Advice please (and my steep learning curve)

[Nikki 77]

Hi,

I’m new to the forum and I need some advice because sadly, I have to find a new home for my beautiful horse (my 10 year old 14.3hh chestnut gelding). Sorry for a long post but I need honest and good advice please. I have only been riding for 10 months (late starter, now 33 years old) and under the guidance of my then instructor who managed the livery yard I was learning at I bought my first horse in June 2010. However, he has turned out to be far too strong for somebody of my experience and sadly, we have spent more time arguing than enjoying our riding time together. Only 2 weeks ago, he took off with me (in a full speed uncontrollable gallop) in the school and I did not have the strength to stop him. We did 5 circuits of the school and he fought every effort I made to bring him back snatching the reins and tearing off in the other direction if I tried to pull him into a tight circle and when I did get him back to a speedy trot, he took off again just as quickly. It ended with him leaping sideways to avoid my partner who had entered the school and I came off. Thankfully I’d already given my reins and lost my stirrups in an effort to use all my weight to stop him and so rolled off fairly undramatically and was ok. He came to a very sudden stop about 3 strides later. I was concerned that he may have been in pain from his back or his mouth so took him in but all is ok. He does now know that he has the upper hand with me though. Learning that he had gotten out of work once, he took off with my new instructor (I have changed yards) the next day. She however, made him work til he was exhausted afterwards.

I have had a couple of lessons with him since and we have hacked out (he is much calmer when hacking) but my confidence is shot and I know that he is getting even stronger, the more that is asked of him. Hence, when I was getting the basics, he was not easy but less strong, but now I’m progressing, he is resisting more (and has won against me).

I am so sad. He is so very pretty and fun and impeccably mannered on the ground and I really felt we had developed a bond. I spent my first few weeks with him doing join up and bonding before riding him, as he is a tense and untrusting horse naturally. But I know I am not the right rider for him as I cannot help him to excel and we are not good for each other’s confidence. He has lost respect for me, although my instructor is getting some amazing work out of him with time. He has amazing trot work on the flat and can jump over 1 meter from a 1 canter stride but I did not know any of this until my new instructor started schooling him.

I am hoping a friend of mine and her sister will be able to give him a new home and education as at least I know he will be going to people I trust, who will give him a chance. If not, I am desperate for him to go to a good home with experienced and careful owners.

If anyone has any suggestions, please do let me know. Thank you.

[Flipo's Mum]

Hi! Welcome to NR! I'm not really one in position to offer advice and words of wisdom but I am a fully paid up member of the welcoming party (and the tea and sympathy parade).
I really feel for you in this situation having been there myself. My horse was somewhat green when I got him a 18 months ago, I've had several falls, he's as spooky as they come and a big kid in his head so we were not bound for great things. I considered selling, but I saw the potential and felt I hadn't exhausted all the options, although on saying that, part of my motivation to try to work it out was that I don't think I would have found anyone who wanted a big lump like him. My confidence was completely annihilated in the first couple of months and its taking time to get it back. He went away for retraining, they spent time resetting his bad experiences with me and I then got lessons on him up at the training yard. I got experienced riders to ride him for me to show me that he was learning and this helped my confidence. I spent heaps of time in the school sorting his brakes (still a work in progress!) and I changed his bit - unfortuantely he's larger than life (a belgian draft heavy horse) so a snaffle wasn't cutting it. I know this isn't a substitute for good training but that takes time.
To me it sounds like you have sussed out your situation quite well. You've done what many recommend - lots of groundwork, you're getting someone experienced to check him out, and considered his health as a possible explanation for his or your combined issues. For me I think there's always room for improvement in horsey human relationships. Not many are lucky enough to buy the perfect horse and have to work on the combination but if you feel its too dangerous then you may be making the right decision to find him a new home. What I would say is that it might be difficult to find such a home in the current economic climate. If you are willing to take a hit moneywise I believe there is a website called project horse where people are happy to take on horses with problems but at a lower price.
I did consider sending my horse off to a training yard with a view to them selling him - this is another option but will involve a bit of money on your part. I guess your RI will be able to suggest local options, so I might be telling you stuff you already know but I really just wanted to say I feel your pain, I hope you can sort things out. I'm a sucker for problem horses now and I'd love to see a success story out of your situation but who knows what is ahead. Maybe while you look for a buyer you can continue with the support from your RI and who knows what might happen?
PS - I'm impressed you managed to stay on for five circuits at gallop in the school - my horse would have lost me after one!

[Nikki 77]

Thank you so much for your reply. If I thought there was any way that my boy and I could improve together then I would absolutely give it a chance. My instructor has been riding and schooling him for a few weeks now and he is improving, and when he works, he is very capable, but he takes a lot of out of her (and she is a very skilled eventing competitor) and I do not have the skills or experience to handle him in the school whilst asking more of him. It is unfair that he was sold to someone as inexperienced as I was because he needs someone who can really challenge him and at the same time help him to enjoy his work and gain control.

Finances are way down my list of things to consider in finding him his next home. I just want to see him brought on and happy, with the right person. I absolutely want what’s best for him and will do everything I can to find the right option. He is so good to handle in every other way. It is a heartbreaking decision and I am shedding lots of tears over it. He is not a bad horse…but mentally and physically strong. I think a lot goes back to his history of hunting in Ireland as a youngster. He was brought on by a 13 year old girl when he first came over and she had had him for 3 years competing at local shows before I bought him. There is a very capable and willing horse under it all, but not in my hands unfortunately. In a couple of years maybe I could work with him and enjoy our relationship but not at this stage.

I will look at Project Horses whilst I wait for my friend to get back to me. Thank you for the suggestion.

P.S. If I could have jumped off after 1 circuit, I'd have done so!!! Thank goodness for stickybums

[learningcurve]

Sorry you are having to give your boy up, sometimes tho it is never going to work out.

I don't know how your boy is kept, but my daughters pony who is very sharp is better with 24/7 turnout and a fibre only diet with vit and mineral supplement.

[Trewsers]

Yes, I was going to say what learningcurve said about turnout - perhaps 24/7 might suit? And perhaps allow more steam to be let off?

[Nikki 77]

Hi and thanks for the advice He is on full livery and was underweight and his fitness was down when I moved to my new yard (now wiser, I think someone was aware that he was capable of being strong after we bought him and so managed him this way). He has been on a build up mix and I am assured that this does not lead to hotting up and fizzy behaviour. He is exercised at least 5 days a week and schooled at least twice by my instructor. He is now turned out during the day whatever the weather (and despite the poor owners efforts to maintain their fields) but comes in at night with all the other horses. He is definitely better and less sharp and fizzy when turned out I agree. And he can be on his toes and nosey but he is no problem out hacking. He is not a spooky horse (but will look for things to spook at in the school to try and get out of work if not kept stimulated).

[Sarah_Sayers]

Sending hugs because I know how you feel. I was in a very similar situation, over-horsed with my first horse, and I didn't even learn second time around, had to sell both my first two. Very nearly gave up riding all together after that.

However I found an instructor who went and found a horse for me, and I've never looked back.

There's a difficult decision that needs to be made. Either you can work though it with your horse, but be very careful you don't make this decision just though guilt. Or, if the relationship is just not right, you find him a more appropriate home (don't forget he may well be happier in a new home too).

From the tone of your post I feel you already understand which decision to make. You want to be getting out there and having fun. Being challenged and schooling is not for everyone. Chin up. x

[Nikki 77]

My instructor this time round is really supportive and is looking for a more suitable horse. In fact we have an appointment to view one on Saturday. She is very honest with me and has put herself out so much for us since we came to her yard. She is happy to continue working with us but is honest about where that is likely to end up (disaster and a well educated horse in bad manners and bolting!) and says I will probably not been riding in a year if I carry on. You are right, he would be happier somewhere else, in terms of his work. He has the best of everything right now (not spoilt) and just needs to find the right partner.

Thanks for replying and for sharing your experience.

[Tomas]

After trying out a few shares that were almost suitable and then finding an actual bombproof ride. The difference in just being able to turn up, get on and ride out anywhere is amazing.

In your position I would probably seriously consider selling on and knowing a bit more about the sort of horse you actually want you won't make a similar mistake.

[dancing lucy]

So sorry its not worked out for you but sometimes its best to let go and get another years ago we got a tb she was far too much horse for me or my daughter but we felt sorry for her she was very underweight when we got her and I really suspect she had been doped on something as she was an angel to ride when we tried her. We got her to our yard bought her everything she needed and built her up then the true character came out she was bolshy and would take off with us without any warning absolutely no manners and we didnt have the experience then to do anything about it, I rode her one afternoon down a quiet lane nothing about when she just set off unseated me and as I fell she ran over my ankle luckily only a fracture but I was out of action for a few weeks and I was so glad it wasnt my daughter it happened to I stopped her riding her from then on. A friend (more experienced) offered to try her so I let her she walked her round to our home and as I watched her approaching our gate the horse took off again she couldnt stop her and she bucked her right over her head and legged it off, course I couldnt run cos of plaster so my 2 daughter took off after her I went in the car and realised she had gone onto a major road cars were stopping all over the place and then she went the wrong way round a roundabout a little taxi driver stopped his cab and jumped out and ran in front of her I couldnt believe it (very silly really) but she stopped. After that episode we got rid of her but I ensured that she went to a person who could handle her and wouldnt be riding her on any roads and no children would be riding her. We got another straight away and havent looked back since we have had several since over the many years and always look and try several times before committing to buy Good Luck

[Nikki 77]

Wow, I have to say I’ve not been scared outside of the school, and in fact when I have taken him out hacking after the incident both alone and in company, he’s been behaved. Feel quite lucky considering. Poor you L I have certainly learned about the type of horse I need. There have been days when I really wanted to turn up and ride and focus on my riding skills, but my boy has had other ideas!

I really love being involved in all aspects of horse ownership be it groundwork and bonding, lunging, schooling, grooming, and even mucking out I don't mind putting in the effort all round and in fact, wouldn't enjoy my riding as much if it weren’t for everything else.

And I’m not put off having a horse with quirks - after my first 10 months of riding and learning (quickly) the falls and bangs have not put me off. I've had my fair share from trying to take a big jumping and fast horse over 2ft cross poles ha ha! However, I need to be safe and so does my horse. And I want to look forward to doing local competitions again (not worrying that we might end up in the judges car at the end of a dressage test as we nearly did). These moments make me smile and I have had a lot of nervous laughter, but that’s not good for the learner who wants to keep on progressing and wants her horse to do the same. I love him dearly but we are not compatible. My biggest anxiety is where he might end up when he’s gone. Not sure how to deal with that.

[OwnedbyChanter]

Hi Nikki sorry to hear about your problem with your boy, these things happen and if blame should be placed it should be on the last owners, if you were honest at the time of buying about you riding expereince and level they have sold you your boy dishonestly and this as you have found out is dangerous.

Now that you are selling on be honest with people that come and see him as the same could happen to them as you and he again will be sold on or worst they could get really hurt. That said I dont believe in 'forever homes' I have read this term lots. You could spend weeks if not months holding out for the perfect new owner and a month later they could sell on again even after promising that 'forever home'

Good luck and be safe

[Nikki 77]

I appreciate everything you're saying and thank you. I was completely honest when I bought my boy and for a while was none the wiser. However, just because I was misinformed and ill-advised, I cannot bring myself to let my boy end up in the wrong hands. I have just been up the stable with him having cuddles and kisses. He is so affectionate when he feels secure.

I feel even more strongly about this because we have been looking for a horse for my partner and we went to a 'leading' dealer where we saw horses so out of it they were not reacting to slamming doors, the haylage resembled wet seaweed and the first person we saw, exited a stable with an intravenous syringe with a bent needle in hand containing clear liquid. He then went to find the owner. We left very quickly. I have since been well informed that a high majority of his horses fail the vetting on bloods (for doping). I will not mention names. The thought of my boy ending up somewhere like that fills me with dread.

I know some people see the more practical side to horse ownership, but I am not able to detach so easily. I am not so much looking for a buyer, but a partner for my boy to move forward with. I am wise enough to know there are no guarantees in life, but I refuse to let things happen without trying as hard as I can for the best outcome. As for a forever home, I thought I could be, and would have been for the right horse, had I known then what I know now.

This is my beautiful boy

[Mary Poppins]

I think that it's great that you have admitted that you are over-horsed and are doing the very best to find a suitable home for your boy. It must be very frustrating that you took advice from your riding instructor which turned out to be wrong.

I think that a brave and capable teenager would have lots of fun with your horse. Have you thought about contacting your local pony club and advertising him for loan with a view to buy? He has been handled by a 13 year old in the past and done shows etc. To me, he sound like the type of horse who needs to be kept busy and do lots of different things - I could see him enjoying pony club camp.

I'm sure that you will find him the right home - you are obviously a very caring owner and you will do what's best for him.

[Nikki 77]

That's a great idea! His previous owner did tell me he had done pony club with her before and loved it. And maybe I can give an opportunity to someone who would not otherwise be able to afford to buy a horse. The only guarantee I need is that he will be well looked after, and if things got too much, to be honest with me before sending him off to somewhere undesireable in case I could help.

I'll know this weekend if that's an option I will need to consider (I will have heard back from my friend by then). Thank you so much