please can some one help me with feeding.

[iluvpin]

hi

i have a few feed related questions to ask. i hope this is the right place.

i have a 22yr old mare that i still regularly ride, the problem is she is a laminetic(sp) but very hard to keep weight on, and through the winter she lacks energy a bit when ridden (summer shes fine).

so my question is what would be suitable to feed her to help her gain some weight but also give her a little bit more energy, but not cause her trouble with her laminitus(sp).

she is currenlty fed safe and sound, sixteen plus mix and will soon have sugar beet aswell. she is left out 24/7 and when grass is lacking they will have hay in the field. last year she done okish weight wise but could have done with a little more energy i think.

any help would be much appreciated.
thank you in advance
lozzie an pinxx

[martini55]

I can't really comment too much so sorry but if I was you I would use an unmollassed beet like speedi beet if your mare is laminitic as it has less than 5% sugar. I am sure there will be more informative replies :) I sympathise though, as I have a laminitic mare and it can be so difficult when it comes to feeding.

[iluvpin]

hey

thanks for the reply. we are hoping to change to speedi beet this winter i think as it will make it easier with the soaking as well as being better for pin.

BUMP anyone else?

thank you.
lozzie an pinxx

[FudgieFoo]

You could try adding oil to her feed. Its a good source of slow realising energy and helps with weight without adding sugar.

[puzzles]

yay - i love feedig queries, it's my specialist area!
i know a mare exactly like yours, hun.
i suggest that yuo begin to wean your mare off the veteran mix and at the same time gradually introduce either a veteran cube, or a veteran fibre-based concentrate (i recommend Dengie Senior), especially if your mare begins to have trouble eating the mix (cubes can be soaked into a mash to make chewing and digestion easier). as Dengie Senior takes a long time to digest yet is low in calories, it releases slow-release energy, keeping yuor horse's temprement even but maintaining her condition without weigh gain.

one of the most important things you can do is add a digestive-enhancer supplement to your horse's daily feed, such as Dengie Triple-Action (one of the best) or Yea-Sacc, or NAF Pink Powder(google them). These will include yeasts, pro-biotics and/or pre-bioics - these either feed the good bacteria in your horse's gut, encouraging the bad bacteria to die off and the good to multiply, or provide a daliy supply of good bacteria. for horses whose digestive system isn't what is was (e.g. veterans) often benefit most from a pre-biotic, to help the bacteria that's already there.

a fibre-based feed such as dengie aids the digestive system as it is easier to eat but takes a long time to digest, also keeping your horse feeling fuller and warmer for longer. ad-lib (constant) forage will also benefit your horse, as will the additon of an extra such as speedibeet, a product which is laminitis trust-approved and maintains condition, or/and an oil supplement; the highest quality oils being linseed (flax) and soya. as they contain 2-3 times the energy of a concentrate feed these can be fed in small daily doses of about 2-3 tablespoons. High quality examples include Global Herbs flax Oil and Baileys Soya Oil.

you also need to make sure that your horse is warm; if she is cold, she will sue the energy in her feed to keep warm rather than to maintain condition.
you can check this by feeling the base of her ears; they should feel warm, not cool nor hot,a dn the same goes for beneath her rug (if she wears one) at the shoulder.
good luck!
if you feel worried or still in doubt, then please PM me and i will try to help as much as i can!
you can also contact fed companies such as baileys or dengie online and ask as many queries as you like, for no cost.
xx

[iluvpin]

hey

thank you puzzles ii found what you said useful and i might pm if i get a bit stuck.

i will google and look at the Dengie Triple-Action (one of the best) or Yea-Sacc, or NAF Pink Powder. i currently give her benevit as she does not have the recommend daily amount of feed, she i continue to give her this and one of the above.
i am also giving her some sunflower oil but may change to one of the ones you mentioned if they will be more benificial.
finally you mentioned changing her from a mix, should i just change to the 16+ cube or the dengie senior as she is also feed safe and sound??

thank you again for you advice and sorry to ask so many more questions.

lozzie an pinxx

[Jessey]

I would stongly suggest looking at the sugar content of your mares diet, the reason is sugar (mostly mollasses in horse feed) is very quick release energy which means its gone before you can ride and won't help with weight but might make them a bit silly for a while and greatly increases the risk of lami :D Generally speaking a cube/nut will have less mollasses than a mix.

I have a 30 something year old cob who is no longer worked but also drops weight quite easily and has cushings so the risk of lami is very high for him.

He used to get a veteran mix, but when you check the ingrediants you will find molasses very high on the ingrediant list (the list is put into quantity order so makes it easy to check) and you need to avoid sugars as much as possible to reduce the risk of lami.
I now feed Baileys conditioning cubes (http://www.baileyshorsefeeds.co.uk/whatproduct/condition/no4.htm), they already have soya oil added which is great for slow release energy and weight gain and also has vits and minerals etc I use these as my chap was very under weight, if your mare is only slightly thin I wouldn't use these as that could push her over the line of thin to slightly overweight and could result in lami again.
I also use a probiotic called Biotal Equine Gold, its great stuff and really does seem to help.
I also feed HiFi Lite, not because its the diet version but because it is it has a far reduced ammount of mollasses on it than the regular one, but it is a good source of fibre for my pony who can't eat hay due to terrible teeth (definatly have your mares teeth checked asap if they haven't been done).
I also feed soaked grass nuts, as they are high protien and help with weight. Definatly do not feed regular sugarbeet, far to much molasses, stick with speedy beet (or one of the other unmolassed beet pulps), you could even try Alfabeet from dengie, its a mix of alfalfa and beet pulp which is unmollassed and quite good for weight gain.

First and foremost you should ensure your mare has access to forage to trickle feed on, this is what will provide fibre to keep her warm and if she is warm she won't use up her fat reserves. Oat straw is great for providing fibre without too many calories so keeps them warm without weight gain, but as your mare lacks weight I would suggest providing adlib hay until she reaches her perfect weight, hay is less likely to give her lami then lots of hard feed will, and remember when you switch your feed to do it very slowly, the shock of a feed change to her system, if done quickly, could bring on an attack on lami - its not only food that will cause lami, stress and concussion etc will too.

I would definatly recommend completeing the Saracens horse feeds questionare (you can do it on-line) they will give you a fully qualified nutritionists advise, and IMO is by far the most detailed responce you will get from a feed company and they explain everything in detail.

J x

[eventerbabe]

Dengie triple action is excellent, we used to feed it to my laminitic mare. It's a prebiotic, probiotic and yeast, fantastic for all round gut health.

Hi-fi lite and alfa-a lite are both suitable for laminitics. If she's lacking in energy i'd opt for the alfa-a lite. alfalfa has equivelant energy values to a mix so you can feed it alone. I hate mixes, they aren't good for horses tums, and with a laminitic that is not what you need.

Speedi-beet is fantastic for weight gain and as it's totally unmolassed is fine for laminitics.. Or if she's finding it hard to chew food, the new fibre beet can be fed wet and sloppy, and is also ok for laminitics. You are playing with fire feeding sugar beet to a laminitic i'm afraid :(

[Mareish]

Allen and Page and Dodson and Horrell have really good advice lines you can phone if you want to talk it through with the experts.

I was very impressed with both of them :)

[iluvpin]

hey

thanks for the replys i am taking into account everything that is said.

i have used the advice lines before from different feed companies and have found these helpful, but the only problem i have with this is obviously they only recommend their feeds so i was wondering if anyone knows of a freelance (so to speak) equine nutritionsit that they could give me the details of.

thank you again for the advice.

lozzie an pinxx

[puzzles]

changing to the Baileys 16+ or Dengie senior is fine hun.
and please don't be sorry! it's what we're all here for, isn't it?

[Jessey]

Very few independants out there I'm affraid, but sure you could find one if you are willing to pay for it :o
Thats why I like the Saracens feed help, last week they acctually recomended me a Dengie feed for my old boy, because they didn't have anything suitable for the job :D

J x

[puzzles]

i agree jessey, they're a truly great, honest company; most are.

[CurlyWurlyRach]

many feed companies are actually quite fair. bailies reccomended Dengie for me.

[puzzles]

and they're so friendly and helpful - dengie does seem to be popular (mind you, it's well-earned popularity)

[appaloosahoney]

You could also try simple systems www.simplesystem.co.uk. I have just moved my veteran mare to it and my baby's very laminitic shetland. The results have really been noticable, funnily enough more so with the shetland (too ancient to know how old he is) who now seems to have a sparkle in his eye again and bounce in his step. My mare who doesnt do particularly well looks good and has lots of energy without too much fizz. I feed lucie nuts with sugar beet and total eclipse but if you email them they give you a feeding schedule specific to your horse.

[iluvpin]

hey

thank you for all the replys sorry i havent answered before now have loads of college work to do.

again thank you.

lozzie an pinxx