Jess' ongoing issues

Jessey

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Dec 20, 2004
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Suffolk, UK
She's really got us stumped, Jess is like a yo-yo in terms of her soundness. Good luck getting to the end of this!

6 weeks ago I went out with a friend for a lovely ride, I knew the going would be good so didn't boot her for it. She acted a complete idiot, jumping, plunging and cantering sideways but felt strong throughout our ride. 2 days later she wasn't quite right but not awful, then about a week or so after that she suddenly got worse, I shut her in the corral and about 36 hours later we had a little abscess pop, she was much improved but not 100%. Its basically gone on like this since, she now has evidence of 2 abscesses bursting in each front foot (all lateral heel).

Last week she seemed to be steadily improving;
Tuesday vet came and said sound in front but mildly lame left hind and suspected an abscess (hoof tester reaction in the medial heel).
Friday the farrier came out and no reactions to hoof testers anywhere and he trimmed her (nothing out of the normal) and found bruises in both lateral heel buttresses and she went from half/10 lame to a good 5 /10 on the straight :( (definitely left fore) I gave 1g bute.
Saturday she was vastly improved on Saturday so gave 1/2g.
Sunday still good so another 1/2g of bute.
Monday she was barely off on the straight and was galloping round like a dermish so I didn't give any bute.
Tuesday morning she looked OK still.
Tuesday evening was pointing with the LF at rest :( So not wanting to bute her (because she charges around when it doesn't hurt) I decided to put her hoof boots on.
Weds morning she was much improved.
Weds evening I trotted her up and she's less than half/10 lame.
Today she was still really comfortable but I have had to take them off as her feet were getting too squishy (with all the rain the neoprene heel captivator was holding the water on I guess).

I'd love to slap a set of shoes on and be done with it at this point but they have made her lamer the last few times we have tied (various shoe types) but I just don't know what else to try. After the vets talk on Tuesday I was all for trying injected anti-inflammatories but is it an inflammatory problem if the hoof boots make it so much better....?
 
I'd have a talk with your farrier and maybe get some X-Ray's done.

Her whole pattern sounds very similar to my welsh cob, though I hope it isn't the same. In his case we X-rayed because I couldn't keep him sound in work and to our horror found severe rotation and very little sole, they were so bad I thought we were going to lose him there and then. Anyway to cut a long story short he's now in full work, shod with pads and putty and a proper pocket rocket. He's insulin resistant so has to be managed carefully and work really helps, it's a vicious circle because he needs to be sound to work but if he isn't worked it becomes very difficult to keep him sound. He can't cope without shoes, pads and putty because they protect the tip of the rotated pedal bone, and also mean if there is a problem he already has supports in place - I'm sure this would mean some people saying he isn't truly sound, but it's better than we'd ever hoped for.

I can't remember, has she been tested for metabolic problems?
 
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I'd have a talk with your farrier and maybe get some X-Ray's done.

Her whole pattern sounds very similar to my welsh cob, though I hope it isn't the same. In his case we X-rayed because I couldn't keep him sound in work and to our horror found severe rotation and very little sole, they were so bad I thought we were going to lose him there and then. Anyway to cut a long story short he's now in full work, shod with pads and putty and a proper pocket rocket. He's insulin resistant so has to be managed carefully and work really helps, it's a vicious circle because he needs to be sound to work but if he isn't worked it becomes very difficult to keep him sound. He can't cope without shoes, pads and putty because they protect the tip of the rotated pedal bone, and also mean if there is a problem he already has supports in place - I'm sure this would mean some people saying he isn't truly sound, but it's better than we'd ever hoped for.

I can't remember, has she been tested for metabolic problems?

We had 2 sets of X-rays, 5 views of each front foot when she first went lame and again after 6 months and we saw nothing boney going on, the only note was thin soles which had improved a bit by the 2nd set. We did try her with pour in pads but she went lame in them. The lack of anything in either work up or xrays led to the diagnosis of "caudal heel pain" which is beautifully non-specific.

She is confirmed PPID and on prascend and is suspect for EMS but as I have always managed her with a low starch/sugar diet and restricted grazing her insulin levels have always been within the normal range.

I do think consistent work helps her, I can't remember back to last year if I rode her until she was sound or if she came sound then I rode her more, either way she was sound for almost 6 months.
 
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I have read it all and boy she is a puzzle. I am sorry I have no advice as you seem to be doing everything you can think of. I remember you going through the whole shoeing thing and she did seem the worse for it. Hopefully she will stay more sound than not! The only thing I would maybe do is get her tested regarding the EMS??
 
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I have read it all and boy she is a puzzle. I am sorry I have no advice as you seem to be doing everything you can think of. I remember you going through the whole shoeing thing and she did seem the worse for it. Hopefully she will stay more sound than not! The only thing I would maybe do is get her tested regarding the EMS??
She has been tested but her insulin results come back normal, but as she is already on the diet that would be used to manage it that doesn't mean she doesn't have it, it could mean it is controlled.
 
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You see that is what i mean, you have been doing everything right regarding tests and diet. I am sure it is so frustrating for you.
 
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The putty my farrier uses doesn't cover the whole sole as that would put too much pressure on areas that don't want it, maybe something more like that would be worth considering?

I'm glad X-Ray's are clear, that's always a relief.

If she has suspected ems then I'd recommend looking at EquiLife's NoMetSyn, the ladies on the phones won't give you a hard sell and are very helpful & knowledgeable.
 
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The putty my farrier uses doesn't cover the whole sole as that would put too much pressure on areas that don't want it, maybe something more like that would be worth considering?

I'm glad X-Ray's are clear, that's always a relief.

If she has suspected ems then I'd recommend looking at EquiLife's NoMetSyn, the ladies on the phones won't give you a hard sell and are very helpful & knowledgeable.

Is it dental impression material he uses?
 
My first thought when you mentioned abscess on top of abscess was PPID. PPID seems to weaken the system in some horses to cause them to have one abscess after another.

My good friend's horse was diagnosed PPID and insulin resistant. She did everything by the book in terms of his care, including dry lotting him. She weighed his hay, had him on Pergolide, then Prascend when it came on the market. It got to where he had more days with abscesses (or the aftermath) than not. He was barefoot, she would fill the abscess holes with whatever her vet gave her,mwhen boot him ----every day.

It was labor intensive to say the least. Her horse was in his late teens by the time he got diagnosed, she laid him to rest when he was 22.

One of my horses was diagnosed insulin resistant and foundered so bad, I thought I would lose him. Rotation one hoof was so severe, it's a miracle he didn't sink. He never had an abscess.

It just seems once the pituitary gland is affected, something happens within the horse to make their hooves a lot more vulnerable.

The best you can do is keep your horse off any sort of grains, keep him off ration balancers that use SOY as the protein source, and feed the lowest NSC value grass hay you can find.

Too much iron can also be a booger as it depletes copper and zinc. Copper and zinc are needed for hoof & coat health and also to stabilize insulin.

I feed a condensed vit/min supplement from HorseTech that does not use soy as the protein source, has no added iron, and guarantees a maximum 4.25% NSC value per three ounce serving.

I mix both horses needed supplements in Timothy pellets and a bit of water so they can't blow the powdered or meal stuff out --- which they will given the chance, lol

What I have learned about farriers: One finds out just how good they aren't when one suddenly has a horse with Special Needs hooves.

The smartest thing I did was to carry my IR horse to the clinic to let the owner/house vet's farrier start shoeing him. The house vet is a leg/hoof specialist. He X-rays the hooves when the shoes come off, tells the farrier precisely how to trim them.

Farrier trims, TACKS shoes on, horse goes back to x-Ray area for X-rays. If the vet doesn't like the trim, I have seen him order the shoes back off for two millimeters.

The horse has de-rotated so much in seven months, he is miraculously sound for light riding --- that's a two-edged sword because I am not sound enough for light riding.

The horse is also in special shoes. They are full rocker aluminum shoes created by Dr. Ric Redden. Dr. redden is an equine podiatrist and has had papers published. If you're interested, he does do overseas consultations (he is in Kentucky, United States) with vet's and/or farrier's.

the day those full rocker shoes went on my foundered horse was the day he stopped shifting his weight from one leg to the other. Seeing the comfort he could find was enough but to see him actually de-rotate was nothing short of a miracle.

in short, the key to my horse becoming sound again was changing farrier's and carrying him to the vet e Rey five weeks to let the vet's farrier do the shoeing.

Dealing with abscesses compounds your efforts but maybe there could be a chance to reduce the repeated abscess with a different approach to the farrier's management of the hooves.

I didn't mean to write a book but this is serious and expensive business. I want to share whT I know based on personal experiences.

Wishing you the very best:)
 
My first thought when you mentioned abscess on top of abscess was PPID. PPID seems to weaken the system in some horses to cause them to have one abscess after another.

My good friend's horse was diagnosed PPID and insulin resistant. She did everything by the book in terms of his care, including dry lotting him. She weighed his hay, had him on Pergolide, then Prascend when it came on the market. It got to where he had more days with abscesses (or the aftermath) than not. He was barefoot, she would fill the abscess holes with whatever her vet gave her,mwhen boot him ----every day.

It was labor intensive to say the least. Her horse was in his late teens by the time he got diagnosed, she laid him to rest when he was 22.

One of my horses was diagnosed insulin resistant and foundered so bad, I thought I would lose him. Rotation one hoof was so severe, it's a miracle he didn't sink. He never had an abscess.

It just seems once the pituitary gland is affected, something happens within the horse to make their hooves a lot more vulnerable.

The best you can do is keep your horse off any sort of grains, keep him off ration balancers that use SOY as the protein source, and feed the lowest NSC value grass hay you can find.

Too much iron can also be a booger as it depletes copper and zinc. Copper and zinc are needed for hoof & coat health and also to stabilize insulin.

I feed a condensed vit/min supplement from HorseTech that does not use soy as the protein source, has no added iron, and guarantees a maximum 4.25% NSC value per three ounce serving.

I mix both horses needed supplements in Timothy pellets and a bit of water so they can't blow the powdered or meal stuff out --- which they will given the chance, lol

What I have learned about farriers: One finds out just how good they aren't when one suddenly has a horse with Special Needs hooves.

The smartest thing I did was to carry my IR horse to the clinic to let the owner/house vet's farrier start shoeing him. The house vet is a leg/hoof specialist. He X-rays the hooves when the shoes come off, tells the farrier precisely how to trim them.

Farrier trims, TACKS shoes on, horse goes back to x-Ray area for X-rays. If the vet doesn't like the trim, I have seen him order the shoes back off for two millimeters.

The horse has de-rotated so much in seven months, he is miraculously sound for light riding --- that's a two-edged sword because I am not sound enough for light riding.

The horse is also in special shoes. They are full rocker aluminum shoes created by Dr. Ric Redden. Dr. redden is an equine podiatrist and has had papers published. If you're interested, he does do overseas consultations (he is in Kentucky, United States) with vet's and/or farrier's.

the day those full rocker shoes went on my foundered horse was the day he stopped shifting his weight from one leg to the other. Seeing the comfort he could find was enough but to see him actually de-rotate was nothing short of a miracle.

in short, the key to my horse becoming sound again was changing farrier's and carrying him to the vet e Rey five weeks to let the vet's farrier do the shoeing.

Dealing with abscesses compounds your efforts but maybe there could be a chance to reduce the repeated abscess with a different approach to the farrier's management of the hooves.

I didn't mean to write a book but this is serious and expensive business. I want to share whT I know based on personal experiences.

Wishing you the very best:)
As above, I have had 2 full sets of x-rays, there is no rotation. We do not believe this is a lamanitic/founder episode as she shows no pain at the toe and frog pressure makes her lamer not sounder, the diagnosis was for heel pain.
Jess has never been fed any significant amount of grains, as already mentioned I have always maintained her on a high fibre, low sugar, low starch diet and she does receive a vitamin and mineral balanced diet suitable to a horse with metabolic issues, I am all too aware of the issues around high iron and deficient copper and zinc among the many other problems often seen with mineral imbalance. I've also tried multiple farriers over the last few years, and multiple different types of shoes, we considered rockers but due to our soil here they are not suitable.
 
What type of soil are you on that rocked shoes can't be used? This is purely out of curiosity, I'm not questioning your farrier's judgement. For a while we had Little Un in shoes that were rolled all round, initially they helped but as he came back into work I started to feel he wasn't quite sure about his balance/foot placement at times so they were changed, but they'd done the job needed by then anyway. They were wide web alloys, looking at the wear he now gives steel shoes I think he'd be needing new ones every couple of weeks!
 
What type of soil are you on that rocked shoes can't be used? This is purely out of curiosity, I'm not questioning your farrier's judgement. For a while we had Little Un in shoes that were rolled all round, initially they helped but as he came back into work I started to feel he wasn't quite sure about his balance/foot placement at times so they were changed, but they'd done the job needed by then anyway. They were wide web alloys, looking at the wear he now gives steel shoes I think he'd be needing new ones every couple of weeks!
We're on sand so wouldn't get much effect from rockers as they need a relatively hard surface to allow them to rock, as I also have dirt floors in the stables and no solid surfaced yard the only time they would do anything would be when we're out on the roads, which isn't much in the grand scheme of things.
We tried rollers too and she appeared better for a week or two then went down hill quite dramatically so we only did 2 sets of those.
 
Have you moved to the new location yet? I just wonder if it's your current location that is somehow not right.

Also is it the hoof that's the problem? Could it be elsewhere and the hoof being thin soled shows a problem.
 
Have you moved to the new location yet? I just wonder if it's your current location that is somehow not right.

Also is it the hoof that's the problem? Could it be elsewhere and the hoof being thin soled shows a problem.
The horses haven't moved yet, it will be a few more weeks, it had crossed my mind that perhaps the move would benefit her but I think thats wishful thinking really.

The original lameness definitely blocked to the foot, but I have had the rest of her checked by a physio and Richard Maxwell just in case.
 
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