (also known as blue-eyed creams). These horses were often mistaken for albinos in teh UK; in fact albinism has never been documented in horses.

The Connemara society won't register blue-eyed creams, although it will register palominos (as palomino) and buckskins (as dun).

This (http://www.newrider.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47377) thread gives a clearer description of the differences between duns and buckskins.

Dun Central Station (http://www.duncentralstation.com/) is the best dun site I know, and should explain better than I can (they have lots of piccies! :D ) why the horse Kate posted is not dun, and why all those 'duns with no stripe' were not dun at all but buckskin. :)

[Hallmarked]

Chev,

Thank you for your answer and the link to Dun Central Station.

From veiwing this my horse was mis-identified as a dun when really he was a buckskin of orange-gold shade with counter shading dorsal stripe;) He counter shaded over his whole body, with his old coat, starting at his head and working backwards during coat changes (especially Spring) but his new coat would come through golden shade.

No matter, he was a very beautiful horse anyway, and very much missed.

Another dun / buckskin fan:)

[Mehitabel]

ooh hallmarked - did your chap look like my old git in spring?

http://historicalfact.com/~es/pony%20pictures/chopfunnycolour.jpg

his bum is his winter coat and his muzzle is just going his orange summer coat. only his front half goes dark brown though.

[Hallmarked]

Mehitabel

Thanks for the picture. Yes just like that. I'm sure he's not an old git though - with that sweet face:)

But all of him went like that, but not all at once, it was like a band of dark colour, started at the front end working backwards. There would be a few days of when he was tacked up he would be a sort of dark bay/brown colour in his front half and a sort of dun/buckskin behind the saddle. Like two horses different coloured horses stuck together in the middle.

Just before he bum went dark, he used to get dark dapples/splodgy bits on it. I didn't get much chance to compare, as I knew another dun/buckskin at my yard but I didn't notice him go through the 'dark' stage.

[yazandsoph]

i dont know if you found out already as couldnt b bothered to read all this but isnt it like chocolate dun type???:confused:

[chev]

If you *could* be bothered to read it all you might learn something! ;)

[Mehitabel]

Mehitabel

Thanks for the picture. Yes just like that. I'm sure he's not an old git though - with that sweet face:)

But all of him went like that, but not all at once, it was like a band of dark colour, started at the front end working backwards. There would be a few days of when he was tacked up he would be a sort of dark bay/brown colour in his front half and a sort of dun/buckskin behind the saddle. Like two horses different coloured horses stuck together in the middle.

Just before he bum went dark, he used to get dark dapples/splodgy bits on it. I didn't get much chance to compare, as I knew another dun/buckskin at my yard but I didn't notice him go through the 'dark' stage.

weird! i have never seen another like that. i see you're in hampshire; we're in the new forest - what breed was your chap? copper does just moult like that - his front half moults in dark brown over a few days and his back half moults in silvery, after he is pale gold all winter, and the hairs are about half the length of his winter coat too. then he loses all of it and goes orange in summer.

the mexican wave effect must have been amazing!

[Lusitanolou]

Fab thread. I have learnt so much. Really didn't realise about the genes. Thanks

[Hallmarked]

weird! i have never seen another like that. i see you're in hampshire; we're in the new forest - what breed was your chap? copper does just moult like that - his front half moults in dark brown over a few days and his back half moults in silvery, after he is pale gold all winter, and the hairs are about half the length of his winter coat too. then he loses all of it and goes orange in summer.

the mexican wave effect must have been amazing!

My horse was a Connemara x TB. Like yours his winter coat was really woolly but he was really sleek in summer. Orangey in summer and creamy gold in winter. Perhaps is't something in the water in the Southampton area:D :D :D

Because of the difference in coat lengths I thought he looked like a well used teddy bear in spring.

25406

Changing coat in the spring with summer coat 'mask' and dark band over neck and shoulders.

25407

Summer coat, with a few remaining winter hairs hanging on under his chin.

Hope these pictures come out OK. - Just checked colour reproduction not that brilliant but gives an idea. The funny face in the second picture is because he's chewing a carrot.

[yazandsoph]

If you *could* be bothered to read it all you might learn something!


yes i agree but with so many posts and having horses so little time sometimes i have to skip im sure you understand i would be on here all night if i was to read every word:rolleyes:

[ImaLittleBoston]

Well, theres a horse down the road from us, registered as a dun, looking like that, But it could be some sort of Olive grulla?
http://greenfield.fortunecity.com/dreams/799/hc/horsecolors.htm

[KateWooten]

Whew ... this thread has run on a bit !!

Ok, now I'm over there studying the different genes and stuff .. on the DUN page - dun gene diluting bay - the effects are variable it seems, from outright yellowy horse with a dorsal stripe and zebra markings, right through there is a 'Peanut butter dun' ... http://greenfield.fortunecity.com/dreams/799/hc/dun6pnut.jpg
which just looks like a bay. Now, is it right that any little bay mare with a very noticeable dorsal stripe, is likely to be actually a dun ? I'm thinking of my Rosie who is registered as bay, but she's much brighter than a usual bay - and with that stripe. Well, exactly like in the pic here, actually.

Ok, Gwen, the little velvety brown pony with the mealy muzzle and eyes like an exmoor pony looks quite close to 'Grulla'
Grulla :
http://greenfield.fortunecity.com/dreams/799/hc/grulla8foal.jpg

Gwen:
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f135/joePony/muckStable.jpg
well, except the face is wrong.

Grulla, which is black diluted by dun, has a black face. Gwen's face is dark basically, but with very distinct fawn markings - and the mealy muzzle and toad eyes. She's definitely not buckskin though - she has the dorsal stripe.

[julia gulia]

Kate? You haven't posted an update on Gwen. How is she doing and do you have any recent photos of her????:)