Potential new livery yard thoughts welcomed.

[Whatanejit]

Those of you who have followed my moans and groans about my current yard and YOs please read on and tell me what you think :)

I think pretty much all of you told me to move. My plans were to go hunting after Christmas with my next door livery who is also looking to move.

However, there was an open day with mulled wine etc at a new yard that has re-opened with new owners - just as close as our current yard - 3 mins drive - 5 mins on the bike.

So here goes..................

Potential new yard has ........

. 20 brand new boxes in traditional horse shoe design

. 1 = 20x40 manege

. maximum turnout with offer of 24hrs in the summer

. NO road work straight onto the common

. A summer jumping paddock.

. Offer of full, part livery or assisted DIY

. Clean and spanking new looking aiming for BHS approval (those of you who have visited Coops will know that our place has no chance of getting that)

. CCTV in tack room - Iron boxes

. Laser security system

. Tea and Coffee making facilities for the liveries!!!!!

. Land manager living on site

. Yard owner living on site

. Yard manager is BHSII who competes highly (not sure how high) at dressage

. They plan to affiliate themselves to guest teachers, run shows, we can bring our own farrier or vet or trainer.

. They require references re new liverys and their horses as want to be select (not sure what that means but they like us - in fact they specified no agressive horses and people who would get on with them and their young family).


Plans for...........

. a second manege - 40 x 60
. a gallop track running around the whole of the property - 14 acres!
. they have planning permission for a further 10 loose boxes but will see how business goes before they expand to that.


Mmmmmmmmm....... this has actually really helped putting it down in writing - it is a no brainer really.

Negatives.........

. No other gelding there a the moment so Coops would be on his own for a while but next door to 4 mares one of which is his current next door neighbour and he is in lurvvvv with her already!!!

. Quite a bit more expensive than our current yard - assisted DIY would be the same as part livery in our current yard - but it would mean that I don't have to do my early mornings and that I would muck out in the evening.

. I don't have 'the parlour' and our little corner that we can hide in - but that isn't a big issue.

. I MIGHT HAVE TO GIVE UP MAY! This is my big downside unless I can persuade her mum to come with us.


Waddyall think????

[louise1]

If I had a horse i would like to use the new stables!!! go for it i say

[NSCHMIDT]

Sounds like heaven:) I hope it's everything your looking for. When I had to board a horse it was a real pain. Good luck

[neen]

W'ejit, it sounds lovely, and it's worth a try. I think I'm one of those people who told you to move... ;)

The turnout and no roadwork would sell it to me. The manege sounds a bit small for 20 boxes -- will you get through the winter if you don't always have access when you need it? Summer won't be a problem, what with the hacking and the jumping paddock. And the plans for the future sound great.

If there are 20 boxes I'm sure other geldings will come along shortly, so Cooper won't be on his own for too long. And you won't want to be sitting in your parlour, you'll be off drinking tea and coffee with the other liveries!

About May... it must be hard to think about giving her up, but Cooper is your boy and you have to do what's best for him. Try and get her to come too!

[chewitmonster]

Sounds great. :)

I've just moved (Thursday gone) from a clean, immaculate (mostly) full livery yard to a standard yard for part livery (I would class it assisted DIY) and I love it. We have much better hacking (went for a wander today) and you can just get on with you and your horse. I don't regret it for a minute - even the two week isolation where Silver and I can't really go near the other horses/liveries.

It sounds lovely, in my mood at the moment (we were almost kicked off our last yard-they were very rude to us) I would move like a shot.

[Bobbin]

It sounds lovely, just make sure it is.

The whole referances things sounds nice in theory but what happens if your horses turns bad tempered, are they going to throw you off the yard? If a horse gets ill or has something wrong with it they can get grouchy, Bry even started to kick when she was off work.

Just remember that on a new yard there are bound to be teething problems and unless the actual facility is there then don't go on the condition that it will be built. Sounds like the place is quite well together already though.

xx

[cazrider]

--And you're still thinking? Why? oh yes, the May issue... a biggie, but you may be able to persuade her mum to move her too. That's the only downside I can see.

I wouldn't worry about Coop being the only gelding if I were you, more are sure to arrive.

Sounds great to me..

Best of luck with the move.;) X

[NoviceNic]

Sounds like a very nice place. How quickly do you think it will fill up?? I am the only one who has moved onto my yard since August. Things are very slow at my yard. The only negative is having no-one to ride out with. I need to gossip sometimes...:rolleyes: :o

[julia gulia]

I don't know Dee:o It all sounds good but...what if you do have to give up May?? Sometimes it is better to know the evil you face than to face the evil you don't know??? mmmmm I don't know....sometimes the grass seems greener on the other side !! I'm not being at all helpful here.:D

[Ptaty70]

now i know you have had your problems, but wherever you go there will be different problems, it just depends on what suits you. All the acutalities sound great (CCTV for example) but what are the yard owners like? how do they like people wanting to do things according to their schedules?

You need to match the new place to what you want to do and what they are like. There is a place near us that prefers mares.. so your boy could be alone for a good while... can he really go out all the hours you want? can you turn up when you want?

Stables are very much to do with personalities and horse management and we are all SO different as we see from this forum!!

On paper sounds absolutely great! just ask the right questions about what is important to you and hopefully it will be a match!!

sounds fab! so wish you the best of luck!

[LindaAd]

Sounds great. You have lessons on May and hacks out with her, don't you? If you can't persuade her owner to move too, couldn't you still do the things you do with her?

And is there turnout in the winter?

And won't they mix mares and geldings? It could be a bit lonely for Cooper if he's turned out on his own.

[Whatanejit]

Thanks for all of your thoughts both positive and negative.:)

I had a sleepless night last night what with all of these questions going around in my head and also my dog is ill so I have been sleeping downstairs on the settee:o

Anyway, after a few beers and a good chat with OH we are very keen but need to ask a few questions of the RI/yard manager who is currently on holiday.

Turnout is my main issue - it is brilliant at our current yard especially when you are on DIY. Cooper is out for almost 11 hours even at this time of year - the brute is asking to come in from 3pm, though:rolleyes:

Personality - nobody could be any worse than what we deal with at the moment. I havn't typed in even half of the awfulness of these people at our yard - as in YOs. Absolutely yes we could have a different type of awfulness but nothing ventured nothing gained.

The assisted DIY - I would like to be assured of turnout times and bring in times and have a say in it as the nights get brighter.


Where the hacking will be great is that the common which we are right onto has some great little canter hills. Canter is Coopers big problem and our instructions are to canter him out as much as possible so then his canter will come in the school. We have 30mins of walk through a housing estate before we get to the common where we are at the mo which is absolutely boiling during the summer months and a heck of a treck - a trip to the common ends up being a 2.5 hr hack which often isn't suitable. The YOs are also going to pay for access to the Crown estate nearby which means that surrey is our Oyster!!!

Our current yard has the Country park on its doorstep which is great but there is a NO cantering rule. Now, cough, we all have sneaky canters but it is incredibly flat - cantering up hills on an uncoordinated and disunited youngster is a hell of a lot easier and great for building up his bottom.

I could still keep May on for a while especially with Coops being off work but it will become impossible after a month or two.

I really doubt her mum will move even if I offer to up my contribution for her keep.

My mum said that no matter what that we have to keep Cooper's needs and ours as a priority. There could be other Mays:o

Oh yes there is already one livery there, a lovely cob/arab mare belonging to their eldest daughter and the most scrumptious little Section A for the youngest daughter.

My next door livery who came with us emailed me last night and she has gone already! So we will know her at least and can hack out together and look out for each other.

Mmmm. I think if the turnout questions are good that we have probably made up our minds to go.

May's mum will be devastated...:o :o

Ponder, ponder.

[Skib]

Dee,
Please read all this as I am going to start with negatives.

You have had some good advice that every place has its down side. And know not to take forgranted that future plans ( maneges etc) will actually materialise.

And I wonder where the new place is? I mean as regards hacking?

And whether you need to decide now when you are about to go on holiday?

And since I dont understand BHS recognition criteria, I am not sure why your present yard wouldnt qualify. That is though I saw it wasnt like an ultra efficient yard (like my teachers or eml's) I didnt really have much idea of what one gets for the limited money. But I didnt wealk round finding fault.

However, I know you werent ever really happy and were thinking of a move - weighing that against the money and bad reports of "you know where" from people who had moved into your yard. And remember there cant yet be negative repoprts of a brand new place.

Yet this seems to be the opportunity you have been waiting for? And opportunities need to be grabbed? Life is full of uncertainties and you are not committed to staying in the new yard for ever.

I've been horrified at some of the reports about Cooper being fed the wrong stuff at the wrong time. The slip shod nature of the supervision. I am glad you going DIY has worked out, but at a good yard that choice should not have been forced on you. I dont see what you can lose by moving. You and Cooper may be happier, and if you are not, then you are no worse off than now.

You are a powerful, energetic and intelligent woman and if the YO likes you, you will be there from the start without anyone to bully you or disparage what you are doing with Cooper.

If you'd like me to come down and visit with you, I'd be really happy.

[Clare-22]

Its a tough one mate :o

Very hard to judge a yard when it is new, there is no way of knowing what type of yard it will turn out to be. I have found YOs to be a funny unpredictable bunch, they all have their quirks! At least with a more relaxed type of yard you don't have to deal with them as much. I do worry that the yard you are looking at sounds quite a formal type of place, but may have got that totally wrong.

Assisted DIY can be quite inflexible, so you need to find out if there is any restictions, such as if you want to turn out and muck out early is that ok, or do they want all horses in / out together? I would think you would have more restricted turnout, as you are relying on someone else to turnout / bring in whose interest may not be that your horse gets the maximum turnout. Sorry don't mean to be negative, I have had a bad experience with assisted DIY and I really didn't like the hidden restricitons. But done properly to suit all parties I can see how it would really help :)

How much acreage does the yard have, I recently looked at a yard with 29 acres and thought fantastic but it turned out they had 30 boxes!

Oh another thing is ask about opening / closing times, I have been gobsmacked that some yards have restictions on when you can come and go.

At the end of the day the best thing to do is go with your gut instinct, if you are unhappy at your current yard and get a good feeling for this new yard then go for it! The hacking sounds fantastic!

As hard as it seems I have to agree with your mum, I know how much you love May, but your first priority is Cooper.

[Afellpony]

You have to be careful when changing yards. I've been on some real smart, professional yards (over many years). However, none of them were geared to native ponies. The YOs didn't appear to have much knowledge of them or their specific needs. Where I am now is ideal but with not much hacking. You have to visit a potential new yard, I think, a couple of times before you can really make your mind up. Ask as many questions as you can. If you can, try and go at the yard's busiest time and then you can get a good idea of the sort of people that are there. You can then make the decision whether try or fly!!!!

[Little Dolphins]

Hiya, O undecided! I'd be just the same:D

The thing that surfaces, to me, when I read your whys and wherefores, is that the bad feelings regarding YO issues must be a heavy load to carry around in the back of your mind.
If that were lifted, wouldn't you feel great?

If you reckon the owners/managers at the prospective yard know their stuff, know horses and their needs, and are able to communicate sensibly with humans, then that is a much better platform for well-being than the one you currently are on.

I'm lucky because I have that in place in my/HQ's situation, and in practise, it outweighs any shortcomings in yard facilities. I trust the people.

Fantastic that a choice has arisen, though! This may be the reward for all the yeuch times you've been through- new dawn, new day!

[Trewsers]

There are always drawbacks to moving yard - I don't think the perfect one exists (but you know that I'm sure). OH and I moved yards in April this year, mainly for the turnout issues / hacking issues and its been a lovely yard to be on - (I've had my moments tho!!!). Lots of things have been great about it, but there were one or two things I missed about the old yard. Just make sure everything is what it appears to be - and echo what somebody else said about opening times - our new yard is much stricter than the old one, and I sometimes have felt a bit pressured to leave at night. Whatever you choose I hope it works out for you!

[NoviceNic]

Maybe I am just lucky. But if I want Captain brining in, I ask my YO and she brings him in. I am not bothered what time he comes in but I ask her to bring him in around 2.30pm before she does her school run. Then when I get up to him at 4pm he is always warm and cosy in his bed. Never had a problem yet. :)

To be honest I think you will always have doubts until you actually get up there and go for it. Look at us. Captain is being a git whilst handling and I have days where I just want to kill him. But I love being at the new yard. I choose what time I want to bring him in. What I feed him and at what time. He has never been so shiny and well in himself. Which is probably why he is being a git on the ground. :rolleyes: :p

[Dummer&Drummer]

ah wananejit - it sounds like you have been going through similar things to me and what i have 'not' typed and yo's :)

and on saturday i am moving into NN's sit

How quickly do you think it will fill up?? I am the only one who has moved onto my yard since August. Things are very slow at my yard. The only negative is having no-one to ride out with. I need to gossip sometimes

i need gossip to NN and will have no one to ride out with. sure she will fill up

i MOVING THIS SATURDAY 23rd dec, nice to be in for xmas, but er other side is me and ddjunior will be alone around xmas with our horses and we used to hustle and bustle :eek: :) but we'll be cool :)

[Chinarider]

Moving yards for me was made easy,

old yard ..... horses dropping dead every other week, being fed cabbages or anystuff left over from fields....

new yard.... professional team stable, 24hr vet, 3 farriers, indoor school, 2 outdoor school. countries best riders for instructors etc etc...

But still get the ols problem as nothing is perfect..

good luck with your decision :) which ever way, cooper wins, cos he has you as his Mum.

[Whatanejit]

Once again, thanks for all your comments folks and offers of support.

We are heading off for Christmas soon and will think seriously about it.

I have a page and a half of my notebook full of further questions to ask based on the negatives not only of my yard but of other yard rules I've heard around and about the place.

In fact when I get back from hols I pay put a list up on here for you guys to add to for me.

We are not going to make a hasty decision. We were innocent and as green as the grass when we entered this place and unfortunately our honesty and openness was seen as a weakness.

I am astounded as to how we have both become more capable and confident in the last 10 months and although we have a looooooooong way to go before we would be independent horse owners (i.e ever consider moving somewhere like Trewsers where we could take them home) I plan to vet this new yard as much as possible before we make any decisions.

I have thoroughly enjoyed the recent autonomy created by going DIY and I don't want to lose that.

Phew! It isn't a stressful decision - quite exciting, really. Even if we don't end up moving.

I'm planning to have a chat to May's mum about it tomorrow night.

:o

[domane]

Have you actually been to view this place Dee? This may sound a bit "out there" but I am a firm believer of picking up the vibe and seeing how you "feel" when you are there.... it has worked a treat for me with places I have lived in and my kids' schools etc. It just has to have a positive vibe for me.....

I would just go and spend some time there and wander around and see if you think it feels right.

Good luck with May's mum and may I wish you and your family a VERY Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year... (is your dad all ok now?)

Have a good one back home. We'll miss ya.

Lots of love Jane & family xxxxxx :)

[Whatanejit]

When I read your post Jane I thought..........

' Of Course I've been to see the yard!!!!'

Then I re-read my original post and it isn't that clear:o

But yes - Of course I've been to see it!!!:D :D :D


The feeling is good - one of family, beautiful views but I havn't met the yard manager i.e the person doing the horse care so I intend to 'interview' her in the new year.:)

Merry Christmas to you and your family and animals too Jane:)

[coverblown]

Dear Dee

This post is of little consequence compared to the good advice you have been given already - and of course, you had all these issues in your head (and OH's) too.

But from some of the oblique references you have given to your current yard, coupled with the more explicit stuff, it is hardly a surprise that you are considering a move.

The cantering sounds great - so good for Cooper's development. May would be a big miss for you though.... I know I am just repeating what you already know.

A difficult one, better the devil you know and all that, but you know just how devilish that devil is...

You'll come to the right decision; meanwhile enjoy your little emerald garden for Xmas and best wishes for the break, and the decision..

Yours, Anne x

[hackedoff]

All I can say sweetpea is go with your gut on this one :)

[Giveitago]

20, possibly 30, horses on 14 acres doesnt add up to much turnout Dee!

It seems the promised 24/7 t/o for my boy hasn't been that easy to acheive and I have had to fight to keep him out.

Good luck with your search.

[Imp]

You've answered your own question really!

Run, ruuun like the wind to your lovely, shiny new yard my dear :p :D

[Afellpony]

I would be extra careful when choosing a new one. Before moving to Hastings, I had to leave my livery yard near Banstead and look for somewhere else, as they decided to only take full livery (which I couldn't afford). Anyway, I saw a place advertised in Surrey (near Redhill) and went to have a look at it. I looked over it very carefully and saw nothing amiss. The owner, a lady a little older than I was then, seemed very pleasant and told me that she had passed her AI at Crabbett Park (Crawley). I took the horse I had then to her yard (full livery) and everything seemed ok. Then, one of the other livery's mares died from colic. The lady that owned the yard looked into the matter in depth and found out the woman who rented it hadn't even called the vet. Investigations also showed that she did not have the relevant qualifications that she said she did. In fact she was a fraud! I immediately took my horse away as did everyone else. I dont know (and I dont care) what happened to her after that because I never kept in touch with anyone there.

[Trace The Ace]

Hi Dee

Go with your gut instincts.....every time. I find that constantly weighing up pros and cons can make us internalise too much. Once you have 'interviewed' the new YO go on gut instinct.

;)

[cvb]

Whatanejit (or can I call you Dee like everyone else is ;) )

I don't know exactly where you are, but I had my two loan horses in Bookham area, and I have a friend who still has a horse in the area. Plus an instructor friend who teaches all over that area. And I remember how hard it was to find decent yards .... that had spaces ! All the decent ones had waiting lists. So if this one IS decent, then I would expect it to fill fast and end up with a waiting list like the others..

The risk is that if it turns out not to be as promised, you may have a time of it finding anywhere else :(

[Whatanejit]

Hi folks!

I'm just back tonight from my xmas hols and am catching up.

Thanks for the further comments and for sharing your experiences with me.


A week away is great to let the dust settle.

There are things about the new yard that are far from perfect.

I have to be careful, obviously, with what I say on the internet but further investigations show a few fundamental negatives.......

. owners are very nice people who are potentially indulging 12 year old daughter's interest in horses.

. yard manager will only be employed part time until yard has more liveries - so mummy and daddy and 12 year old daughter will be looking after the horses in between:eek:

. initial offer of assisted DIY which was offered verbally and written in advert in tack shop has now been retracted as they want part or full livery as they need to start paying the bills - ok I see the issue but what else will change that was initially used as an enticer!

. as others have said - the extra facilities are not there yet even though there are plans for them.

. another livery who has been on 3 other yards in the area gave me similar advice to CVB and that was to wait and let the others fill it up, pay for the new facility build and then see what sort of reputation it gets and will it thrive - then think about moving or indeed join a waiting list.

My post holiday mind is relaxed and saying lets wait and see - my pre - holiday mind said run for your life out of your current place as the YO irritated the hell out of my before I left by making snide comments.

I am going to start 2007 with my post holiday frame of mind, attend the other open days and continue to look at other yards in the area - including Bookham so that I may have a get out clause when needed!

MMMMMm.... but then again?????????!!!!!!!:p :p

Oh, I don't know.:o

[neen]

Hmm... that doesn't sound so good. I'd be worried about the part-time manager -- what happens if something goes wrong when she's not about? And I'd also be worried if they're not a fully horsy family. Building new facilities is expensive and hard work and if you don't suffer from horse-fever yourself, would you really go through with it? Not all horsy 12 year olds are still horsy at 14, even... then what? Also, you've been enjoying the DIY so much... would you want to give it up so someone else could pay their bills?

I'm not much help, am I? :D

[Skib]

I started looking at livery yards in Surrey about 2 years ago.
I would say Dee, that closeness to home would be an absolute priority for me. - unless you can afford full livery, and may be even if you can? I turned down a share at Bookham/Effingham last Xmas when OH and I timed the journey. Ads for yards arent always realistic about the driving time.

Something else that happens as one learns to ride is that over the years one gets to know the professionals - Yard managers etc. They move on, and thus one gets to know staff at various different yards and some of the instructors who work there too. Personal contact is very valuable. You have been to several riding schools near here. You must know lots of people by now?

At the moment you are being put under pressure both to leave and to enrol? But you are not actually in a strong position to do anything at the moment as you have a sick horse. Poor Cooper. Does the YO want you out and is that why she is being vile? You may do better to wait till he gets better? And then decide.

And then one is so irrational too. I have a list of three horses to see as possible weekday shares (if I seriously decide to share). But none of them seem to be in livery yards which were high on my list for their hacking? And one horse I hanker after is a really long drive.