dealing with personality clashes.

[digitalangel]

Im posting this here because im an older rider and the yard i ride at is all mature ladies and usually we can sort any 'drama' before it turns into one. However there is some what of a personality clash between 2 people at the yard and i would like to hear some different views.

Woman 1 is late twenties who lives about a 40 minute drive from the yard. She works shifts. She has 2 horses both on DIY and a third, ill horse she is looking after. I help her out some days out as does another woman ( assisted livery ) She does most of the stable work despite living so far away and juggling a full time job and 3 horses to look after, seems to manage it well, even if she is a bit haphazard and has been forgetful on occasion.

Woman2 is late thirties and an at home mom. She has one horse and lives 10 minutes away. She has been on the yard quite a while. She is very diligent and is always at the yard the same time every day and definitely has a strict routine in place. She used to be a groom and believes everything should be done a certain way.

I should point out here that there is no YO or manager, just a caretaker bloke that collects the rent and fixes the fences etc.So noone is in charge.

Over the past couple of months i have seen what can only been described as Woman2 picking on Woman1. Woman1 did make quite a few mistakes when she moved to the yard such as leaving the tack room door open when she went down the shop one day - a family member had passed away and she needed credit for her mobile is what i ( and the other woman ) were told at the time.Not an excuse because it was a very big security risk but i was gobsmacked at the way the woman ripped into her when Woman1 was obviously very upset. As a way of keeping the peace i suggested woman2 move her tack to another room, which was done.

Since then Woman2 seems to blame Woman1 for everything that is not done to her standard, from sweeping up to the amount of straw on the muckheap and where it was placed to leaving the lights on or the front gate on the combination. Woman1 just sits there and is pretty shy about it, she has stuck up for herself a couple of times but it just goes over the other womans head.

Yes Woman1 can be careless and forgetful but she is a relative novice at keeping horses ( especially stabled ) but its obvious she cares for these horses and will always take on advice, but it worries me that she will leave dirty straw in her stable rather than incur the wrath of Woman2 by putting too much straw on the muckheap!

Most of the other liveries arent as uptight as Woman2 and to try to defend Woman1 ( as do i ) and we all do our fair share of sweeping and sorting out the muckheap without complaint or pointing fingers ( its a yard, it happens! ), and other (newer ) liveries have made the same mistakes and one of us usually has a quiet polite word and theres no drama.

Theres obviously a personality clash and both women are making an effort to get along in a civil manner, however i am wondering how long i can bite my tongue before i explode at Woman2! As i see it , it is typical bullying behavior as she singles out Woman1 on a pretty regular basis.

What do you think?

[Alfies-slave]

Suggest having a regular yard meeting where all these little things can be sorted out. Draw up a list of rules amongst yourselves and all agree to abide by them.

[Pink's lady]

Be super friendly piggy in the middle deliberalty. Be nice to woman 1 and give her as much help as possible but be nice to woman2 as well and when she says something nasty about woman1 , talk around it. Say something like 'nah' I don't think so - she tries hard and loves her horses. Why not mention it to her if it really bothers you' kind of thing. It's easier than a head on confrontation although it will take longer.

[Wally]

My horses get looked after like horses, they are muddy, smelly (nIce horse smells, no teatree or apple blossom flavoured horses here!) If they come in they are on rubber mats and whatever bedding happens to be in the Islands!

I have better things to do than make sure every teeny tiny bumble is mucked out, that every teeny tiny bit of wet bedding is removed.

Okay leaving the tack room open is a lesson learned, she knows what the implications might have been and is obviously mortified by what she did, move on!

Personally I'd tell the person doing the "picking on" to back off because there is basically nothing wrong with the way she does thing, she just doesn't do them "her way" and her way is not necessarily the only or best way.

Please stop making an atmosphere in the yard because I am beginning to feel like piggy in the middle......in as nice a possible way you feel you can!

I couldn't be doing with it.

[carrimclaren]

I'd probably go along the same lines as Wally in the fact that i'd confront the situation properly before it becomes and angry argument.
If you've known woman 2 a little longer then it might pay to quietly ask her if you can have a word and then ask her if everything is okay with her and if she's got any problems. If she says no then i'd diplomatically explain that she's upsetting the balance of the yard and everyone is starting to feel rather uncomfortable and it's a not a plesant yard feeling. Ask her what the niggles are about the woman and suggest she has a proper discussion about problems rather than baiting her the whole time.

If she's still being a bully after this maybe someone else should also have a word too.

[Crazyhorse]

I wouldn't say that there was a personality clash as poor woman 1 seems to just be trying to keep her head down and get on with things. It sounds as though woman 2 has too much time on her hands and has turned into a perfectionist. What she is doing is bullying and woman 1 is far more likely to make even more mistakes if she is nervous about being watched. It sounds like she is doing a fab job juggling all her committments. Someone needs to approach woman 2 and make it clear that bullying isn't tolerated on the yard. Maybe she just needs a wake up call and is not aware that she is actually bullying. Hope it all gets sorted as it must create a horrile atmosphere for everyone on the yard. Good luck.

[digitalangel]

Pinks Lady: I have defended her and myself and some of the liveries pointed out to her that Woman1 had not finished mucking out her stables when she ran to us about the 'horrendous' state of the stable block ( straw on the floor ) and she did shut up about it but i dont think she got the hint.

Wally: you got it in one! it is creating an atmosphere! Woman1 was mortified about leaving the tack door door open and never leaves it open for a second now - even when she has to make return trips to get stuff and the tack room is in clear eyeshot - its rather sad to watch and Woman1 is really scared of Woman2 which doesnt help. I have told her to assert herself calmly and quietly but she tends to findit really hard.

I too agree that i have better things to do than sweep up every time a stray piece of straw floats onto the yard within 30 seconds and im *sure* she doesnt, looking after 3 horses, and a full time job but i dont think Woman2 has much in her life other than her kids and her horse and i think that is why she picks on Woman1 - she is an easy target and provides some form of drama for her.

I will see if a few of us can have a word but i for one worry that it will make the situation worse to confront her directly, so we try to make subtle hints at our disapproval but i dont think she picks up on them ;)

[Ruskii]

My own views are just like Crazyhorse but with a mixuture of Wally's in there as well. This woman (Number 1) already looks after 3 horses and works full time (what is she super woman ?! I couldnt do it !)

I'd be straight with Number 2 and tell her to lay off. But that's just me and I'm known for my no nonsense/lack of patience attitude :o

[Wally]

Sometimes a word clears things up. Be direct without acusatory, and just tell her how you feel.

If you tell her how you feel, she'll stop using you as piggy in the middle, then she won't have anyone to whinge to and if she doesn't have anyone to whinge to it'll take the "fun" out of picking on woman 1.

[Ruskii]

I too agree that i have better things to do than sweep up every time a stray piece of straw floats onto the yard within 30 seconds and im *sure* she doesnt, looking after 3 horses, and a full time job but i dont think Woman2 has much in her life other than her kids and her horse and i think that is why she picks on Woman1 - she is an easy target and provides some form of drama for her.



I was thinking the exact same thing, but wasnt sure how to put it across :o

[digitalangel]

good idea. she has never bullied me, or any of the other newer liveries there, and i hope she has a healthy respect for me. I will have a quiet word and hope that she listens to me.

Of course, she has been talking about leaving, and to be honest, i wish she would as it is obvious our less-than-perfect way of doing things just isnt for her.

I am doing my best helping Woman1 with her 3rd horse ( she took it on as a rescue case and the horse is very poor ) and everyone at the yard commends Woman1 for it, andis giving her loads of help ( donating rugs/feed/turning out/giving advice/etc ) and it disappoints me that all Woman2 can do is pick on her.

Maybe if i ask woman2 to do something positive for this ill horse ( and woman1 ) it might give Woman2 some understanding on just how hard it is for Woman1 right now to maintain a perfect standard?

[Debs0571]

I agree with Crazyhorse, there is nothing worse than an atmosphere to upset people, I really can't abide bullying, and I would have to have a quiet word with woman 2. Whether she is aware of it or not she is making things unnecessarily difficult for everyone. Let us know how you get on x

[svenja]

As someone who has a demanding career and works very long hours, I feel sorry for Woman 1. I agree with Wally. It sounds like it's creating an atmosphere and making things unpleasant for everyone.
There's nothing worse than bossy perfectionists with too much time on their hands. Perhaps if you try putting it nicely to woman 2 from your point of view- ie ''you want everyone on the yard to get on, it's such a nice atmosphere (a white lie never did any harm;) ) and quibbles should be avoided, etc....''- that may help? I find a one-to-one chat often works better than a full-on meeting, as even with the best of intentions calling a meeting may inflate the issue and make people believe it's much bigger a deal than it really is. Good luck!:)

[coverblown]

It does sound as though W2 is being a bully. I wonder if she really cares about the state of the yard or if she just enjoys the bullying.

What motivates her to behave like this. Surely she can see that W1 just needs a bit of peace and, ideally some help and understanding.

A.

[Little Dolphins]

Woman 2 needs a little word in her ear.

I have been 'woman 1' at my yard- still am to a certain extent, but nowadays I tend to just feel sorry for our 'woman2'. She thinks everyone is a fool except herself, and finds people to pick at who, she assumes, are not going to defend themselves.

Our YO had a short but effective parley with her. You don't have a person 'in charge' (except woman2!), but could someone, perhaps, agree to take the plunge and speak up, before the atmosphere is totally ruined for all of you?


Good luck! :)

[Portia]

It sounds as if #2 has some control issues, and #1 confidence issues! Not always a good combination where group dynamics are concerned.

How many adults are there on the yard? Is your view of the situation the same as everyone else's? Sounds like it's creating a nasty atmosphere (and being unkind to #1 - and I personally can't abide this sort of behaviour, life is too short).

I suspect #1 would feel uncomfortable in a yard meeting type situation, and #2 would become very defensive publicly (and more unpleasant to #2 privately). IMO this would best be addressed by woman 1 standing up to woman 2, she'll need support from yourself, but until she is able to deal with this herself, I suspect the bullying would continue to a greater or lesser extent.

Once #1 has openly stood her ground, should it continue then go to an open yard meeting.

[Nik-n-Kia]

I would just tell woman 2 a few home truths and then let her know that the bullying isn't on.

I know it's not acceptable for teenagers to bully so it defo isn't for grown adults to do it.

And also she never knows when she might need a favour and if sh keeps on about the way things are done nobody will help her for fear of her going off on one.

She is just making herself look bad and I think that she needs to be told this.

What a carry on.

I've left yards for such stupidity and i'm only 23!!!

hope it gets sorted as it seems quite a tense way to be!!!

Nikki xxxx

[Ptaty70]

This isn't a resolution, more of a comment... it could well be that W2 is jealous of W1 and what she manages to fit into her day but finds it easier to pick on her for what she sees as inadequacies, more because W1 can't defend herself... maybe she is actually miffed that W1 is liked and has your support with the rescue horse. Maybe she has nothing else to occupy her perfect life...

Have met many like them. You can try to have a word in a nice way by pointing out how much W1 is doing and showing you will not tolerate any moaning about her.

Very difficult situation and I hope it all gets sorted out. Sometimes if there is noone to beeeeatch to about W1 and if W1 just carries on as she is, keeping her head down, then W2 will lose interest. When there is noone to moan at about someone (gossips over the back fence etc), the problem can die down. I would certainly put forward your opinion that you will not tolerate such put downs.. as well as the others on the yard also making this clear..

God, hope it gets sorted for you. nothing worse than an atsmosphere on a yard!!

[rohan]

Sorry but I must say as woman 2 is not the owner to be hosest it is none of her business ans I would tell her that as she cant seem to tale the hints you all seem to have dropped, she seems to have it in her head that she is the owner not just another diy'er. I dont like bossy people like that. Just as well Im not there I'd have had her torn down a peg or two by now. You have the patience of a saint well done.

[Cheko]

Oh dear! The bitchiness of women. I'd leave them to get on with it by totally ignorring them.

[digitalangel]

wow thanks everyone! there is some invaluable advice here so thanks very much!

Portia - there are about 6 of us and most of us do share the same opinion! I wll talk to woman1 today and possibly Woman2 next time i see her do it, but i must agree that Woman1 should stick up for herself - ive seen her try once but i think she needs to be a little more assertive.

once again - thank you ladies!

[Portia]

People with personality traits such as #1 may have sometimes switch allegiance in order to improve their standing with the perceived aggressor.

In other words should someone speak to #2 about her treatment of #1, #1 might firstly deny that there's a problem, and secondly side with #2 - against those who tried to help her in the first place!

It can all get very messy, so be careful and don't let yourself get dragged in.

[Retty]

I can't abide bullys and woman 2 clearly is one! I have met a fair few in my time, they usually are the type that think they know everything and if anything isn't done their way then it is incorrect! I totally ignore these types. I do however feel sorry for woman 1, perhaps a way around it is when talking to woman 2 say something along the lines of.. "Wow I really admire Woman 1, with all of her responsilbilities and looking after 3 horses aswell - I don't know how she does it! I'm going to offer to help her out where I can as it sure must be hard for her and I know she would appreciate the help". This hopefully might shame Woman 2 into actually being a bit nicer ;)

[Tots N Dots]

This hopefully might shame Woman 2 into actually being a bit nicer ;)
I know exactly what you mean, but I have found that these woman 2 types rarely feel shame :) they think they are completely justified :eek:
I had a "woman 2" actually a friend of 20 years standing, but not any longer, I was going through a major confidence crisis after a very bad accident and a long break from riding. what ever I did I was wrong, whatever tack I had on my horse was wrong, to the point she would come ride my horse and change the tack :eek: . whatever I fed was wrong. my confidence was at rock bottom as it was, I was told without her I would never be able to ride a horse? well "woman 2" out the way and I am so much better (and riding) :D though I still have my wibble moments on a regular basis.
these people are so insecure about themselves that they can only feel good by undermineing an easy target, which I was at the time.
I actually feel sorry for her but hey she isnt my problem anymore :D

It really is a tough one, could everyone stand up to woman 2 together and kind of make a stand?

[summerguest]

Apart from things that affect everybody...like leaving the tack room unlocked, why does this woman feel she can make comments?

How you manage your horses is nobody elses business..unless you are talking cruelty and neglect.

I have met a few people like her and have found the only way to deal with them is very bluntly!! Generally they are so full of themselves they tend to ignore subtleness.

She needs to be told to mind her own business, her comments are not welcome etc....preferably by the woman being bullied. Maybe the rest of you could help her have the confidence to stand up to the bully just by showing you support her and think the bully is in the wrong.

Once the bully knows that the rest of the yard does not support her and dislikes her behaviour I wouldn't be suprised if she just backs off and acts like it has never happened. This has been my experience.

Hope the situation resolves as its horrible when there is an atmosphere at the yard, as this is your relaxation / pleasure time that you spend with your horse and hopefully friends that share your interest. Good luck!