Killer Cat

[happyhacker101]

Anyone else have a cat the kills anything and everything?.. We took in a stray two years ago - its hard to remember how he used to be as he is now a big softy but.... he still kills just about anything, today he came home with a weasle... Quite handy in a way as we dont want stoats and weasles as the attack the hens.

[vimto92]

Awh, he just wants to please his Mum.

[Lissy]

Hehe yep I have one of those! She stays inside so she doesn't kill any of the local wildlife, she was a rescue case and I guess killed anything to survive.

You boy is gorgeous and looks cuddly!

[happyhacker101]

Pussycat's the same - used to killing to survive, guess that it never leaves them even though he's been well fed for the last two years!!

[AengusOg]

Cats are the greatest threat to our wildlife, and far outnumber the populations of foxes, weasels, stoats, and any other so-called vermin on mainland Britain.

It's actually an absolute disgrace and a tragedy that so many are allowed to range, unmanaged and continually killing they way they do.

Australia is another case in point........the wildlife of Australia were not equipped to deal with cats and foxes, both introduced by humans, and responsible for the disappearance of several indigenous species, and still killing.

The Domestic Cat..................Public Enemy #1

Originally Posted by AengusOg

Cats are the greatest threat to our wildlife, and far outnumber the populations of foxes, weasels, stoats, and any other so-called vermin on mainland Britain.

It's actually an absolute disgrace and a tragedy that so many are allowed to range, unmanaged and continually killing they way they do.

The Domestic Cat..................Public Enemy #1

Can you relate to something called the "food chain"? It's a natural occurance and I hope to god you're not one of those sick people who put their foot down when they see a cat on the road think how overrun with diseased rabbits, rats ect we'd be. Ugh
Our cats are the same, kill anything and everything. I don't mind, I'd rather be rodent and vermin free thank you.
Domestic cats don't transmit disease like "vermin" as they are vaccinated against it (However I am aware that they can be a carrier)

[AengusOg]

Originally Posted by northern_rachel

Can you relate to something called the "food chain"? It's a natural occurance and I hope to god you're not one of those sick people who put their foot down when they see a cat on the road think how overrun with diseased rabbits, rats ect we'd be. Ugh
Our cats are the same, kill anything and everything. I don't mind, I'd rather be rodent and vermin free thank you.
Domestic cats don't transmit disease like "vermin" as they are vaccinated against it (However I am aware that they can be a carrier)

The food chain requires everything in it to be prey to everything above it, until it comes to the top predator. Unfortunately cats have no natural predators, with the exception of the occasional fox which has learned to kill them, and so the food chain is broken in Britain.

As for running them over on the road..........I wouldn't do that deliberately. However, as a predator at the top of the broken food chain, I do have other means of redressing the balance, which are available to me.

As a (hopefully) responsible cat owner, do you not care about the amount of songbirds and certain species of rodents which are seriously endangered due to excessive predation by domestic cats? Have you no sympathy for the plight of the only true wild feline resident of Britain, the Scottish Wildcat, in its struggle for survival as a species, in the face of cross breeding with domestic cats which live a feral existence, and the disease which is spread by them?

Do you care at all about the amount of cats which are born everyday, some of which will end up being rehomed, thus exasperating the problem of overpopulation of this small land mass, or the others which will be destroyed owing to their being carriers of infectious diseases?

Actually, I don't dislike cats, I admire them to an extent, if only for their seeming ability to hypnotise certain weak, self-centred members of the human race into adoring them, and doing everything for them, whilst preventing them from the realisation of the danger cats are to the more important species which we, as humans, have a duty to protect for the generations which follow.

The Domestic Cat...........Public Enemy #1

[IrishDQ]

I think the main threat to wildlife is probably large colonies of feral cats, which wouldn't be a problem if a) individual people/farmers neutered their cats b) the goverment gave more funding to rescues who carry out trap-neuter-release operations.

If the feral populations eventually died out due to not being able to breed (obviously) that would be a large chunk of the cat population gone and back to more manageable pet levels, IMO.

As it is the ferals themselves have a usually bad life and also a very short lifespan, unless there is intervention by a rescue group to vaccinate/neutere/trap, tame and rehome kittens.

anyone who harms a cat is quite sick though as you could be killing somebodys pet, how would you like it if somebody killed your dog or horse because they considered them a threat.

and I think public enemy #1 is humans! cats haven't caused wars, global warming, unneccessary cruelty to other animals/people etc... and what about the amount of wildlife that are poisoned/trapped/killed by people every year. I don't think an average cat could kill a fox either, it's usually the other way around.

[happyhacker101]

;
Actually, I don't dislike cats, I admire them to an extent, if only for their seeming ability to hypnotise certain weak, self-centred members of the human race into adoring them, and doing everything for them, whilst preventing them from the realisation of the danger cats are to the more important species which we, as humans, have a duty to protect for the generations which follow.

The Domestic Cat...........Public Enemy #1[/QUOTE]


I do hope that this comment is not aimed at me A fluffy bunny I am not, we took pussycat in as he was living on the dump on the local farm having been dumped by his previous owner - by taking him in we have "perhaps" saved some of this precious wildlife you talk about He is kept in at nights and we "try" to stop him from getting the birds etc but I will not stop him from hunting stoats, weasles and rabbits - I'd prefer him not to hunt the rabbits but those cute fluffy ickle things make huge holes in my horse's field that could break one of my horses legs so I guess that I'd rather the cat hunted and ate a few than that happen!. As for the weasles and stoats - after being greeted by serveral headless chickens last winter that can only have been killed by stoats or weasles - nothing else small enough could have got into the hen house to cause so much damage (apart from a rat - cat kills them too)

I'd still rather have my cat anyday

[AengusOg]

It's doubtful that stoats and weasels are your culprits which are killing your chickens. I've kept poultry for forty years and I never had one killed by a stoat or a weasel, and I've seen both species regularly around the hen houses, probably hunting mice and voles, and definitely young rabbits.

It's more likely to be mink which are killing your hens.

I'm not at all fluffy either, so we have that in common at least. In fact, I have had a healthy interest in fieldsports for the greater part of my life.

I have, however, lost more chicks to cats than to any other predator in all the time I've had poultry.............this place used to be hoaching with feral cats, as all the farmers kept them to kill vermin on the farms. The trouble was that they didn't stay on the farms, and took a liking for my chicks, and for the local gamekeeper's pheasant poults. There aren't nearly so many now........I don't know what happened to them.

Feral cats are a national problem, but the amount of domestic cats inhabiting a given area of land with the bounds of a large town or city far outnumbers the amount of cats living on a similar sized area in a rural situation, obviously, so it follows that the cute little puss round the corner is doing a good deal more damage, along with his neighbours, than are his country cousins who, although they are also preying on vulnerable species, are doing less intensive damage per square mile of land. So, actually, the true domestic cat causes more problems than do the ferals.

As for your rabbit problem.......if someone aims a gun at a rabbit,they are likely to shoot it; if they use ferrets to bolt it into a net, they will likely kill it; if they use any of the other excellent ways to kill a rabbit, it will spell death for the rabbit. However, keeping a cat to control rabbits is a hit or miss affair, with birds and some mammal species taking the hits more often than not.

IrishDQ.....I take your point, and I have changed my opinion on cats being Public Enemy #1, I amend that to 'The Domestic Cat.........Wildlife Enemy #1'

Cats really are lethal hunters, loved and cared for by millions of people throughout the world............it's just a pity that only a tiny percentage of those people give a toss about wildlife.

[IrishDQ]

I agree there, they probably are since they are an "introduced species" and do pose a threat to native wildlife as any sort of introduced species can upset the natural balance...

I do see that a few pet cats here and there may kill a fair number of wildlife collectively, but I think feral colonies of 50 + or even 100 + cats in rural areas must do more damage, and are usually the result of farmers letting their cats breed, and then their kittens breed etc... until you have a massive colony. If there was more responsible pet ownership (i.e. not getting a pet cat unless your going to neuter it) then obviously the number of cats would reduce.

A lot of the things the cats hunt are animals like mice, rats and rabbits which are by no means endangered. It is a shame they also kill rarer species like wild birds, stoats etc. but unless everybody keeps their cats indoors there is nothing else to be done really. (personally I think it is a good idea to keep urban cats indoors-only anyway, for their own safety if nothing else.)

I don't know exactly how widespread this problem of big colonies living in rural areas is, but I do know of a few last year here, thats only the ones that were dealt with by a rescue group. (one colony of over 70 cats was TNR'd, although they were in a more urban area, another lot of over 100 cats on a farm had to be PTS as they were mostly sickly)

[happyhacker101]

Sorry, but we are going to have to agree to disagree on the cat/stoat/rabbit/hens saga

I know what killed my hens and I am afraid that your 40 years experience in this case doesn't win as we know what killed out hens, we def dont have mink around here as the local farmer would know if we did as he shoots all vermin on sight. I am also good friends with most of the local game keepers and they would also know if this was the case.

You have a point but so do the other posters and I would rather that this thread didn't get into an argument.

Thanks

[AengusOg]

Ok then.

Originally Posted by AengusOg

It's actually an absolute disgrace and a tragedy that so many are allowed to range, unmanaged and continually killing they way they do.

And this would be addressed to ALL cats would it??

I have two, one goes out, one generally stays in... NEITHER hunt... When I have a mouse in the house, it is very much alive, yet wasnt brought in by the cat.... it may have been found by Salem or Kendra who take an avid interest in it, but Kill?? not likely!! Tis ME that has to catch it and release it elsewhere... So, if I were you, I'd think about what I was saying before actually saying it.. not all cats are mindless hunters!!!

Originally Posted by AengusOg

Australia is another case in point........the wildlife of Australia were not equipped to deal with cats and foxes, both introduced by humans, and responsible for the disappearance of several indigenous species, and still killing.

Ofcourse cats (and the colorado potato bug) were introduced to Australia by HUMANS..... be a bit silly to think they were introduced by Koala bears.... but possibly you could have been more precise by stating they were introduced by Travellers, from a different country.... Or perhaps they were introduced by Aliens you never know!!

[Lissy]

I hate to say this....but we not only have cats and foxes that are a problem in Australia, we also have a problem with wild dogs....they are breeding with our dingo's which is reducing the purity of the breed so to speak and also decimating the wildlife populations as they have to eat too, why has this become a problem? Well because of irresponsible owners dumping their so called pets....I guess alot of people just look at the wildlife that has been decimated but if you want to see something worse in Australia just look at it's rivers, streams and other water ways, the amount of introduced fish and crustaceans that has wiped out species is just incredible!
Most problems like this nearly always can be tracked back to people just being irresponsible and down right thoughtless. Ok my whinge is over lol!!

[blackhorses]

I think there is a huge problem with people not neutering cats especially in feral populations which do decimate wildlife, but like all food chains if the prey goes down so do the predators. Cats are top of their food chain - wildcats in scotland used to roam over all of the UK and europe - they are just as ruthless - our domestic cats are descended from such wild cats. So blaming an increadibly effective hunter is pointless, it is us that need to step in as we have created this environment and provided the perfect places for cats to live and breed, cats wether feral or wild have always been here and have always decimated wildlife of all species, it is only through humans taking away habitats, building roads, houses, draining land, agriculture etc that the habitats for these prey species have gone - making them rare, and then cats doing just what cats do, they don't know that a species is rare - so we are really to blame.
I have 18 cats - all feral rejects that I have taken in and neutered - all have moved in - they're not daft - and only about 5 of those can really be bothered to hunt, all of them are in at night though because we have lampers, most of their prey is rats, doves, voles, moles, shrews and mice - although one brought me a rather angry natterers bat which I let go as he was unharmed - birds are usually far too much hassle!!
I think we forget that most UK wildlife is introduced - fallow deer, hares, edible dormice, rabbits, pheasants, muntjac etc none are native and we kill vast amounts of these with shooting etc and the larger animals are slower to reproduce - cats hunt small things which do replenish their numbers quickly.
I think the only way to stop cats killing things is compulsory neutering of feral populations on farms - it doesn't do the cats any favors either - I've seen farms with populations well in excess of 200 - all skinny weak malnourished creatures, at the most farms need 2 or 3 cats for vermin control, you will get other species dying too but we kill far more on the roads or through agriculture than one cat will.
As for chicken killers - the biggest killer is rats - I've lost plenty of chicks even from under hens/geese/peahens, I even lost a not very badly injured almost full grown peacock to rats and 2 adult call ducks - they chewed their heads off, stoats and weasels are usually smart enough to keep away from cats territories and are far less likely to go for chickens - all of the mustelid family are very good hunters and will also eat anything that moves so just as bad as cats really. So I think humans are public enemy no 1!!

[ponypalz]

As more fodder for the "humans are public enemy #1" side, I think I read somewhere that glass windows on houses and buildings actually kill more birds than cats do.

Beautiful kitty, Happyhacker 101! He's very lucky to have found you. I think it is wonderful that you saved him. (Even if murderous thoughts lurk in that pretty head lying so peacefully on the mat.)

My rescued kitty can't hunt. She's a bit slow moving. When I found her, she had a terribly broken arm and was very injured. Vet said that it was likely that someone had thrown her out of a moving vehicle. That seems to go back to my first point, doesn't it?

[happyhacker101]

Blackhorses, totally agree with what you have said. With regard to the hens, they live in the field away from the house, there is a huge weasle population right next door in the woodland, and I mean huge - anyone wanting to go weasle spotting is welcome Anyway, we hadn't had a problem until the last winter which was a harsh one here, weasles were seen in the hen pen and it was at the same time as us losing three of our girls. Hence, we are pretty sure the weasles were to blame. Pussycat like your cats - stays in at night due to lamping etc.

Ponypalz. thanks for your comments, pussycat has a back leg that doesn't flex but he doesn't let this hinder him but I guess it will the older he gets, would prefer him to stay in more than he does, but once winter comes, he only pops out for an hour or so before wanting to be infront of the fire