Toyota Rav
- Thread starter Bengi1991
- Start date
I have an old T reg 2 door RAV4 which is our daily runabout. Fun fast car for general driving and totally skidproof in bad weather. We actually prefer driving it in bad conditions to our Disco.
Just be careful someone doesn't try to sell you a 1.8 model as they are not 4wd.
Just be careful someone doesn't try to sell you a 1.8 model as they are not 4wd.
A friend has one. She really likes it, but has had a horrendous year when a lot of the electronic things went wrong and were very expensive to put right.
We have a P reg rav, which I now get the use of. I love it, it's a fab car and has been totally reliable. Had nothing wrong with it at all until recently and that's really related to its age and general wear and tear more than anything else. Only thing is it not cheap to run and is a bit of a gas-guzzler. But I suspect newer models are better? At least that's the impression I get from reading other people's reviews on them.
Rav 4
Overall a good car, but as noted not the most fuel efficient. Derbysihre Police use them and given a 'good' driver you can get reasonable MPG, but like anything else, add a trailer and watch the needle drop.
They are what the purists would call 'not a real 4X4'. You have no control where the power goes - great if you don't want to get involved with extra gear levers and the like, but limiting if you ever need to decide how much power and where you need it.
The latest 6 speed manuals are ace ! but not cheap
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The only downside I've heard, but not experienced is that a clutch is a major job with bill to match.
Overall a good car, but as noted not the most fuel efficient. Derbysihre Police use them and given a 'good' driver you can get reasonable MPG, but like anything else, add a trailer and watch the needle drop.
They are what the purists would call 'not a real 4X4'. You have no control where the power goes - great if you don't want to get involved with extra gear levers and the like, but limiting if you ever need to decide how much power and where you need it.
The latest 6 speed manuals are ace ! but not cheap
(The only downside I've heard, but not experienced is that a clutch is a major job with bill to match.
Wouldn't want to tow with mine...more toy than work vehicle.
Steev...what do you mean about 'control where the power goes'...cannot see how it differs from our Disco (both are manual) even down to operation manually of diff lock???
Clutches are a weak point!!!
Steev...what do you mean about 'control where the power goes'...cannot see how it differs from our Disco (both are manual) even down to operation manually of diff lock???
Clutches are a weak point!!!
Where does the power go ?
If you are a purist (read anorak) of 4X4 then these things matter.
Things like the RAV are permanent 4 wheel drive, and you have no control over where the power goes.
Not sure how much detail to go into here before it becomes a mechanics lesson so I'll do my best to keep it short(ish).
Road vehicles have a differential gearing that allows the wheel on one side of an axle to turn at a different speed to the other. This is needed because as you go round a corner the wheel on the inside of the curve travels less distance than the wheel on the outside. If you had a solid axle the result would be massive trye wear as they fought against each other. Effectively one or both would be 'skidding' for the duration of the curve.
If you look at the underneath of a disco for example you will see a bulge, about the size of a small football in the back axle, and another in the front axle. These are the 'diffs'. What you don't see is that there is also one in the middle to allow the front wheels and back wheels to be driven at different speeds to, or to control what percentage of power goes to what end of the car. Most 4X4s do not apply equal power to front and back, there will be something more akin to a 60 - 40 split but this is a design feature of the manufacturers choosing.
What this all means is that if you lifted up one wheel of a normal car and put it in gear the wheel off the ground would turn, but the one on the ground wouldn't. The diff puts the power to the path of least resistance - in this case the wheel off the ground. Please do NOT try this - take my word for it.
If you take a 4X4 for MOT when they do the brake test they need to take this into account because turning the wheels of just one axle will, via the connecting axle and diff try to turn the other axle resulting in very expensive damage (that's why there is a warning sticker to this end on mostg 4X4s).
So your 'normal' 4 wheel drive doesn't allow you to choose where the power goes. It is either by 'dumb' mechanical diffs or more recently electronics. Either way it isn't you that chooses.
Compared to . . .
Vehicles designed for more off road use will have combinations of :-
High / low ratio boxes.
2 or 4 wheel drive (may be selected electronically on the run with a dash switch - like my now long gone Ssanyong Musso) - or by some sort of gear lever (normally at low speeds only), or even by having 'freewheeling' front wheel hubs that you need to get out and select / de-select.
Centre diff lock. Allows you to lock the front axle to the back axle. This means that if, for example the front wheels have no grip the diff is prevented from putting all the drive there and made to give some to the rear wheels, thus hopefully getting you unstuck.
Cross axle diff lock does the same but on one axle, so if the left wheel is spinning but the right has grip selecting cross axle diff lock will force both wheels to turn, once more heopfully getting you unstuck.
Add the two together, cross and inter and now any one wheel having grip will provide movement.
HOWEVER - and note this well. If you lock either or both the diffs on normal driving conditions you will cause serious and very expensive damage to your vehcile as the differing road speeds present at each wheel will set up stresses in the drive train. It may also seriously affect your steering and overl handling.
Diff locks are only to be used in adverse conditions and unlocked as soon as possible.
Hmmmmm Sorry that went on a bit but hopefully explains it.
I used to drive an 8 (double back axles and double front axles) wheel tipper on quarries. I could lock inter axle (left to right) or inter axle (both backs) or both. Selecting them both always got me out of trouble but at the cost of steering. Nearly put me over a cliff face once when I forgot to unlock them and tried to steer.
If you are a purist (read anorak) of 4X4 then these things matter.
Things like the RAV are permanent 4 wheel drive, and you have no control over where the power goes.
Not sure how much detail to go into here before it becomes a mechanics lesson so I'll do my best to keep it short(ish).
Road vehicles have a differential gearing that allows the wheel on one side of an axle to turn at a different speed to the other. This is needed because as you go round a corner the wheel on the inside of the curve travels less distance than the wheel on the outside. If you had a solid axle the result would be massive trye wear as they fought against each other. Effectively one or both would be 'skidding' for the duration of the curve.
If you look at the underneath of a disco for example you will see a bulge, about the size of a small football in the back axle, and another in the front axle. These are the 'diffs'. What you don't see is that there is also one in the middle to allow the front wheels and back wheels to be driven at different speeds to, or to control what percentage of power goes to what end of the car. Most 4X4s do not apply equal power to front and back, there will be something more akin to a 60 - 40 split but this is a design feature of the manufacturers choosing.
What this all means is that if you lifted up one wheel of a normal car and put it in gear the wheel off the ground would turn, but the one on the ground wouldn't. The diff puts the power to the path of least resistance - in this case the wheel off the ground. Please do NOT try this - take my word for it.
If you take a 4X4 for MOT when they do the brake test they need to take this into account because turning the wheels of just one axle will, via the connecting axle and diff try to turn the other axle resulting in very expensive damage (that's why there is a warning sticker to this end on mostg 4X4s).
So your 'normal' 4 wheel drive doesn't allow you to choose where the power goes. It is either by 'dumb' mechanical diffs or more recently electronics. Either way it isn't you that chooses.
Compared to . . .
Vehicles designed for more off road use will have combinations of :-
High / low ratio boxes.
2 or 4 wheel drive (may be selected electronically on the run with a dash switch - like my now long gone Ssanyong Musso) - or by some sort of gear lever (normally at low speeds only), or even by having 'freewheeling' front wheel hubs that you need to get out and select / de-select.
Centre diff lock. Allows you to lock the front axle to the back axle. This means that if, for example the front wheels have no grip the diff is prevented from putting all the drive there and made to give some to the rear wheels, thus hopefully getting you unstuck.
Cross axle diff lock does the same but on one axle, so if the left wheel is spinning but the right has grip selecting cross axle diff lock will force both wheels to turn, once more heopfully getting you unstuck.
Add the two together, cross and inter and now any one wheel having grip will provide movement.
HOWEVER - and note this well. If you lock either or both the diffs on normal driving conditions you will cause serious and very expensive damage to your vehcile as the differing road speeds present at each wheel will set up stresses in the drive train. It may also seriously affect your steering and overl handling.
Diff locks are only to be used in adverse conditions and unlocked as soon as possible.
Hmmmmm Sorry that went on a bit but hopefully explains it.
I used to drive an 8 (double back axles and double front axles) wheel tipper on quarries. I could lock inter axle (left to right) or inter axle (both backs) or both. Selecting them both always got me out of trouble but at the cost of steering. Nearly put me over a cliff face once when I forgot to unlock them and tried to steer.
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...so a bit unfair to call a RAV4 'not a real 4wd' when your defination excludes all Land/Range Rover and Discoveries.
Only really the Japanese cars that have optional 2/4wd, often engaged by getting out and altering on wheel hub, often a feature designed to save fuel.
I think a lot of off roaders would take issue with your definitions.
Sorry feeling pedantic tonight!!
Only really the Japanese cars that have optional 2/4wd, often engaged by getting out and altering on wheel hub, often a feature designed to save fuel.
I think a lot of off roaders would take issue with your definitions.
Sorry feeling pedantic tonight!!
real 4 wheel drive
Told you it was an anorak subject.
Yes RAVs are 4 wheel drive. So are things like Fiat Pandas but I'm not sure you'd consider towinbg a horsebox with one.
What I was trying to point out is that there are variations of '4 wheel drive'.
Landies, discos - rangies etc do as far as I recall have a diff lock (selectable via second gear stick) and I'm aware some have inter axle diffs too so no, I'm not saying these aren't 4 wheel drives at all - I'm saying they definately ARE.
I'm not knocking RAVS, they go like stink, grip the road like the tyres are made of glue and are amazingly great fun to drive.
They do not however allow you - the driver to decide where that power goes and if the going gets tough that's an option that is nice to have. That's why 'working' 4 WDs like the discos etc have the option to let the driver decide.
Told you it was an anorak subject.
Yes RAVs are 4 wheel drive. So are things like Fiat Pandas but I'm not sure you'd consider towinbg a horsebox with one.
What I was trying to point out is that there are variations of '4 wheel drive'.
Landies, discos - rangies etc do as far as I recall have a diff lock (selectable via second gear stick) and I'm aware some have inter axle diffs too so no, I'm not saying these aren't 4 wheel drives at all - I'm saying they definately ARE.
I'm not knocking RAVS, they go like stink, grip the road like the tyres are made of glue and are amazingly great fun to drive.
They do not however allow you - the driver to decide where that power goes and if the going gets tough that's an option that is nice to have. That's why 'working' 4 WDs like the discos etc have the option to let the driver decide.
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I would NEVER tow with my RAV...definately a toy but with gearbox and diff control actually handles better in snow then my manual Disco. Horsebox doesn't leave my barn in snow, can't make it up the drive without very sensitive driving.
However having once driven from Calais to the middle of Germany in a white out in a rear wheel drive BMW everything is relative
However having once driven from Calais to the middle of Germany in a white out in a rear wheel drive BMW everything is relative
owing to us blowing up our landrover and having to try and drive in the snow in a normal car - the family car had to go and be replaced by a 4x4 but a family car - the landy is nearly fixed!
We LOVED the Rav and almost bought one but on our way back to have a final look as it were ie we were going to actually buy it - we spotted an X trail on a Nissan Dealers forecourt, looked at it - and errr, bought that instead!
I think the Rav would have been a lot more fun but we have a dog with a savic travel cage and the flat back to the X trails boot meant we went for that instead!
Funny what makes you pic a car!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And I liked the 2 wd option, then the auto 4x4 which kicks in when needed and then the perm 4x4 mode - I guess for bad snow days!
Don't recall the rav having that option on it - but I'll happily stand correced!
We LOVED the Rav and almost bought one but on our way back to have a final look as it were ie we were going to actually buy it - we spotted an X trail on a Nissan Dealers forecourt, looked at it - and errr, bought that instead!
I think the Rav would have been a lot more fun but we have a dog with a savic travel cage and the flat back to the X trails boot meant we went for that instead!
Funny what makes you pic a car!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And I liked the 2 wd option, then the auto 4x4 which kicks in when needed and then the perm 4x4 mode - I guess for bad snow days!
Don't recall the rav having that option on it - but I'll happily stand correced!
No RAV is permanent 4wd, we have the two door which only just takes our Jack Russell but is a great fun car!!
I have an 04 plate Rav which I bought on a total whim last year when taking my economic and sensible Yaris into the dealers for a minor repair. So now I have a gas guzzling 4x4 (and I'm informed its permanently 4x4) and the insurance lept up. But I absolutely love it. Its a 3 door, as I didnt want or need a big car, and the back seats go flat easily, to carry larger loads. It was fab in the snow and I didnt lose a days work and got to the farm daily too.
Are RAVs 4WD ?
Derbyshire Police (for whom I work and thus got in at 5 this morning) use RAVs as response cars. The ones they use are permanent 4WD but live in a 'strange land' that Derbyshire ssem to have created for them.
I am not authorised to drive 4WD for them (despite owning a Ssanyong Musso for many years that does have electronically selectable 2 / 4WD and dif locks).
However Derbysihre are happy to let me drive the RAV on my 'standard police force driving mermit' over anything I can get it over / through . . . . Unless it snows - at which point because the 4WD and diff locks (doesn't have one) are not driver controllable it is no longer counted as 4WD.
Derbyshire Police (for whom I work and thus got in at 5 this morning) use RAVs as response cars. The ones they use are permanent 4WD but live in a 'strange land' that Derbyshire ssem to have created for them.
I am not authorised to drive 4WD for them (despite owning a Ssanyong Musso for many years that does have electronically selectable 2 / 4WD and dif locks).
However Derbysihre are happy to let me drive the RAV on my 'standard police force driving mermit' over anything I can get it over / through . . . . Unless it snows - at which point because the 4WD and diff locks (doesn't have one) are not driver controllable it is no longer counted as 4WD.
They are great!!!! In my opinion. My mum has an x reg and I used to drive around in it as a learner... I found it so easy and comfortable!
The only problems were the fuel consumption... and the towbar for the trailer. We do use it to cart our old trailer around but the boot door on this particular model was too low to have a fixed towbar on it.. so we have a removable one we have to take on and off everytime we use the trailer (if it's on the boot door can't open!)
But that's the only issues with it. We've had it 5 years now and (touch wood!) nothing has gone wrong with it. It is a great car so I'd definitely consider it.
Hope this helps!
The only problems were the fuel consumption... and the towbar for the trailer. We do use it to cart our old trailer around but the boot door on this particular model was too low to have a fixed towbar on it.. so we have a removable one we have to take on and off everytime we use the trailer (if it's on the boot door can't open!)
But that's the only issues with it. We've had it 5 years now and (touch wood!) nothing has gone wrong with it. It is a great car so I'd definitely consider it.
Hope this helps!
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