confirmation of law regarding weights when towing

summerguest

New Member
Aug 25, 2006
317
0
0
Blue wicked...is it really the trailers max capacity that counts....and not its actual laden weight being towed at the time ( as weighed )

I was led to believe that if you weighed in at less that total train weight of car or were pulling less than cars towing capacity you were legal. ( even if unsafe given the 85% of kerb weight rule)
 

noodle

New Member
May 29, 2007
2,237
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0
46
Essex england
www.waggy-walkers.co.uk
Ok, I am going to sound REALLY thick now.
I have a merc vito 110cdi van, 5 yrs old.
I want to get a tow bar fitted, but before I do I need to know what sort of weight I can tow with the van.
I have looked in the manual and it says

max permissable trailer load in KG

2,000 braked, unbreaked 750

then it says max permissable gross combination in KG on gradients upto

8% 4,600 10% 4,600 12% 4,600.
Can anyone help me out with what all this means!

Plus what sort of trailer{second-hand} would be best.
Sorry for having a REALLY thick moment
 

Samantha1980

New Member
Mar 14, 2005
691
0
0
North Aberdeenshire
can some please copy and paste the bit that says the tow vehicle must be capable of pulling the MAM (maximum authorised mass, [the weight of trailer and max load])
I can see where it says not to exceed GTW (kg of everything) and not to exceed GVW (tow car and contents) but can find the bit about the tow vehicle and MAM of trailer:confused:
thanks
I was led to believe that the tow vehicle must be capable of towing MAM was a EU rule and although it applies to the UK there is no British bit of law specifying it. hence all the confusion it has caused.
 

summerguest

New Member
Aug 25, 2006
317
0
0
If you go on the goverment website it states there are no uk laws regarding towing vehicles of less than 3 tons. recomendation is do not tow a trailer weighing more than your towing vehicle can pull stated in the manual.
The confusion seems to be around this EU guideline.
 

MrKia+Me

Non member
Aug 1, 2008
2,237
0
0
Right heres an example as I see it and have researched it.

I have a Nissan Xtrail DCI sport 2.2l. It has a MAX braked Towing weight of 2500kgs. My MAX weight 505 is 2340kgs as stamped on my trialer plate.

Therefore I am LEGAL to tow with it as even although the kerb weight is 2000kgs this is a CARAVAN recommended weight for cars not for a braked horse trailer. If your horse trailer is not braked then I could only tow a max of 750kgs which means that I couldnt tow with the car at all as the UNLADEN weight of the trailer is 905kgs.

I tow Kia who is for tellings sake about 500kgs he is lighter than that but is a round number. With my 505 which when you add them together is 1405kgs plus about 50kgs for tack/water butt etc so the car is towing 1455kg which is obviously below my max train weight AND if you want to count it below my KERB weight.

This is my example many people may have others. I have spent week researching this and was glad that BW brought it to my attention.:)

Nikki xxxx
 

paynel

Liam N Pen Pen
Jul 22, 2003
382
0
0
Dudley
equestrian-angel.com
hi just to add a comment. I phoned DVLA a month ago as me and my friend are looking for a trailor. I am 19 years old and i past my test February 2007. The DVLA said to me...they had my driving license number and everything and said that i could tow a horse trailor on my own as long as i wasnt over the weight and that i was insured? I asked them if i could have this in writting and they said they was more than welcome to....So im confused now?
 

BlueWicked

fluff-free
Jan 13, 2008
2,358
1
0
in the real world...
hi just to add a comment. I phoned DVLA a month ago as me and my friend are looking for a trailor. I am 19 years old and i past my test February 2007. The DVLA said to me...they had my driving license number and everything and said that i could tow a horse trailor on my own as long as i wasnt over the weight and that i was insured? I asked them if i could have this in writting and they said they was more than welcome to....So im confused now?


errr.... yeah, of course they would say that - but you WILL be over weight :eek::rolleyes:

Im sorry but it really irritates me that a lot of people dont bother to do ANY research themselves - even when all the facts are spread out (inc weights ;) ) on the previous pages. On your own head be it...
 

Nookster

Active Member
Oct 21, 2002
7,014
1
38
Im looking at the ford mavericks and nissan terrano's after xmas so i can get a trailor. where can i get the towing information for those vehicles from?


Ford Maverick 2.0 is 1500kg and the 3.0 is 1700kg which is not sufficient to tow I’m afraid. Shockingly low tow weights for this vehicle to be honest! Nearly matched my Subaru impeza that I just bought and I would never in my life consider towing with that.

Nissan Terrano come in at either 2800kg or 3000kg dependent on model. This would cover for instance a ifor 505 trailer with the MAM of 2600kg but I couldn’t comment at all on how well they drive.

You will need to do your trailer test as it is a very rare thing in my eyes to get a tow combination that is below 3500 tonne combined.

Best to be fully covered so would always advise doing your tow licence and the heaviest tow vehicle possible. As you can imagine skimping to allow you travel is one thing but endangering yourself, your horse and other road users is another.


Hope this info helps :)
 

paynel

Liam N Pen Pen
Jul 22, 2003
382
0
0
Dudley
equestrian-angel.com
Nookster - thanks for the reply, yeh would never put my horse in danger or any other road users. i was lookin at the 2.7 maverick searched a few sites and came up the towin near enough as god as the terrano.....im not having a brand new maverick there vile to look at and too small there more of a 4 x 4 looker than a horse worker lol. and being my age i gotta think whats best as my insurance is going to be £1,600 for a maverick/terrano just TPTT!! Or wether to get a 3.5 ton horse box...transit? What do you reckon?
 

Nookster

Active Member
Oct 21, 2002
7,014
1
38
Nookster - thanks for the reply, yeh would never put my horse in danger or any other road users. i was lookin at the 2.7 maverick searched a few sites and came up the towin near enough as god as the terrano.....im not having a brand new maverick there vile to look at and too small there more of a 4 x 4 looker than a horse worker lol. and being my age i gotta think whats best as my insurance is going to be £1,600 for a maverick/terrano just TPTT!! Or wether to get a 3.5 ton horse box...transit? What do you reckon?

Really your choice :)

But ruddy hell for insurance price! thats a serious ouch ouchy! Baffles me sometimes the prices they charge! They charge you that for a 4x4 yet i'm only a couple of hundred for a 2ltr turbo wrx impreza. But i'm old :D being old is finally starting to have its good points :D

If it were me - get all quotes for both insurance, running costs and weigh up which will fit into your finances and life the best. :)

Have you consider looking at the older discoverys at all? they can be picked up for a good price and they can sometimes be a nice surprise insurance wise :)
 
Last edited:

paynel

Liam N Pen Pen
Jul 22, 2003
382
0
0
Dudley
equestrian-angel.com
oooo u got the car of my dreams....wait til i turn 25 for a scooby tho lol... yeh have been looking at the discoverys, there a group 12 and a maverick and terrano only 10...so would be more on insurance i would think, I am paying £2,300 now and its only a 1.6 suzuki vitara soft top. I do luv it tho hehe...oo and thats TPFT too !!
 

ILurfSmurf

New Member
Nov 27, 2006
2,103
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28
Sussex
i-lurf-smurf.bebo.com
ok :eek: i've tried to do some research on my dads behalf - but am failing!!!
Could someone please help :eek:

Volvo XC90 2.4L 2004 - max towing weight 2250kg
does this mean that to tow an IW505 with 2 horses (murph is 470kg, the other i cant imagine being more than 500 - to be on the ULTRA safeside give them 600kg each, with a a trailer of 905
that equals 2105kg, so even being extra cautious, i'm still within the cars towing limit of 2250kg.

But it's not legal, because the max weight of the 505 is 2340kg - so i'd need to buy the trailer, and get it replated to 2250kg, to legally tow it?

phew! can someone confirm i've got this right (or more likely, horribly wrong!), please! :eek:

I'm really shocked, tbh - at how much info there is on the internet about this subject, that all contradicts each other!!!! So many people have told me that we can buy one and go and all is well, because its within the cars towing capacity, and that it doesnt need to be replated? And others are saying something about Gross train weights (that really confuses me!) and that i can/cant tow it because of that! I'm a bit confused - and all the different abbreviations are doing my head in (if i see MAM written one more time i'll probably cry - i STILL dont understand what it means!
I really tried hard to work it out on my own but i have decided i need more experience advice :eek:
Someone help me, i'm all confuzzled :eek:
 

BlueWicked

fluff-free
Jan 13, 2008
2,358
1
0
in the real world...
ok :eek: i've tried to do some research on my dads behalf - but am failing!!!
Could someone please help :eek:

Volvo XC90 2.4L 2004 - max towing weight 2250kg
does this mean that to tow an IW505 with 2 horses (murph is 470kg, the other i cant imagine being more than 500 - to be on the ULTRA safeside give them 600kg each, with a a trailer of 905
that equals 2105kg, so even being extra cautious, i'm still within the cars towing limit of 2250kg.

But it's not legal, because the max weight of the 505 is 2340kg - so i'd need to buy the trailer, and get it replated to 2250kg, to legally tow it? :eek:

yes, if you get the trailer derated to 2250kg you would be ok. that covers you legally -presuming you have your B+E or passed before 1997
 

Finn1985

Its toooooo cold
Mar 5, 2009
47
0
0
Fife
This law is silly. I think there should be exceptions. My bf is a farmer and he is able to tow an 11tone bailer with his tractor but he cant tow me and my horse to a show - unless we hitch the box on the back of his tractor (which we have done)

i got told by a police officer friend that if the total weight of the trailer + load was lower than the weight of the tow vehical than you are still able to tow. so everyone, just load the car full of concreat blocks and we are good to go.
 

Iron Maiden

Koumpounophobic?
Sep 14, 2006
3,881
2
0
UK
I'm always a bit sceptical about taking what the police say as gospel because in my experience enforcement can differ from force to force and the discretion of the officer may or may not come into it. This is what the Department for Transport website says on the subject:

Requirements regarding trailers used on the road are given in the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, as amended and the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989, as amended. The following is a summary of the main requirements.

Weight
In the case of light trailers, that is less than 3500kg maximum laden weight, there is not any specified relationship in UK law between the weight of the towing vehicle and the weight of the trailer.

For M1 category vehicles (motor vehicles used for the carriage of passengers and comprising not more than eight seats in addition to the driver's seat) the maximum permissible trailer weight is quoted by the vehicle manufacturer. Alternatively, the vehicle manufacturer may provide a maximum gross train weight (the laden weight of the trailer plus the laden weight of the towing vehicle). If this is exceeded it is possible that the Courts or Insurance Companies may take the view that this constitutes a danger.

The maximum laden weight of a trailer which may be towed by a light goods vehicle depends on both the stated gross train weight of the towing vehicle (GTW) and the vehicle manufacturer's recommended maximum permissible trailer weight. Neither the maximum permissible trailer weight or the maximum gross train weight (the laden weight of the trailer plus the laden weight of the towing vehicle) should be exceeded. It is possible that the stated gross train weight is less than the sum of the stated maximum permissible laden weight of the towing vehicle and the stated maximum permissible laden trailer weight. In this case the towing vehicle and the trailer must be loaded such that each does not exceed its individual maximum limit and the sum of both does not exceed the maximum gross train weight.

It is not a requirement to display a notice of the unladen weight of the trailer or the towing vehicle, unless the towing vehicle is either a motor tractor or a locomotive, as defined in the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986.

I tried to find out what the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, as amended say but they have been amended about a million times and I lost the will to live. But the key thing is that there is no reference to trailer MAM. My interpretation of this is that you need to make sure your trailer, as towed on the day, is within the vehicle's maximum permissible trailer weight and the vehicle & trailer together don't exceed the max train weight. Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong!

Where the MAM is important is with the licensing requirements. If you look up the relevant legeslation (I did being a saddo) it is very clear that you need to add together the MAM of the trailer, irrespective of its actual load on the day, and the weight of the towing vehicle. If you have passed your test after 1/1/97 this total must not exceed 3500kg. You can downplate the trailer if you aren't going to load it to anywhere near the MAM.
 

Niv2

New Member
Oct 3, 2007
358
0
0
I'm always a bit sceptical about taking what the police say as gospel because in my experience enforcement can differ from force to force and the discretion of the officer may or may not come into it. This is what the Department for Transport website says on the subject:



I tried to find out what the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, as amended say but they have been amended about a million times and I lost the will to live. But the key thing is that there is no reference to trailer MAM. My interpretation of this is that you need to make sure your trailer, as towed on the day, is within the vehicle's maximum permissible trailer weight and the vehicle & trailer together don't exceed the max train weight. Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong!

Where the MAM is important is with the licensing requirements. If you look up the relevant legeslation (I did being a saddo) it is very clear that you need to add together the MAM of the trailer, irrespective of its actual load on the day, and the weight of the towing vehicle. If you have passed your test after 1/1/97 this total must not exceed 3500kg. You can downplate the trailer if you aren't going to load it to anywhere near the MAM.

Correct. MAM is virtually irrelevant if you have Cat E on your licence....you do not need to get your trailer replated. In effect, the only requirement is to ensure that the weight of the trailer and its contents do not exceed the stated towing weight of the vehicle.
 

ali-c

New Member
Jan 20, 2007
359
0
0
Scotland
Correct. MAM is virtually irrelevant if you have Cat E on your licence....you do not need to get your trailer replated. In effect, the only requirement is to ensure that the weight of the trailer and its contents do not exceed the stated towing weight of the vehicle.

This is my interpretation of it too. Hope it's right because it is really confusing.
 

Alexa&Tess

Member
Sep 2, 2008
811
0
16
Hiya

OK, so I passed after 1997 so I can only drive up to 3.5 tonne.

So....

I have a volvo V40, kerb weight 1800, max braked towing weight 1400. The Robinsons single horse trailer has an unladen weight of 600Kg and a gross weight of 1400Kg. So that totals at 3.2 tonne. So I should be able to tow that legally from a car/trailer point of view and a licence point of view?
 
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