New Trainer Critique Please

[Whatanejit]

Hi guys.

I got all I wanted from this thread.

thanks.

[Afellpony]

I used a trainer that used 'natural' training methods on Falcon, starting with the round pen and long reining before comencing ridden work. No artificial aids were used and he's turned out fine. (I definitely didn't want a Germanic style of training).

[LindaAd]

Nice pictures - did you take them? And have you got the trainer's permission to post them on here and ask for comments? If not, I think I'd be rather un-chuffed if I were that trainer.

I think the only way you can tell if the trainer is going to be right for you and Cooper is to have a couple of lessons and see how they go.

[Whatanejit]

Snap - but what do you think of the vids?

[LindaAd]

Too far away to be able to say much, and it's impossible to comment anyway on someone so much further on than I am. And we know nothing about the horse, how old it is, whether it's hers - oh yes, sorry, you said it's hers - what its history is, or what.

There was a nice canter transition in the second one, with a very clear and visible aid. I'd guess from that that it's a youngish horse, as it probably would be if it's hers and doing unaffiliated Novice in any case.

[fitz]

I am not an expert at all, and dont want to grill someone I dont know, but I'm not gone on the vids. I wont go into why (as it will betray my ignorance as well as everything else)
That said, that doesnt necessarily mean you shouldnt give her a go for a couple of lessons.

[Keket]

The rider seemed to be bumping the horse with the spurs at every stride, something that I can't stand. Either that, or she's got a very unstable lower leg. I certainly wouldn't let anyone get on my horse if they were doing that.

[julia gulia]

Hi Dee! I have found that some instructors are great riders but don't teach well and some are not so pretty to watch but give a great lesson. Some excel at both! When is your first lesson?

[teabiscuit]

if you give her a try and see how she goes?
one bad lesson won't hurt Cooperman too much as long as it ends there, and she may be good.
then you have a chance to see what your instincts say about her :)

[The Flying Irishman]

I agree with teabiscuit, tbh the horse looked to be going really well and she appeared to be riding it well.

Kath x

[Skyhuntress]

Not something I'd look for in a trainer-her position isn't that great, the horse is above the vertical, and she's got quite an unsteady leg. But I guess it's all relative to what you had before and what you want out of the horse.


I don't know what level she rides at, but as a rule, I never train with someone who isn't at least 2 levels ahead of me-otherwise I don't think that they can teach me enough.

And by the way, germanic form of riding is considered THE classical riding, along with variations of French and Portuguese :) The rest is usually labelled as natural.

But give her a try! You can always pull out of if you find you don't like her style or the results.

[teabiscuit]

And by the way, germanic form of riding is considered THE classical riding, along with variations of French and Portuguese :) The rest is usually labelled as natural.

how about the greek? wasn't Xenophon greek? and lets not forget the spanish lippizaners! (sp)

[Skyhuntress]

how about the greek? wasn't Xenophon greek? and lets not forget the spanish lippizaners! (sp)

That's true ;) Forgot about them-and I shouldn't, since I had to sit through a 2 hour CD of the style LOL. So long as they base themselves on the Scale of Training, they are considered classical.

[Pink's lady]

Not particualrly a fan of her riding (hands bobbing about all over the place) but there is little correlation between how well people ride and how well they teach. So you won't know until you have a lesson - she could be the most fantastic teacher ever.

As for Classical versus 'germanic' I think of 'classical' as the spanish school of riding (horse really sitting down, weight on back legs, shoulders up and lifted and poll highest point with the face on a perfect vertical not that improtant) and the 'germanic' as 'modern' dressage (big flashy strides, neck curled in with rollkur/drawreins, incorrect extention/collection etc.). Guess which one I'm a fan of;). But it's all words - just because your a moderned-day ride doesn't mean you're not riding correctly and working your horses in the 'classic' style as I see it.

[hobnob]

The rider seemed to be bumping the horse with the spurs at every stride, something that I can't stand. Either that, or she's got a very unstable lower leg. I certainly wouldn't let anyone get on my horse if they were doing that.

ECHO!

there is no need for that what so ever!

[teabiscuit]

The rider seemed to be bumping the horse with the spurs at every stride, something that I can't stand. Either that, or she's got a very unstable lower leg. I certainly wouldn't let anyone get on my horse if they were doing that.

i don't think they were, in my opinion, they were just moving because she was, if you know what i mean, i could not see actual contact with the spurs that often.

[hobnob]

i don't think they were, in my opinion, they were just moving because she was, if you know what i mean, i could not see actual contact with the spurs that often.

There was still alot of movement in the lower leg, regardless of weather it was intentional or not, If it was not intentional, i woudl be concerned about having a rider on a horse with that much leg control(or lack of). wareing spurs!

[Whatanejit]

Thanks for all your comments so far folks.

Just to clarify, though.

This person will be SCHOOLING Cooper mainly. I go externally to a classical teacher.

I will have a few lessons with her only to make sure I am in sink with what she is doing with Cooper.

Now that he is out of work for another month, and then it will take me a month of walking and gentle trotting I don't think she will be riding him until Jan/Feb by the looks of things.

In her defence, she never schools in spurs, just wears them when competing. I was watching her like a hawk on the day and the spurs really were not used all that often.

Thanks again.

[Pink's lady]

There's nothing there that makes me go 'OMG - get her off the horse!' but her sitting trot isn't that great (although the looks very bouncy). But neither is mine right now :o so I can't criticise. The rest of her riding might be really good.

Once he's back in work you could ask her to come as a one off and say you've got a couple of people coming and you'd like to see how she gets on with him. Or ask for a lesson on him and give her a chance to ride him as well.

[Whatanejit]

Will do PL - I have a list of freelance people in the area from my Intelligent Horsemanship membership.

I am very precious about my boy as we all are about our horses.:confused:

Fortunately, I will be in the position to watch her ride for the first while until I 'trust' her and then, hopefully she will school during the week leaving us to hack at the weekend.

Thanks again.

[HorseManiac]

The spurs are there for a training aid.

Theres nothing wrong with spurs unless you use them INCORRECTLY.

Anneli x

[carthorse]

I wouldn't let her ride Jim - too unsteady in her leg & too busy in her hand for him. At "best" he may get used to it but I wouldn't want him to!

[asha]

She does look like she's a bit handy, although to be fair I think the pressure of a dressage test brings that fault out in some people.
Wouldn't you consider schooling Cooper yourself under supervision, with the RI just sitting on him 10 mins or so each time to iron out any problems?

IMO there is little point having your horse regularly schooled by someone you don't intend to take your main training from. I'd watch a few others ride and then make a decision.

Good luck anyway, your boy is v.handsome by the way.

[DavidH]

...

[asha]

Well done David H, for being brave enough to say what i'm sure many others were thinking!

[Whatanejit]

Thanks guys - I was looking for honesty so triple thanks to you David.

Mmmmmmmmmmm.


http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f270/Whatanejit/Smilies/19.gif

[carrimclaren]

Would have to agree with DavidH :o She rides like i imagine i do but i'm a novice so i'm expected to have faults :p
She seems to be a little heavy handed in trying to get a contact but the horse seems to be leaning a little instead of collecting up as she's not really got a correct leg on him so he's not really using himself that well, although he looks like he's got a nice trot if he was collected up a little more.
I think as someone else said, sometimes you get instructors whose ability is in teaching and not the actual practical. If you studied my friend when she's jumping you'd be horrified at her lack of judging a stride on horseback (she's a great jumper but just isn't textbook is her way of saying). Put her on the ground and she's the most marvellous teacher who gets wonderful results. It always does get difficult when it comes to our horses as we get strangely over-protective about who gets on :) I'm the same even though my riding skills are not really too great.

[LindaAd]

Am I the only one who thinks that this whole thread is first of all a bit sneaky, and secondly just rude?


If I were a trainer and I found out that someone had done this to me, and if that someone then came and said "No thanks, I don't want you to ride my horse, you're not a good enough rider", I would suggest politely that since they know so much more than me, they would be better off training their own horse.

[Lot1983]

Maybe we should introduce some 'guidelines' about offering critiques of a third parties riding methods/techniquie via the medium of photos and videos:

Although it is good to get advice on subjects like this, surely their a certain legal issues involved, slander/libel (Libel is written isn't it?)

There has been a case in the news recently where a parenting message board was threaten with closure by a woman who's methods were slated. That board is now banned from discussing them. It is something we should all be aware of as what would we all do without NR?

If indeed the instructor had posted the video and asked for a critique that would be a different matter.

Not having a go at anyone, I understand that people only want the best for their horse, but certain things, sadly should only be conducted out of the view of the public eye.

x

[Mehitabel]

does she know you've posted videos on her on the internet for criticism? i'd be spitting bricks if i found out anyone had done that to me - look at all the sympathy hobnob (quite rightly) received the other day when someone did the same to her.

[teabiscuit]

sorry but i don't think she was that bad, the horse was going nice and rhythmically, she wsn't hanging on to its mouth as far as i could see and she wasn't jabbing it with spurs each step. we don't know how well that horse was going for that horse-it may only just have been broken in yesterday, in which case she's a star!
admittedly she had faults, but hey who doesn't?
and from that vid, how on earth can we say she can't teach, which is what the origanal question was, was it not?

[julia gulia]

I have to agree.........She may be a great teacher . Apart from that point......I wonder if it makes us all feel better to slam other people and their skill level. We all do our best, don't we? I admire people who get on their horse...ride the best they can and have a good time. Hopefully...this instructor would read these responses and think to herself......I couldn't care less what other people think :) Unfortunately...that probably wouldn't be the case. She'd probably read them and be hurt or wonder why she should even be on a horse.:o

[Skyhuntress]

The difference being that she is labelling herself as an instructor. If she was saying that she was just a rider looking to school horses for other people, different story entirely. But she's not. She's labelling herself as a trainer.

[julia gulia]

And she may be an outstanding trainer:)

[Whatanejit]

Thanks all for your responses.


To those of you who were concerned I am well aware of the rules for posting on NR and have not broken any of them.



Most of the people who I hoped would respond have by via either this post or pm and I thankyou again.

There are a few others who have not been on line for a while and whom I may pm for their opinion.


Take care.

[Mehitabel]

it's nothing to do with the rules of the board - surely it's common courtesy not to post videos of someone else on the internet for all and sundry to see and invite criticism of them without their permission.

[Laura+Phantom]

6) Canter transition made from outside leg.


Sorry but can you please explain what's wrong with that? That's how i've always been taught to do it..although more recently I was taught to almost turn to the outside (bring outside hip back, inside forward) aswell.

(Not arguing with you, I genuinely want to know :o )

[Whatanejit]

It has everything to do with the rules of the board.

You are supposed to have their permission

[julia gulia]

Did she know it was going to be critiqued?

[LindaAd]

It has everything to do with the rules of the board.

You are supposed to have their permission


Are you telling us you did have her permission?
I think julia gulia's question is very relevant.
And so is this rule:

8. Comments on other people/trainers/businesses - please ask for private comments via email or the PM system if you are seeking others experiences of particualr people or businesses. It is not fair or balanced to discuss them in public.



Did she know it was going to be critiqued?

[Whatanejit]

I repeat!

'To those of you who were concerned I am well aware of the rules for posting on NR and have not broken any of them'.

Now, if you don't like the thread go and read something else and stop bullying!!!!

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f270/Whatanejit/Smilies/Angry/asskick.gif

[Mehitabel]

and i repeat - my concern is not for the rules of NR - it's for the invasion of this person's privacy, which is common courtesy and nothing to do with breaking any rules.

[chev]

Closing this until the moderators have a chance to discuss this issue.

In the meantime perhaps people could refrain from posting videos or pictures of third parties for critiques of any kind, regardless of whether or not permission has or has not been given.

Posting pictures or videos of yourselves is welcome; but I am concerned about the number of threads recently inviting critiques of others.