I have owned my own Welsh cob now for 3 years and she is fantastic - have done lots of hacking alone and in company. Have just started riding a gorgeous 4yr old TB ex-racehorse retrained for riding and not racing. She is very sweet and at first hacked out alone beautifully - but about 3 weeks ago she started refusing to go out alone and on Sunday I could not even get her down the drive - lots of backing up and in the end she backed into a fence - i was scared she would hurt herself so came back, any ideas why she has started doing this?? we are getting on great otherwise
hacking alone
- Thread starter branwyn
- Start date
Did anything happen on the ride just before she started to refuse - it may be something that you really didn't register at the time but that the horse thought was pretty significant. I don't even mean a fright (although it could be) but more a change in your patterns or behaviour.
Alternately - check her back and saddle - if she's sore she's not going to want to go anywhere so make sure that you eliminate physical reasons.
Alternately - check her back and saddle - if she's sore she's not going to want to go anywhere so make sure that you eliminate physical reasons.
Thanks for your help - don't think she's made a real best friend although we have been hacking out a lot with one other mare so it could be that. did try again today and managed a whole circuit of the nursery adjacent to the yard (did not try the drive again!)
so will work on this. Was very windy on Sunday so could have been that which upset her although we have been out when it has been windy before
branwyn
so will work on this. Was very windy on Sunday so could have been that which upset her although we have been out when it has been windy before
branwyn
Hi Branwyn
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I'd say she has just got used to being ridden with the other mare as you said, and she will have assumed that's what you were going to do, so got a surprise when she was taken out on her own. What she was saying was "I'd rather go out with the other mare than by myself". My guess is that, as you're finding, she'll get used to it again quickly enough. Horse generally do prefer company out hacking, but when they're used to it, will for the most part, go by themselves.
I think you're doing all the right things. Just keep perservering by herself for a bit, so that she realises it's fun, and something she will be doing, and you'll be fine.
.
I'd say she has just got used to being ridden with the other mare as you said, and she will have assumed that's what you were going to do, so got a surprise when she was taken out on her own. What she was saying was "I'd rather go out with the other mare than by myself". My guess is that, as you're finding, she'll get used to it again quickly enough. Horse generally do prefer company out hacking, but when they're used to it, will for the most part, go by themselves.
I think you're doing all the right things. Just keep perservering by herself for a bit, so that she realises it's fun, and something she will be doing, and you'll be fine.
Can anyone explain please why she may find it is fun to hack out?
I have wondered whether horses enjoy hacking out? And why the riding school horses that hack out seem so happy to canter even though some of them dawdle when walking? Is it that they are trained to canter at certain points so that it is habit, part of the work they know they must do?
Or do they really enjoy it, like dogs like being let off the lead when taken for a walk? Reading about horse behaviour, one might imagine they would rather stay at home eating all day.
I have wondered whether horses enjoy hacking out? And why the riding school horses that hack out seem so happy to canter even though some of them dawdle when walking? Is it that they are trained to canter at certain points so that it is habit, part of the work they know they must do?
Or do they really enjoy it, like dogs like being let off the lead when taken for a walk? Reading about horse behaviour, one might imagine they would rather stay at home eating all day.
Thanks for that - will just keep going out for short hacks alone and gradually build it up again
branwyn
branwyn
Skib,
The two things at work herein are genes and environment.
By nature (i.e., genes), the horse is a "roamer" and a "herd" animal (among other things.) It was programmed to move freely in wide open spaces; so, unless someone has tampered with Mother Nature's plan, the horse likes to run free with its herd in open country.
However, the artificial environmental factors, such as confining a horse to a small area, or isolating a horse from the (or any) herd have a direct affect on, and will often result in overriding the horse's natural instincts.
So, some horse's have a stronger "roamer" instinct and continue to enjoy moving (going places) in open spaces; while others have been conditioned to the artificial environment, and fear leaving their confinement or isolation.
Which is which, is very much unique to each individual horse.
Generally, out here in cowboy country, we see a lot of horses in both "camps", because we still have a large ranching presence, along with a large city presence (with the attendant boarding of horses.) So, we see a lot of the behavioral problems with the boarded horses (hacking and many other mental and emotional problems), that we do not generally see with ranch horses, or horses that are boarded in large open pastures.
If the "roaming" gene is still strong (vis-a-vis conditioning), then the horse will enjoy going places.
As an anecdote: An acquaintance of mine purchased a seasoned Hanoverian/Thoroughbred cross three years ago from a seller in Seattle, and moved the horse to Montana. The horse had always been stalled, except for work and Dressage shows.
When the horse arrived in Montana, and was placed in an enclosed stall with a small attached paddock, the horse refused to leave the stall and walk out into the paddock (although the door was always open.) Emotionally, he couldn't handle the extra space. And, the horse exhibited neurosis.
Eventually, he learned that he could come out of the stall and move around the small paddock (25'x25'); then, when he demonstrated that he was completely comfortable with the arrangement (about one month), he was moved to a larger stall/paddock arrangement; and, the emotional acclimation process started all over again. He spent a year in this paddock (75'x125'.)
Then he was moved to a 200'x100' paddock, and the acclimation process repeated.
Then, last year, the fence separating his paddock from a 40 acre pasture was removed, and the acclimation process repeated.
At each and every change to more open space, this horse had significant emotional difficulty; until he got used to the space.
Then, horses were pastured with him one at a time; which again, he had to learn how to deal with.
Now, after three years, he is actually looking and behaving like a normal, well-adjusted horse: running with a herd. And, he exhibits all of the signs of being happy (unlike his prior neurosis.)
Although only an anecdote, it is indicative of the kinds of problems that we see in some horses that are not allowed (or required) to hack out occasionally. Hacking out accomplishes many things for a horse (and rider); but, among the most significant (albeit subtle) is that it gets the horse back to its genetic roots.
As an aside: The same general situation can be found on the subject of "isolation."
Best regards,
Harry
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Harry
Thank you so much. I really hoped you would have time to give my question some thought and to answer it. And as always your explanation is so illuminating. I am very grateful.
Not least because I love hacking and much of my learning to ride takes place out in the open on what feel (as I ride them) to be willing, happy horses.
With thanks for your insight.
Thank you so much. I really hoped you would have time to give my question some thought and to answer it. And as always your explanation is so illuminating. I am very grateful.
Not least because I love hacking and much of my learning to ride takes place out in the open on what feel (as I ride them) to be willing, happy horses.
With thanks for your insight.
aaaah!! that sounds all too familiar!!! when i first got my pony shed go out on her own without any trouble! then, one day, (on my birthday!!), she decided she didnt want to any more
i suspect it was to do with the fact she got more settled at the new yard and made some pals and found it hard to leave them
i took her out inhand on her own a couple of times, and hacked with 1 or 2 other horses a few times. since then we have ventured on our own again a couple of times (never very far though) and, even though she seemed a little wary the first time, she appears to be fine now. i just have to be quite adamant with her and make sure she does not get a chance to turn around at her lesiure. mind you, that's my pony who can be a stubborn little poo at times!
julia
x
i suspect it was to do with the fact she got more settled at the new yard and made some pals and found it hard to leave them
i took her out inhand on her own a couple of times, and hacked with 1 or 2 other horses a few times. since then we have ventured on our own again a couple of times (never very far though) and, even though she seemed a little wary the first time, she appears to be fine now. i just have to be quite adamant with her and make sure she does not get a chance to turn around at her lesiure. mind you, that's my pony who can be a stubborn little poo at times!
julia
x
sorry for the stupid question
I am in the US, so I'm not familiar with the phrase "hacking out". Does that mean trail-riding? Is it done alone or in groups?
Sorry for my dumb question.
I am in the US, so I'm not familiar with the phrase "hacking out". Does that mean trail-riding? Is it done alone or in groups?
Sorry for my dumb question.
As I understand the terms usage in the UK, it is trail riding, road riding, or cross-country riding; or some combination thereof. Basically, getting out of the stables and off the premises.
It is done singularly and in groups.
Harry
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It is not a silly question, even in Britain. I am sorry I used the word. I never think of myself as hacking out. I just "go for a ride".
When I registered for my first riding lesson, I was asked my objective. I said I just wanted to ride like riders one sees on local bridle tracks. The young woman informed me that I wanted to "Hack out" and wrote it on my form.
In normal English the word "hacking" stands by itself. Hacking out is a horsey person's language. Harry is right that hacking out seems to mean riding outside a manege or school, and on public gound.
What is a trail? Is trail riding done only on specified trails? In England we have an insufficient network of bridle tracks. But some lengths are very short. In British English one can have a short length of track, but one could not have a short trail. We have some long distance bridle paths and the word trail suggests something more like these.
Harry used the words Cross country. In some places, when conditions, are suitable riders in the UK are allowed to leave the track and ride where they want. We call that hacking too. Is this what you call cross country in the States?
Cross country is used in the UK (I think) only for advanced riding as in one part of competitive Eventing and always involves fixed jumps. UK riding stables advertise that they have cross country sources. Whereas hacking out would normally be walk, trot and canter -without galloping or jumping.
But in the UK we also have the word Pony Trecking. Is this trail riding? Pony Trecking is when groups of riders, not necessarily experienced riders, are taken for longer rides across open country. It is often part of a riding holiday or an educational trip for school children including non-riders. I have never done it but I know it is looked down on by some teachers of "real riding" who use it as a term of abuse, implying that one learns nothing by hacking out since it is mere pony trecking, each horse just following the one in front.
In the UK there seems to be an extreme division of opinion over hacking out. Either it is viewed (by teachers and riders alike) as one of the most dangerous things one can do on a horse, or so elementary as to be beneath contempt.
This is a new rider view. I am not even sure I have the British bit right.
When I registered for my first riding lesson, I was asked my objective. I said I just wanted to ride like riders one sees on local bridle tracks. The young woman informed me that I wanted to "Hack out" and wrote it on my form.
In normal English the word "hacking" stands by itself. Hacking out is a horsey person's language. Harry is right that hacking out seems to mean riding outside a manege or school, and on public gound.
What is a trail? Is trail riding done only on specified trails? In England we have an insufficient network of bridle tracks. But some lengths are very short. In British English one can have a short length of track, but one could not have a short trail. We have some long distance bridle paths and the word trail suggests something more like these.
Harry used the words Cross country. In some places, when conditions, are suitable riders in the UK are allowed to leave the track and ride where they want. We call that hacking too. Is this what you call cross country in the States?
Cross country is used in the UK (I think) only for advanced riding as in one part of competitive Eventing and always involves fixed jumps. UK riding stables advertise that they have cross country sources. Whereas hacking out would normally be walk, trot and canter -without galloping or jumping.
But in the UK we also have the word Pony Trecking. Is this trail riding? Pony Trecking is when groups of riders, not necessarily experienced riders, are taken for longer rides across open country. It is often part of a riding holiday or an educational trip for school children including non-riders. I have never done it but I know it is looked down on by some teachers of "real riding" who use it as a term of abuse, implying that one learns nothing by hacking out since it is mere pony trecking, each horse just following the one in front.
In the UK there seems to be an extreme division of opinion over hacking out. Either it is viewed (by teachers and riders alike) as one of the most dangerous things one can do on a horse, or so elementary as to be beneath contempt.
This is a new rider view. I am not even sure I have the British bit right.
Thank you too Harry for your explanation. I always thought Sennie did enjoy hacking, but was not exactly sure why.
I think the term "hacking" comes from the hunting field, where a hack is a lightweight horse that is used to take someone to and from the hunting field where they change horses and ride the hunter during the hunt itself. I've never been hunting, so I don't know how much of this still happens, but maybe someone who has can let us know. A "show hack" would be this type of horse, pretty and lighter weight for show hack classes at a horse show.
Confusing because if you go to buy a horse in UK and it is described as a "safe hack" it doesn't mean it's a lightweight, or its only been used to take someone to a hunt. It just means that the horse is used to riding out and should be pretty non spooky, but it may well be a cobby type horse.
May S, for me, hacking out means riding on the farm where I keep Sennie, or possibly on the roads and bridle ways. maybe on our own or maybe with others. It could be from about half an hour upwards, and could well include a gallop. Certainly did last weekend! We are lucky though, as we have 100 acres to ride about on, so don't need to go on the roads.
I think the term "hacking" comes from the hunting field, where a hack is a lightweight horse that is used to take someone to and from the hunting field where they change horses and ride the hunter during the hunt itself. I've never been hunting, so I don't know how much of this still happens, but maybe someone who has can let us know. A "show hack" would be this type of horse, pretty and lighter weight for show hack classes at a horse show.
Confusing because if you go to buy a horse in UK and it is described as a "safe hack" it doesn't mean it's a lightweight, or its only been used to take someone to a hunt. It just means that the horse is used to riding out and should be pretty non spooky, but it may well be a cobby type horse.
May S, for me, hacking out means riding on the farm where I keep Sennie, or possibly on the roads and bridle ways. maybe on our own or maybe with others. It could be from about half an hour upwards, and could well include a gallop. Certainly did last weekend! We are lucky though, as we have 100 acres to ride about on, so don't need to go on the roads.
Skib,
We need a permanent thread for terminology and vernacular.
Then there's range riding, which refers to riding on the large expanses of rangeland where cattle typically graze. (This is the province of the "ranch horse.")
My use of "cross country" (uncapitalized) is descriptive of general riding off-road, to cover a lot of country; not to refer to Cross Country, which is the specific riding discipline (sport.)
I also use the term "road ride" to differentiate hacking out on roads, versus on trails or range riding/cross country.
We also use the term "...been in the mountains." Which means the horse has been mountain trail riding. (This is deemed a significant skill for a horse; because of the high and extensive mountains, and the predators therein.)
Then there is "packing", where the horse is used as a pack animal, to haul supplies and equipment; on packing trips (usually into the mountains.)
Then there is "...has packed Elk"; which refers to that fact that a horse that has carried out part of the carcass of a killed Elk on its back. This is valued over here in mountain hunting country. (It's just about impossible to get an Elk carcass out of the mountains a piece at a time, before the bears and other critters claim it; horses are essential to getting it out. And, you can well imagine how a horse will react the first time it smells fresh Elk blood; up close: All of the survival instincts kick into high gear.)
All of the above are done singularly or in groups. And all require training/acclimatization of one sort or another.
Best regards,
Harry
We need a permanent thread for terminology and vernacular.
Similar to/same as your Bridle Path in the city; or a foot path in the forest. I use the term generically, because of the wide variation of trails for casual riding over here; in the city and without.
Then there's range riding, which refers to riding on the large expanses of rangeland where cattle typically graze. (This is the province of the "ranch horse.")
My use of "cross country" (uncapitalized) is descriptive of general riding off-road, to cover a lot of country; not to refer to Cross Country, which is the specific riding discipline (sport.)
I also use the term "road ride" to differentiate hacking out on roads, versus on trails or range riding/cross country.
We also use the term "...been in the mountains." Which means the horse has been mountain trail riding. (This is deemed a significant skill for a horse; because of the high and extensive mountains, and the predators therein.)
Then there is "packing", where the horse is used as a pack animal, to haul supplies and equipment; on packing trips (usually into the mountains.)
Then there is "...has packed Elk"; which refers to that fact that a horse that has carried out part of the carcass of a killed Elk on its back. This is valued over here in mountain hunting country. (It's just about impossible to get an Elk carcass out of the mountains a piece at a time, before the bears and other critters claim it; horses are essential to getting it out. And, you can well imagine how a horse will react the first time it smells fresh Elk blood; up close: All of the survival instincts kick into high gear.)
All of the above are done singularly or in groups. And all require training/acclimatization of one sort or another.
Best regards,
Harry
Greentchr
A Lighter Shade of Green
cross country riding
[Sorry- attachment of jpeg doesn't seem to work- it is a great picture, though!]
This is a picture of what we refer to as cross-country here in southern Idaho (hopefully the picture shows up in the post- I have not tried a picture before). We basically saddle up, ride out the back yard and into the mountains. It is high desert, so there are a lot of scrub (short and tough) plants, a lot of rock (ahhh, those rock-monsters can be scary for a spooky horse!), and trees in the higher elevations. There are several hundred miles of area in which to ride. This particular area is a National Forest. There are a number of trails anywhere from 2-50 miles in length, but the trails are not always great for horses because motorized vehicles (4x4s, motorcycles and jeeps, and snow mobiles in the winter) also use them on occasion. I am not brave enough to go too far at a time at this point, so I am not sure what is on the other side of the mountain, though I know there are several hundred square miles of forests, complete with bears, cougars, moose, hunters, and other scary things!. The problem with riding cross country for a novice like myself is much more opportunity for hurt to both horse and rider. Trail riding has it's advantages, as the rocks are 'moved' and the branches don't attack. However, the feeling of being free to enjoy my horse, a friends company and a beautiful ride is worth the potential hazards. It just makes us more attentive.
Thank you, everyone for the terminology lessons! this forum is amazing. I have never had the opportunity to correspond with those outside my own country, and I find I like it very much! It is exciting to see the 'sameness' and the differences between horse people of different parts of the world.
[Sorry- attachment of jpeg doesn't seem to work- it is a great picture, though!]
This is a picture of what we refer to as cross-country here in southern Idaho (hopefully the picture shows up in the post- I have not tried a picture before). We basically saddle up, ride out the back yard and into the mountains. It is high desert, so there are a lot of scrub (short and tough) plants, a lot of rock (ahhh, those rock-monsters can be scary for a spooky horse!), and trees in the higher elevations. There are several hundred miles of area in which to ride. This particular area is a National Forest. There are a number of trails anywhere from 2-50 miles in length, but the trails are not always great for horses because motorized vehicles (4x4s, motorcycles and jeeps, and snow mobiles in the winter) also use them on occasion. I am not brave enough to go too far at a time at this point, so I am not sure what is on the other side of the mountain, though I know there are several hundred square miles of forests, complete with bears, cougars, moose, hunters, and other scary things!.
The problem with riding cross country for a novice like myself is much more opportunity for hurt to both horse and rider. Trail riding has it's advantages, as the rocks are 'moved' and the branches don't attack. However, the feeling of being free to enjoy my horse, a friends company and a beautiful ride is worth the potential hazards. It just makes us more attentive.Thank you, everyone for the terminology lessons! this forum is amazing. I have never had the opportunity to correspond with those outside my own country, and I find I like it very much! It is exciting to see the 'sameness' and the differences between horse people of different parts of the world.
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Hacking out alone
Hi I am new here but I was reading your thread about hacking out alone.
I have had my 13 year old new forest x cob on loan for over a year, the first week of having him I took him out on my own after going out first with someone else and he was fine. Then I took him out a second time and he just refused to go past a particular point so I turned round and came back. Then I was told by someone at the livery stables that they had spoken to Casper's owner and told him that I was out for a hack on my own and he asked how it went because when he is on his own he tends to spin round and come back (not charging back but just decides that he will hack back home)and the only reason I managed it the first time was because he did not know his way home(my pony is a VERY quick learner), then when I was doing the riding and road safety test he decided to do just that, spin round and come back the way he had come. I still passed though and the exminer said that I had handled it very well, had not panicked and checked everything etc. I was very relieved and much to my surprsie I did not panic and he had reared up and spun round, now I can't even get halfway down the track we use for hacking before he wants to come back, so I just go with others, it is a bit annoying when you have a lovely crisp autumn morning and you want to just amble round the roads etc with no-one but your horse for company but then I suppose I will just have to accept him the way he is, any other way he is a beautiful pony (came 5th in Family pony section at a big horse show we have here every May Bank Holiday).
Sorry for the long post
Hi I am new here but I was reading your thread about hacking out alone.
I have had my 13 year old new forest x cob on loan for over a year, the first week of having him I took him out on my own after going out first with someone else and he was fine. Then I took him out a second time and he just refused to go past a particular point so I turned round and came back. Then I was told by someone at the livery stables that they had spoken to Casper's owner and told him that I was out for a hack on my own and he asked how it went because when he is on his own he tends to spin round and come back (not charging back but just decides that he will hack back home)and the only reason I managed it the first time was because he did not know his way home(my pony is a VERY quick learner), then when I was doing the riding and road safety test he decided to do just that, spin round and come back the way he had come. I still passed though and the exminer said that I had handled it very well, had not panicked and checked everything etc. I was very relieved and much to my surprsie I did not panic and he had reared up and spun round, now I can't even get halfway down the track we use for hacking before he wants to come back, so I just go with others, it is a bit annoying when you have a lovely crisp autumn morning and you want to just amble round the roads etc with no-one but your horse for company but then I suppose I will just have to accept him the way he is, any other way he is a beautiful pony (came 5th in Family pony section at a big horse show we have here every May Bank Holiday).
Sorry for the long post
hacking, trail riding, trekking
I used to think of "hacking" as when riders get dressed up their stylish English clothes and go for a ride somewhere like Hyde Park--as much to be seen, as to get out. But then I figured out from reading here that the term pretty much covers all riding outside the immediate school (which is essentially the way "trail riding" is used here).
I think what you call "pony trekking" would be covered by a couple of different terms here. A day trip with a guide would just be a "guided trail ride". But you can also do "pack trips" where you travel long distances on horse back, and camp out for one or many nights with what you (or the hired outfitters) pack in.
Grace
I used to think of "hacking" as when riders get dressed up their stylish English clothes and go for a ride somewhere like Hyde Park--as much to be seen, as to get out.
But then I figured out from reading here that the term pretty much covers all riding outside the immediate school (which is essentially the way "trail riding" is used here).I think what you call "pony trekking" would be covered by a couple of different terms here. A day trip with a guide would just be a "guided trail ride". But you can also do "pack trips" where you travel long distances on horse back, and camp out for one or many nights with what you (or the hired outfitters) pack in.
Grace
Harry, Sorry, it took me a bit of time to appreciate and understand your description of training a horse to carry a dead elk.
There is even a saying used in the UK about people "Horses for courses". Meaning the right person for the job.
What you meant to teach us was that when two riding schools argue about whether or not it is safe to take novice riders out on a hack, the argument is pointless. It is indeed pretty safe to ride out on school horses which spend all day every day hacking. Each newly arrived horse is ridden by a staff member until they too are accustomed to the tracks and the public surroundings, just as you train your horse to carry an elk.
But it is a different matter to ride out from a school where the horses are used for competitive jumping and dressage and only hack out once or twice a week.
It is valuable for me to understand this, as complete strangers (experts) may suddenly declare that what we are doing is dangerous, without knowing anything about our horses or background.
There is even a saying used in the UK about people "Horses for courses". Meaning the right person for the job.
What you meant to teach us was that when two riding schools argue about whether or not it is safe to take novice riders out on a hack, the argument is pointless. It is indeed pretty safe to ride out on school horses which spend all day every day hacking. Each newly arrived horse is ridden by a staff member until they too are accustomed to the tracks and the public surroundings, just as you train your horse to carry an elk.
But it is a different matter to ride out from a school where the horses are used for competitive jumping and dressage and only hack out once or twice a week.
It is valuable for me to understand this, as complete strangers (experts) may suddenly declare that what we are doing is dangerous, without knowing anything about our horses or background.
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