How are criollos broken in?
- Thread starter criollocrazy
- Start date
Well said Amber and Kathy!!
The reason I bought my Criollo/Argentine Horse was for the way he was trained to ride eg Western , I had no interest in buying a Pure Bred or x foal that was untrained.
The reason I bought my Criollo/Argentine Horse was for the way he was trained to ride eg Western , I had no interest in buying a Pure Bred or x foal that was untrained.
hi all and old buddy must admit I was on a mission when last posted as so incensed by hoof trimmers tale of what has happened to andy she is treating. I will say as a horse rider I am massively attracted to western in what I perceive is the relaxed way of going. I have been quite shocked to see some dreadful images on youtube of western training - but them I can say the same about dressage and rollkur, showjumping and hedgehog skins,endurance and forcing horses way past what they are capable of...then you add in breed ugenics such as culling perfectly healthy yearling exmoor foals cos they have white markings and then saying the rest are quite wild and wary after their first human contact is roundign up and hot branding ( like the not the nine oclock news joke about the talking gorrila)for example...
I think for the crillos that get homes over here rather than salami susages they must think they are in seventh heaven and well done those proffessional horse dealers such as criollo farm who have spotted an opportunity to sell on such horses. There is a very good video by Dylan Winter the Travelling horse that shows a criollo that got of the meat ship in italy and was ridden back to the UK - v.sound horses. I do however think that by doing so it encourages totally unwittingly the continuing of such training methods ( though to hark back to another ancient shoe 'Brass'its a bit like not tipping the poor waiting class so they uprise - it just doesnt work!).
I personally think that the only way to guarantee an 'unspoilt ' horse would be to buy direct and unbroken from the breeder - but then I dont think thayt I have the skills to bring on a youngster after 38 years of riding so I am back to squARE ONE!
I think for the crillos that get homes over here rather than salami susages they must think they are in seventh heaven and well done those proffessional horse dealers such as criollo farm who have spotted an opportunity to sell on such horses. There is a very good video by Dylan Winter the Travelling horse that shows a criollo that got of the meat ship in italy and was ridden back to the UK - v.sound horses. I do however think that by doing so it encourages totally unwittingly the continuing of such training methods ( though to hark back to another ancient shoe 'Brass'its a bit like not tipping the poor waiting class so they uprise - it just doesnt work!).
I personally think that the only way to guarantee an 'unspoilt ' horse would be to buy direct and unbroken from the breeder - but then I dont think thayt I have the skills to bring on a youngster after 38 years of riding so I am back to squARE ONE!
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I don't understand this obsession with papers!! All my horses are great, none are papered. Rocha is a brilliant little horse and yes she may have been boated over here, paperless, intended for use as a sausage but she is just as good as anyones papered horse!!
As much as I love Greasedweasels Criollo I do not think that he is any better than our 'sausage' horses - they all do their jobs well, suit their owners and there is no need for moral high ground from anyone
Rant over
As much as I love Greasedweasels Criollo I do not think that he is any better than our 'sausage' horses - they all do their jobs well, suit their owners and there is no need for moral high ground from anyone
Rant over
I think she bought one off the boat too!
Maybe once these were sausage horses - Its not just luck dealers are getting well over £4000 for these horses, very expensive sausages - not to mention the cost of skippering the boat from Argentina to Italy with vets, grooms, feed fuel, whos eating these horses ??? The King of Italy!! lol
Maybe once these were sausage horses - Its not just luck dealers are getting well over £4000 for these horses, very expensive sausages - not to mention the cost of skippering the boat from Argentina to Italy with vets, grooms, feed fuel, whos eating these horses ??? The King of Italy!! lol
B*gger going to have to reply! This thread was never about papers though as I will admit I have now deleted my posts I cannot prove that!! However I can assure you KT that neither of our horses came off the boat and am more than willing to scan you their import documents for "proof" - please think before you type especially when you are talking about someone's business. I may be a lot of things but hypocrite I am not!
I personally think that kind of treatment is cruel, beating a horse with its head snubbed to a post. Culture or tradition I dont think can be an excuse. People use that against the whole foxhunting thing when people say its a tradition so i dont buy it at all compared to cultures etc wrong is wrong in my view.
Before people go all fluffy on me I am not an NH person or one for the 'old ways' as people call them i just have my own ways of doing things that work for me, yes I will hit a horse if required but beating them whilts they are tied to a post aint something I would do.
If this is truly the way and it does produce quiet minded safe horses then maybe we have to think is the horse suppressed inside itself but that again is another argument.
Having read all the replies and what this thread has turned into i dont think that attacking GW for standing up for what she believes is the right thing to do. She has a fully papered stally that is breeding lovely foals if you look at her website (assuming your a she BTW) and he works just as much as they are supposed to giving catty remarks (KT) about someone elses horse that you know nothing about is childish and plain rude.
So are all the criollos in this country 'sausages' then??? Have people not improted them with their papers directly from trainers/breeders??? I am sure I saw a thread a while back about someone importing a few direct from Argentina or was I wrong??? Yes we see rescue horses 'saved' from the meat farms but those people tend to shout from the rooftops that they are doing this not buying a legit animal.
I think a few people need to think before they type and not attack specific members when they dont agree. I alove a good discussion but witch hunting I am not for.
Nikki xxxx
Before people go all fluffy on me I am not an NH person or one for the 'old ways' as people call them i just have my own ways of doing things that work for me, yes I will hit a horse if required but beating them whilts they are tied to a post aint something I would do.
If this is truly the way and it does produce quiet minded safe horses then maybe we have to think is the horse suppressed inside itself but that again is another argument.
Having read all the replies and what this thread has turned into i dont think that attacking GW for standing up for what she believes is the right thing to do. She has a fully papered stally that is breeding lovely foals if you look at her website (assuming your a she BTW) and he works just as much as they are supposed to giving catty remarks (KT) about someone elses horse that you know nothing about is childish and plain rude.
So are all the criollos in this country 'sausages' then??? Have people not improted them with their papers directly from trainers/breeders??? I am sure I saw a thread a while back about someone importing a few direct from Argentina or was I wrong??? Yes we see rescue horses 'saved' from the meat farms but those people tend to shout from the rooftops that they are doing this not buying a legit animal.
I think a few people need to think before they type and not attack specific members when they dont agree. I alove a good discussion but witch hunting I am not for.
Nikki xxxx
I cant see any catty remarks. And there is certainly no witch hunting going on.
GW was the one who felt patronised & wanted to leave the forum beacuse she/he didnt agree with peoples feelings of compassion!!
I completely agree that people should be able to have their opinion without being attacked, but this is exactly what GW is doing to others!!
GW was the one who felt patronised & wanted to leave the forum beacuse she/he didnt agree with peoples feelings of compassion!!
I completely agree that people should be able to have their opinion without being attacked, but this is exactly what GW is doing to others!!
I don't like bad feeling on any subject, but I quite agree with Amber on this, GW is the first to have a go at any of us that dare to show an opinion.
Well again I dont feel it that way. I dont own a criollo had no idea what one was until I joined this forum (shock horror at me lol). I just dont see how some behaviour can be condoned and some criticised when it all comes back to the same thing the treatment of horses.
Would I pay 4k for a horse destined for meat. No i wouldnt i wouldnt pay that for a horse period never mind one without papers. Do the boats emply grooms etc??? I thought it would just be the same as when they are lorried chucked in travelled the off loaded when they got to destination??? Would it not cost the shippers money/seller money to pay grooms muckers etc to travel back and forwards???
Yes you cannot just buy horses with papers, heck Kia only has his passport because i got it done so i am not one who is all about that. I just dont think that going on about ethics and breaking etc is justifiable when people are buying animals from a meat boat 'After' they have been transprted then loving the temperament that these beatings have produced. I personally think you have been ripped off if you have paid that amount of money for a meat horse when you could get a horse with just as lovely a temperament over here.
I personally sometimes think that Britain is the dumping ground for the continents rejects and what the dealers bring over from the continent to sell to us is just what cannt be sold over there goes to aution and picked up cheap t be sold to us at ridiculously inflated prices. You get the ones that are actually what it says on the tin but sometimes well you get the picture.
Nikki xxxx
Would I pay 4k for a horse destined for meat. No i wouldnt i wouldnt pay that for a horse period never mind one without papers. Do the boats emply grooms etc??? I thought it would just be the same as when they are lorried chucked in travelled the off loaded when they got to destination??? Would it not cost the shippers money/seller money to pay grooms muckers etc to travel back and forwards???
Yes you cannot just buy horses with papers, heck Kia only has his passport because i got it done so i am not one who is all about that. I just dont think that going on about ethics and breaking etc is justifiable when people are buying animals from a meat boat 'After' they have been transprted then loving the temperament that these beatings have produced. I personally think you have been ripped off if you have paid that amount of money for a meat horse when you could get a horse with just as lovely a temperament over here.
I personally sometimes think that Britain is the dumping ground for the continents rejects and what the dealers bring over from the continent to sell to us is just what cannt be sold over there goes to aution and picked up cheap t be sold to us at ridiculously inflated prices. You get the ones that are actually what it says on the tin but sometimes well you get the picture.
Nikki xxxx
V
vimto92
Guest
Sorry... but how on earth could anybody justify beating a horse, affecting them mentally and physically, and most of all... actually find it acceptable? I feel like I've stepped onto a whole new forum to be honest... surprised to say the least.
I see the debate like this:- by buying these horses we are perpetuating (condoning...?) the trade, ergo the breaking method. Not so. We are paying a premium price for horses which may (or may not) be destined for the meat market, which is up to us if we can afford it and want a safe horse. The breaking method would be the same whether we bought them or not. They'd still be shipping for meat whether we bought them or not.
Can't think that anyone would condone the leg tying/beating method. Criollo buyers take a chance on getting horses with "issues" or old injuries, and like I said, we pay a premium for the privilege, and that's up to us. All the owners I know work with their horses to overcome these problems, and yes, the horses must think they are in heaven in comparison to their old lives. Personally, it breaks my heart to think of what they may have gone through, but I'm giving them a chance to move on and leave all that behind. My payoff is having a couple of sensible, clever, characterful horses. Can't see that I should beat myself up about that...
Can't think that anyone would condone the leg tying/beating method. Criollo buyers take a chance on getting horses with "issues" or old injuries, and like I said, we pay a premium for the privilege, and that's up to us. All the owners I know work with their horses to overcome these problems, and yes, the horses must think they are in heaven in comparison to their old lives. Personally, it breaks my heart to think of what they may have gone through, but I'm giving them a chance to move on and leave all that behind. My payoff is having a couple of sensible, clever, characterful horses. Can't see that I should beat myself up about that...
western-saddler
New Member
I have a friend who worked for a few years in Argentina. She said their methods of breaking is cruel. Yes they often castrate with no anaesthetic like the Andy mentioned before and yes they have had problems picking up back feet for trimming. But interestingly the Argentinians often think we are cruel for stabling and incredibly cruel for putting horses down that are 'no good'. In fact, friend was saying that her Argentinian friends have rescued a number of horses in the UK they heard were going to be destroyed. Apparently if a horse is no good in Argentina it gets turned out for a wild life in a herd. Thought i would add a different perspective
Luckily (for me) I was only there for 3 days. I only saw this awful training a few hours before I was due to leave. They were in the middle of nowhere and I had to wait for the taxi to come and get me. It was awful :'( All the horses were really shut down. The one I saw them 'work' was in as a training livery for a couple who were new to horses. This mare would pull back when tied up. So they trussed her up, and when she fell over they beat her. The owner and I were both crying. The owner was from switzerland and understood no english. I said to her 'Monty Roberts' and she nodded so I hope she understood there was another way.
Incidentally, this yard is considered to be one of the top western training/breeding establishments in France
I've PM'd you regarding this.
Sorry to sound rude but nikki shut up! Before you say i been ripped off for paying £5000 for my criollo Terro have you met my horse? Have you met any of the horses that us criollo owners have. All of us have a deep and loving bond with our horses. The Character of my beloved horse terro is worth the money i paid for him. His personality and the the close bond isn't something i could get from any old horse. The work i put into him just to be able to do things like pick up his feet and put a rug on him has paid off with the way he follows me around. I trust that horse with my life and he trusts me. I could leave the stable door open and he wouldn't run away he would stay in his stable cause thats where he feels happy and content. So please consider our criollos before you blabber off on one and calling my stunning horse a 'continent reject'
Grow up your sound like a brain washed diot!!
I dont care how much you paid for your horse or how you got it. Honestly couldnt care how it is treated by you either.
My point is that you all condone the breaking of these animals the way they are broken but still love them for the way they are, they're tempraments and obedience. I have a special bond with my horse and hes in no way a criollo. Everyone with I have read about with a 'different' type/breed of horse from the norm seems to think they are different from other horses. Not slagging the icy/fjord owners here but a few of them seem to think they are different as well. They are ALL HORSES!!!! Your bond with yours will be just as deep as me with mine!!!
Get a life and read my replies before you tell anyone to shut up.
I have as much right to my opinion as you do so stop trying to patronise someone and give orders when, to use your words, you donot know me or my horse.
Honestly I despair with some of the people that use this forum I really do
nikki xxxx
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Why do they not walk trot canter like everything else???
Do you ride them abck to front or something??? I mean might be a bit hard but i was under the impression they were horses and I have ridden some lovely horses in my time with fabulous temperaments and movement and they werent beaten to a pulp to break them.
Nikki xxxx
Grow up your sound like a brain washed diot!!
I dont care how much you paid for your horse or how you got it. Honestly couldnt care how it is treated by you either.
My point is that you all condone the breaking of these animals the way they are broken but still love them for the way they are, they're tempraments and obedience. I have a special bond with my horse and hes in no way a criollo. Everyone with I have read about with a 'different' type/breed of horse from the norm seems to think they are different from other horses. Not slagging the icy/fjord owners here but a few of them seem to think they are different as well. They are ALL HORSES!!!! Your bond with yours will be just as deep as me with mine!!!
Get a life and read my replies before you tell anyone to shut up.
I have as much right to my opinion as you do so stop trying to patronise someone and give orders when, to use your words, you donot know me or my horse.
Honestly I despair with some of the people that use this forum I really do
nikki xxxx
Clearly you slaqgged off the criollo by calling it a continent reject that is what i objected to. I didn't say my horse was any different to yours or anyone elses. I care for 4 horses who are all of british breeding as well as my own. I do not treat them any different to mine and i love them all the same no matter if my personal own is a argentian criollo or if harry is a welsh section a or if gin if a welsh section D. There all my responcerbilty of care and i love them all. Also i do not care how my terro as broken in at all in argentina. at the end of the day the breacking in of any horse is traumatic. Working with my work college to break in a welsh pony even being as careful as we can we still frightened the hell into her when we tried her with the dummy. Think about it horses arn't ment to carry people!
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