I know how to ride, you squeeze with your knees

[newforest]

That's a comment I got the other day from a lady who rode in the 60's. They have no concept that things may have changed, horses might be ridden differently.
But are we riding that much different? is that a simplistic view and not complicating things, or an outdated attitude. They want to buy a horse and assume they are expedienced enough to ride anything they view.
There are definately horses out there I can't for love or money ride, I will hold my hand up and say if they need to be kept between hand and leg all the time that's pretty much me stuffed!
Age, health, knowledge, experience, confidence mean I will get into deep do do with something too sharp and onward bound. I would put myself in the novice category. I don't feel I could ring up about any horse I liked the look of and get it going well, but maybe that's because I have had mine ten years and you are happy with what you know?

 

[Trewsers]

I think things change over the years for sure. When I had lesson as an adult they were different to the odd ones I'd been given as a child / early teen. There are lots of horses that I couldn't ride very well, but I guess I could ride them - just not well! lol
I always think the whole " I can ride" thing is open to interpretation. And of course it depends on the horse, some horses will give your average rider a good ride without them putting in any effort or knowing how to. Others just won't do very much at all.
When you say get it going well - I've always marvelled at riders who can do that. I once went to view one. Took RI with me. Seller was in awe and said she'd never managed to get her horse to go that well before ever ! My RI got him going really well. I managed to achieve walk and two strides of trot. Before giving up and knowing my limits.

 

[carthorse]

I think someone who thinks they're experienced enough to ride anything is either incredibly talented and skilled or, and far more likely, stupid and arrogant.

I do think horses are still horses, particularly when it comes to normal riding horses rather than specialised very high level competition horses and while styles may have changed a bit the very basics are still similar. That said I learned over 40 years ago and was never told to grip with my knees for general riding - maybe if the ponies were being cheeky and staying on was an issue, but not to actually ride. But admittedly that wasn't as far back as the 60s - if she learned then and hasn't ridden since then how old is she and what exactly is she looking at buying, because I would guess she's at an age when most people, even if they've ridden all their lives, are looking at taking things a bit easier in their choice of horse and coming back after that big a gap and straight away looking to buy feels a bit foolhardy.

I'm not convinced the training of horses has changed hugely, but I do think the type of horse around has. Lots more warmbloods and warmblood crosses, also more coloured cobs than I remember. And people seem to buy with far less experience, and a lot of the experience they have is in an arena rather than out and about. There also seems to be a much bigger problem with people overhorsing themselves - the time was that you bought what you could ride now and if you later wanted to do more than that horse was capable of you sold it on and bought the next step up. A combination of these factors is almost certainly why we have so many problem/project horses nowadays!

After all my waffling, yes I do think some things have changed but I think more things have stayed the same below high level competition. People seem less sensible about their abilities though and many don't seem to understand horses are horse - maybe that's the biggest change of all?

 

[chunky monkey]

I think if people say they can ride, ask them to do some schooling. You soon find out how much or little they can.
I class myself as a novice. Sure i can walk trot and canter and pop some teeny jumps. Can i ride no way. I ride like a sack of potatoes for starters. Can i school a horse no chance. Should i be riding a horse, probably not.

 

[carthorse]

I think if people say they can ride, ask them to do some schooling. You soon find out how much or little they can.
I class myself as a novice. Sure i can walk trot and canter and pop some teeny jumps. Can i ride no way. I ride like a sack of potatoes for starters. Can i school a horse no chance. Should i be riding a horse, probably not.

Is your horse happy and under control? Are you happy and safe doing what you want to do? If the answers are yes then you can ride that horse.

 

[chunky monkey]

Is your horse happy and under control? Are you happy and safe doing what you want to do? If the answers are yes then you can ride that horse.

Very questionable just now.

 

[PePo]

Good horsemanship has always been good horsemanship. I think the end goal is the same as it always has been - e.g to produce a responsive, mechanically sound horse that is a safe, pleasant ride - but I think there are now many more accessible roads, which can only be a good thing as long as the horse is put first.

Also, what's desirable may be totally different from one discipline to the next - but lots of basics are the same.

I also think there's possibly more understanding and use of science which providing it's used right can be a hugely help to both rider and ultimately horse.

A 'good' rider is open to so much interpretation and so dependent upon so many factors but I think for the most part, we need to remember that do most of us pleasure riders need to ride any horse? Very, very few (if any). So, most of us for the can can choose to ride the type of horse's we like in the way we like providing we aren't detrimental to the horse.

I like schooling so have regular lessons, take part in clinics and so on to improve my technical skills as a rider but also enjoy going out for hours hacking.

I'm totally outclassed by lots of people I know. Does my horse care? I doubt it.

 

[newforest]

Schooling is open to interpretation as well though. The cob knows what she needs to know. We can do a simple dressage test, pop a little course of jumps, hacks alone or company- prefers behind.
Waiting at road junctions very important. Waiting for me to do gates, working on the waiting for me to get on! She's still on the keen you've hopped let's go side.
I am leisure rider, just happy and content.

 

[PePo]

Schooling is open to interpretation as well though. The cob knows what she needs to know. We can do a simple dressage test, pop a little course of jumps, hacks alone or company- prefers behind.
Waiting at road junctions very important. Waiting for me to do gates, working on the waiting for me to get on! She's still on the keen you've hopped let's go side.
I am leisure rider, just happy and content.

Oh absolutely. Anything can be open to interpretation though, surely?

A dressage test can be anything from Intro A to a Grand Prix dressage test. Or you could be riding at Inter II and never set foot in a competitive arena.

Jumping a course can be anything from a few fences at 50cms to Grand Prix jumping .

Hacking can be ten minutes around the block to a 80km endurance training ride.

I don't pretend to be anything other than a leisure rider - I'm not interested in categorizing myself into a box. As long as my horse is happy and we are making progress that's enjoyable and beneficial to us both, I'm happy.

 

[newforest]

One of the things I love about the place I am at now, nobody cares what you do or don't do, what you own, what tack you use etc. We are all busy looking after our own.
We've got people who don't ride, who says you have to.

 

[selside]

I agree that good riding is a 2 way exchange between rider and mount, regardless of methods or style. A sweeping generalisation of course but society has changed massively since the 60s too. When I learnt to ride as a child - late 60s - folk tended to trust the "professionals" and be less questioning. What the doctor, policeman, bank manager, teacher, riding instructor said was taken as fact. There were fewer books about horsemanship and you accepted instruction because you wanted to do things "correctly". Things have changed a lot and over the decades I've tried to retune to the changes where they result in more sympathetic and softer ways of riding. I would say that (good) modern teaching does this better than the older more military based heels down, heart up be the boss at all times methods.

I accept I was a very unquestioning young rider from a non horsey family who could have done more to find out about the wider equine world. But the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction for my liking now. Dr Google, legions of books, endless online resources and the many and varied horse gurus who broadcasting their methods make me think there is almost too much information out there! Too much contradictory new, faddy, opinionated guidance that people are picking up and experimenting with, often piecemeal. I see people at my loaning yard trying out multiple techniques they've read about and seen, often badly.

New is good where it comes from better understanding of horse psychology or physiology, ;less so when it exploits human desires to fit in, be on trend or suppress horse's instincts. Rant of a grumpy old woman over! ?

 

[carthorse]

I agree that good riding is a 2 way exchange between rider and mount, regardless of methods or style. A sweeping generalisation of course but society has changed massively since the 60s too. When I learnt to ride as a child - late 60s - folk tended to trust the "professionals" and be less questioning. What the doctor, policeman, bank manager, teacher, riding instructor said was taken as fact. There were fewer books about horsemanship and you accepted instruction because you wanted to do things "correctly". Things have changed a lot and over the decades I've tried to retune to the changes where they result in more sympathetic and softer ways of riding. I would say that (good) modern teaching does this better than the older more military based heels down, heart up be the boss at all times methods.

I accept I was a very unquestioning young rider from a non horsey family who could have done more to find out about the wider equine world. But the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction for my liking now. Dr Google, legions of books, endless online resources and the many and varied horse gurus who broadcasting their methods make me think there is almost too much information out there! Too much contradictory new, faddy, opinionated guidance that people are picking up and experimenting with, often piecemeal. I see people at my loaning yard trying out multiple techniques they've read about and seen, often badly.

New is good where it comes from better understanding of horse psychology or physiology, ;less so when it exploits human desires to fit in, be on trend or suppress horse's instincts. Rant of a grumpy old woman over! ?

Selside I completely agree with your second paragraph and I think it's why there are so many "problem" horses about nowadays. There's a lack of consistency in how things are done so if a horse changes home he may suddenly find everything he's been taught is now unacceptable because the new owner follows a different guru, how is he to understand that? And yet through no fault of his own he's blamed. There also seem to be a lot of riders and handlers who's experience is mostly based on what they've read and seen rather than any significant hands on experience and when they go and buy what they think suits their image it can get very messy - time was when people just didn't buy like that, they learned how to do things and then maybe slightly underhorsed themselves for a first horse because overhorsing was seriously looked down on. Natural horsemanship methods, while not intrinsically bad, are often badly performed by people who don't understand them and they can really screw up horses and, with the wrong horse, put handlers at risk. And when you look at some of the traditional handling are the basics so very different? When I was a child there was a small elderly gentleman near us who bred Shires - he was old enough that in the past he had worked them - and watching him quietly bring three stallions in together with them all completely calm and attentive used to fascinate me, and he could pass one of those horses to me or anyone completely sure it would behave. To this day that, to me, is gold standard horsemanship not all this gadgetry and showmanship and talk of different methods - though maybe not with the roll up in one hand!

 

[newforest]

I am surprised moving home doesn't screw the horse up. It would be like us moving to another country and being asked to do something in another language.

Having recently moved mine away from the place she's known since she was a baby, the only consistent she had was me standing in a field not really knowing how I was going to do things!
I wonder though as handlers/ riders how consistent we are with the one we have?

 

[carthorse]

I certainly try to be consistent, though much as he's a horse not a machine so am I a person - we both make mistakes and have off days.

I think the effect things like moving home on them has depends on the horse. Jim, even with the same owner took ages and when I moved him back to his old yard thinking he'd settle straight back in he was just as unsettled for probably 9 months despite at that point moving with a companion too. Little Un pretty much looks around to find food, checks I'm there and decides all is ok with his world though he may be a bit inclined to break away when lead for a few weeks in an effort to explore the yard and field areas.

Riding wise Little Un is also not bothered by incompetence, you can almost see a look of glee as he realises he can go where he wants and steal mouthfuls of whatever takes his fancy, though he can't cope with nervous riders. Jim, well incompetence was tolerated if it was inoffensive (ie sat there very still and made no attempt at telling him anything) but was firmly and quickly dealt with if it annoyed him! It was NOT wise to annoy him. He was the same to handle too, a child could generally handle him in total safety as long as they did things his way, but on the days you knew there was a problem (eg hunt had been around, a colt on the yard, mares coming into season for the first time in spring) then I would be very careful who handled him if I couldn't be there.