Reassure me that my horse can live outside!

[Mary Poppins]

I fully admit that I am guilty of pampering my horse - she only has to look at me for me to produce carrots and I am aware that she waits at the gate for me every day mainly because I feed her and spoil her stupid. I just love her to pieces. However, I also know that she is a horse and is quite capable of living like one.

She has been coming in overnight for the last year (summer and winter) and now for reasons beyond my control she has lost her stable and she has to live outside. I have been promised that if we have a really cold spell then she can come back in again but as it is so mild she doesn't really need to be in.

I am just after some reassurance that she will be OK living out. She is in a large field which is hayed twice a day and even still has some grass in it. She has a 200g rug on with a neck cover. She is a heavyweight aged about 22, unclipped who isn't working at the moment as I can't ride her. She is a good weight (maybe even a bit fat!) and doesn't seem to be cold. She will have a small hard feed per day along with all the hay so she won't be hungry (although she would tell me that she is always hungry).

I know that I sound really pathetic but I couldn't sleep last night for worrying about her. When I left her yesterday she stood glued to the gate wondering why she wasn't going into her stable. I am sure that she will get used to it but it made me feel heartless! I am all for horses living as natural a life as possible, its just that she is so different from any other horse that I have known and I worry that she stood by the gate all night waiting to be brought in. As I type this I know how stupid it sounds......

[Mehitabel]

i wouldn't have a horse in if you paid me. i think it is better for them both mentally and physically to live out. it's the change in routine that confused her yesterday, not a desperate desire to be in a stable. very few horses are actually happier in than out, mostly it is just the routine and what they expect.

[Bay Mare]

Hi MP :) How are you hun?

I agree with Mehitabel, Saffy lives out, that's how she likes it, she's incredibly unhappy being caged in a stable. In the 2 years 3 months that I've had her she's 'asked' to stay in twice! They don't have hay in the field but she comes in for a few hours every day for a haynet and a feed (forage only, we don't do hard feed :) ).

She'll be fine, honest, and especially if shes' an unclipped good doer :)

All the best x

[Mary Poppins]

I think that I am overprotective due to her having a very serious bout of colic/virus last winter when she almost died. I found her lying in a puddle in her field freezing cold. Her digestive system isn't the best (hasn't been good for the last 3 years) and she can't consistently formulate hard droppings - she has very runny poo most of the time! However over the last year this hasn't improved due to her living in or out or changing her diet etc. Blood tests didn't show any problems and she is regularly wormed.

Perhaps living out would be best for her to she isn't standing still all the time - it might get things working inside. I do worry about her being out when it is frosty as I have heard that if horses eat frosted grass this is bad for them - particulary if she is prone to colic. Is there any truth in this?

[Mehitabel]

it's more so if they are stabled - the sudden cold stuff going in can give a shock, so going from in a stable eating warm hay to frosty grass is the issue. if they've been nibbling it all night as it gradually froze it's generally fine.

the main issue with frosty grass is laminitis - it is stressed, so produces more of the fructans that cause laminitis. but this is generally when it's richer anyway, so a late frost in spring when the grass is more nutrititous anyway, would be much more of a worry than now, when there is no nutrition in it so any rise in fructans is negligible. in general, out and moving is better for gut problems - movement stimulates peristalsis so will keep things moving. also if they're out and have ad lib hay (we use a round bale) they never run out and again that is better for the gut.

[Mary Poppins]

Thanks Mehitabel - would there be any occassion where you would recommend that a horse lives in? Do you think that there is any truth in the theory that some horses just like to be warm and dry and are more 'homely' than others? (again I know how stupid I sound...)

[Mary Poppins]

Hi MP :) How are you hun?

I agree with Mehitabel, Saffy lives out, that's how she likes it, she's incredibly unhappy being caged in a stable. In the 2 years 3 months that I've had her she's 'asked' to stay in twice! They don't have hay in the field but she comes in for a few hours every day for a haynet and a feed (forage only, we don't do hard feed :) ).

She'll be fine, honest, and especially if shes' an unclipped good doer :)

All the best x


Hi BM

I am fine thank you - so pregnant now that I can hardly move! Roll on the Spring so I can function again and think about riding. I can't wait to get back on. My other pony is like Saffy and hates being stabled - he tries to jump out and barges when the door is open. It is just that my horse is not like that - you could leave the door wide open all night and she would wait there patiently waiting for someone to come and see to her!

[Afellpony]

All my ponies (with the exception of 1 (which was a horse) ) have been natives. I've never kept them in. They're out 24/7 whatever the weather. If the weather gets too severe in winter, then I do put a rug on them. None of them (Exmoors and Fell) has ever wanted to come in.

[Mehitabel]

it depends where you live, really, and the individual horse. some with sweet itch are comfier in away from flies, obviously laminitis is another case where it's kinder to keep the horse in and you need to monitor food intake very carefully. then places like shetland, if you had a TB or an arab, it would be unfair to ask them to cope with the weather extremes that we don't really get on the mainland.

we have 2 horses (out of 70+) who i feel genuinely prefer being in overnight, one is the stallion - i think that is a nosey issue, as his overnight field is down the road and he can't keep an eye on what is going on! the other used to live out happily, then was in for about a year for a serious injury and liked it - took a fair while to settle to living out again but has now done so and lived out all winter this year perfectly well. that may well have been a routine thing though, TBH, since she has settled now.

it's hard when they've been used to living in for a long time - many do have trouble adapting at first and it can be hard to know if you're doing the right thing by putting them through the stress of adjustment, a bit like barefoot transitioning.

but i do believe that for the vast majority of horses it is in their best interests to live out with appropriate rugging, feed and shelter. they maintain fitness better, they go lame less with things like tendon tweaks as they have that low-grade level of fitness and stamina from being on the move slwoly all the time, their lungs are normally better from being in the fresh air, teeth are better as they eat with head down and straight, so teeth wear as they're supposed to, they stretch their topline mucles and make correct work easier, and they develop far fewer vices.

horses are waterproof by nature - and rugged, even more so. they really don't see weather in the same way as we do. ours will stand in the shelter much more often in summer to avoid flies than in winter to avoid rain. i think most of the waiting at the gate is routine, not genuinely being miserable - provided the field has food and shelter. at many places their fields turn into a quagmire, so the horse is fetlock deep in mud with no food to eat as the grass has gone and there's no hay - then fairy nuff, a stable and food is better. but with decent field management so there is somewhere dryish to stand and hay ad-lib, none of ours hang around the gate even in the depths of february.

[Murasaki]

Sorry to hijack this -Mehitabel do you keep the round bale under shelter or is it just in the field please?

[Shadowlark]

Sure can!

My gang live out 24/7 and include the "delicate" arabs and Tbreds in teh group - despite the -40 temps that we can and do gleefuly reach (they never stay mroe then a few days but still!) It's a riot to see them booking it around in a snow storm.

Only one has a blanket, and he hates it and would move heaven and earth to not have it on.

My poor Deja suffers terribly from heaves (RAO) from being "caged" as Bay mare puts it (I agree 110%.. if I kept my dogs the way people keep horses the spca would bang on my door) The severe arthritis horses on the back are now both looking amazing, the vet is taken aback at thier progress - now that they live like horses they are both back in work and doing splendidly with no trace of the former lameness they were plagued with!

They arn't "hard fed" The big herd has Timothy/alfalfa round bales at all times. Deja and Bear can't have hay due to health conditions. So they have cubed hay and beet Pulp. Bear came to me skin and bones at 31 years of age I was told he was unlikely to live thru the winter... despite efforts to feed him up on grains etc. Now? I think he is up about 400 pounds since sept. it's really been remarkable!

One thing I have noticed, is they won't touch frosty grass if there is ample hay availlable. Most days some will be on the bales, others will be foraging. Frost on the ground.. everyone is on the rounds.

They are a happy healthy crew. The vet enjoys her visits - and they are few and far between. But then this is how she keeps her own horses and she always laments that she can't convince more owners to stop with all the nonsense and let them just BE horses.

[Cupcake]

My ponies are kept outside, skye has never in the 7 years i've owned her slept in a stable even once. She's 20 now and does not and will not tolerate being in a stable all night long.
Your defiantly not acting stupid about this, your acting just like all of us would. Make sure she's very warm, fleecy rugs are always a much loved addition and keep her tummy full so she can warm herself up. Does she have a companion? That might help her feeling alone.

[mogadoga]

Id love Alex out, but the big cob is a wimp tbh. He would get used to it... but i need him in at night in winter so his legs can dry out (mud fever!!!)/
But no, she should be fine...and if you keep an eye on her you'd see any signs of distress, as said, give her a chance to get into her new routine :)

[Mary Poppins]

Thank you everyone. Yesterday she was waiting for me by the gate and after her feed and pampering session I turned her out and again she just stood by the gate looking at me. However, 15 minutes later the hay truck started up and I saw her ears and face light up as she watched the truck load up and deposit hay in her field. She then went to join the other horses (there are about 6 other horses there) and happily munched away. She was happy and didn't seem to have suffered from being out all night. I think that she just might survive!

The weather is looking a bit damp but mild for the next week so she shouldn't get cold - she has got a 200g rug on and I might buy her a 100g fleece to go underneth it should the weather turn much colder. If I can get her used to being outside I don't really want to confuse her by bringing her in again.

I know that I am too overprotective but I just want what is best for her.

[Mehitabel]

200g should be plenty in this weather (assuming you're not in the wilds of scotland) - any of ours would be sweating and uncomfy in 300. petal is still in a LW no-fill one and is fine.

we all want what is best for our horses - but head needs to rule heart when it is drizzly and miserable and we would hate being outside. they don;t care at all, in the majority of cases.

[Bluey's~Friend]

G'day! She should be able to live outside, I;d say so, but in bad weather a stable or shelter shed or any kind of shelter would be good for her. I'm also guilty of spoiling horses rotten, comes natrual!

Gotta Gallop,

Bluey's~Friend

[helenc]

Aaaw, she'll be fine.

My two both live out 24/7. I have an aged TB who point to pointed til he was 12 so was prob kept in for most of his life. He is unclipped & rugged in MW at the most with no neck cover - he sometimes has mini icicles in his ear hair but is never cold generally!

The other is again an ex-racer but is now my competition horse - again full TB but he has a trace clip & rugged in a MW or HW depending on temp. He is competed most weekends & in medium work.

Both are fed on good quality haylage - not even ad lib, they just get a good chunk in the morning & another at night - no hard feed either & both looking very very well!

[Skib]

OK Mary Poppins - to back up what mehitabel says I will tell you a favourite story about the great polo player, Edward D. Miller. He retired from the army and set up a Polo yard. Polo ponies were not ridden all winter, so you can compare it to a horse belonging to a pregnant Mum.

Like you he thought the most valuable ponies should be cossetted.
His first winter in business, 1892-3 , he stabled the six best animals and turned out the less valuable ones. That first winter the ponies he turned out had only a bit of straw and rough hay to supplement the grass. It was a hard snowy winter and for a whole month they had to push aside the snow to get at the grazing.
Whereas the stabled ones had oats and hay.
When Spring came he was surprised to find that the ponies that had been turned out in the cold were fitter and quicker to bring back into work than the ones that had been carefully stabled. They had more flesh and muscle on them than the ponies that had been kept boxed but were not exercised. So he changed policy and after that turned all the ponies out for the winter unless there was a reason - health or old age or a horse newly imported from abroad - which made it inadvisable.
He says it seems pointless to have field shelters as horses rarely seem to use them in winter, prefering natural windbreaks like trees and hedges. He also warns polo players against handing ponies over to a farmer and leaving them in a field untended.
The next winter he began to feed the horses turned-out over winter as carefully as he would a stabled horse. Which is just what you are doing. And found that a horse in a field will easily condition itself.

I cant quote this exactly as I dont own a copy of his autobiography. But I never forgot it. And because of this I could never own a horse up here in London at a yard with no turn out.

I hope all goes well with the baby. You are almost there now.

[Laura+Phantom]

ah I know how you feel! My 4 that I own have always lived out and that's the way they like it but my loan pony has been stabled at night her whole life. I feel like I daren't let her get wet or go out in the rain, even with a rug on, and she's a connemara! I think it would take her a while to get used to living out and I would feel terrible, but all horses will adapt. They love routine as i'm sure you know, so as soon as your hoss gets used to her new routine she'll forget she ever had a stable! Especially with all that yummy hay to eat :)

I had to stable my old loan pony at night when he was in his 20's but he was very fine, and couldn't hold his weight at all, bless him. I think your mare sounds a lot tougher, and I agree that being free to move around with help regulate her digestive system. I think colic is much more common is stabled animals, but I might be wrong.

Good luck, and keep at it, she'll be okay :) Good luck for the new arrival too!

[Sexy Sietske]

mine are in all week and out all weekend. Both of them cope fine and enjoy being out. I thought nelson would be mardy and drop weight and want to come back in but he doesn't care and is getting a right fatty!!

[appaloosahoney]

When I bought Chelsea (now 18) three years ago she had spent the previous 10 years stabled with only an hour exercise per day. She was moody, flighty and hormonal. She has spent the last two years out 24/7 in a rug with companions (first year in at night out at day before RAO struck) and couldnt be a more different horse. I was so worried when I began this regime that she would be unhappy and that our bond would weaken but the difference in her has been so marked that its hard to believe that I have the same horse. How unhappy she must have been before. I do believe that it doesnt work for all horses but that they will let you know as long as you give it a little time for them to settle into the new routine.

[Mogwei]

Sorry to hijack this -Mehitabel do you keep the round bale under shelter or is it just in the field please?

Our hay is adlib and is out in an open feeder in the field.

[notpoodle]

if i had the possibilty to keep mine out 24/7 in the winter with hay in the field, i would :) but sadly, thats not always possible, so she has to make do with being stabled at night as out whenever i find a volunteer to turn her out in the morning for me (due to work etc i cant go up myself in the morning). she seems very happy with the arrangement at the moment, but is quite keen to come back in at night :D

Julia
x

[Mehitabel]

our round bales are just on the ground. they do waste some, but they hoover it and overall, compared with the time and effort of haying daily, the loss of the bottom 6 inches or so of the hay or haylage is negligible. they eat it fast enoguh that it doesn't start getting mouldy.
we aim for the highest bit of ground possible to minimise the poaching round it, and if more than three horses inthe field we have 2 bales.

[girl-friday]

My horse is a TB x appaloosa and lives out. He has a stable (3 actually) but really dislikes being in so he just has a 400g Taka turnout on and pleases himself. Everyone told me I would have to winter him in but he just didn't like it so I didn't bother. He seems to thrive out and has lost no weight or condition because he has no stress.

My other pony who is a native (exmoor) pony lives out (without any rugs)with him and they just love it. I wouldn't make him come in while he can live out, it's nicer for them to be able to roam.

She will be okay.