update with Libby(very fast pony)!!!!

[hannah_xx]

Well ermm all your advice was great but..
I tried to do you said..

Start in walk, ask for some trot a few paces at a time and then ask for the downward transition. Concentrate on getting quality transitions and count the number of paces to give you focus.

haha well the second i give the slightest nudge to trot, there is no way i can get her to do just 4-5 paces,, she just rushes off, if i don't let her she sticks her head up. seriously when i try and walk again she just jogs and makes it very awkard for me to ride.

Other than lots of transitions, something that works really well with her is working our way round the school putting 10m circles in at each marker, she soon settles and starts to listen.

Well i done a few of these small circles which were fine, i tried to do some halt transitions, she will not stand she just backs up and dances around on her feet. there is no settling down, she does not do calm

i keep her busy with transitions, circles, changes of rein, 5m loops, leg yield and demi vaultes. After a while she is concentrating so hard on what is coming next that she has to slow down and listen.
Let us know how you get on and good luck. Forward thinking horses are great work with, really rewarding but not always easy.

hmm as i said circles ect don't do much for her as the second i start trotting shes off trotting around as fast as possible. Canter well hmm haha more like gallop, tried do the Demi Vaults, crikey thought she was gonna topple over!

Work in slower paces and transitions. Get her to listen.

HAHAHHHAA try telling Libby this! she WONT do slow, she tries to listen but does not understand what slow is

Right think you all gather the problems now. Today was the worst she has ever been. Got on her walked around, asked for trot..wee off she goes gets all hyped and fired up and trots around as fast as possible. she starts to canter and my god shes like a rocket.
Got off and free schooled her which is fun because she is brilliant at it (and thought it might wear her out a bit..no that didnt work.

Went and told owner that didn't think she was happy in that bit. Okay we try other bit, (still strong bit). Got on and had no control, even worse that before. so we try another..OH MY GOD i have never rode such a fast pony in such a small school, she was galloping around soo fast it was impossible to stop her! tried steering her into the wall but that didn't work, some how managed to get her to jog and i jumped off! Cor that was scary! (wish i got it on video).Owner then free schooled her some more for about 10 mins (after allready been in the school about an hour now) right then i get on again, tried some American gag thing (i think) oh no, Me nor Libby liked this got off piratically straight away. Right back to old bit but put double reins on..Well lets just say what an unsuccessful day with Libby (Romany was good today though! )
Yard owner said that basically its obvious that Libby was rushed her training, backed in a rush with no proper ground work ect, all Libby knows to do is go..AND GO FAST. She is not doing it to be nasty or naughty, its just what she has been taught and all she knows! YO (owner) and i are going to go right back to basics with her with lots of ground work, and teach her to calm and show her its not all about fast. Its difficult as im the only one how rides Libby..so owner do lots of lunging/free schooling as she is very taltented with that
im rather dissapointed as i was really looking forward to having a normal pony to ride for once, the only horses i ever ride latley have problems (as much as i LOVE romany, and Libby) i would quite like to have a nice ride. And i was REALLY looking forward to hacking out with Libby as Romany wont hack alone. So i guess all that will have to wait!
SORRY that was the longest post EVER! brownie points and cookies hoeever got this far!

 

[hannah_xx]

bumpty bump

 

[wundahoss]

Hi, if I read your original thread I can't remember it, so will just comment on this one - sorry if may be going over old ground.

It sounds to me like the horse is either in pain or very frightened. I would rule out pain first & foremost, including not using a bit until one can be used gently without causing her more pain. Regardless of whether it's bit or other pain, or fear/confusion causing her behaviour, I think it's counterproductive to try to use pain to control her - and a 'gentle' bit is painful enough if used with force.

After ruling out saddle, back, feet & other potential pain issues, I agree with your instructor - get back to the basics & make sure she has a good foundation before asking her for any more. I would also try to set things up - a safe area - so that you didn't have to attempt to force her into things - stopping for eg - for safety's sake, but rather you can *ask gently* and just persist for as long as it takes until she eventually slows, which is the time to reinforce her.

 

[Joyscarer]

What's she like on the lunge or long reins?

How was she when free schooled?

How is she in the field, is she still rushing about?

I wonder if this is a response to leg aids and how she would be with voice aids.

 

[summercandy]

I had a mare who was broken in by travellers and used in a cart for their trotting races.She sounds very similar to Libby in that she was always rushing off with her head in the air.She had pain issues in her hips and also in her poll.I had her seen by a chiropractor and a physio and she had to have a week off work afterwards and be started again from scratch. I put her in a lunge cavesson and rode her off of that,initially on the lunge just in case she took objection to it.With a bit she would throw her head around and refuse to work sensibly.As soon as I started riding from the cavesson she became a pleasure to ride.An EDT ruled out any issues with her mouth so I think it was more a deep rooted remembered pain issue and possibly connected to the problem in her poll. I spent months riding around as quietly as possible and did no fast work with her.Everytime she rushed off I quietly asked her back to walk using my voice staying as relaxed as possible with no rein contact. It took quite a long time but it did work once she realised that there was nobody hauling her around anymore.
Another option with a horse that likes to rush off is to start your schooling session in the canter allowing her to rush for a couple of circuits before asking for circles to slow her down.As soon as she is listening to the rider then you can ask for the slower work but I agree with keeping her busy all the time asking for transitions and leg yielding,shoulder in etc.

 

[hannah_xx]

Thanks for the replies everyone! however i don't think she is in pain, but i will discreetly mention it to her owner (YO), because i don't want to sound rude to her or anything lol.

What's she like on the lunge or long reins?

How was she when free schooled?

How is she in the field, is she still rushing about?

I wonder if this is a response to leg aids and how she would be with voice aids.

On the lunge she is good, i lunged her in just a headcollar yesterday and she was good but still rushes off, it was impossible to warm up propally in walk as she went straight into trot. I have not tried long reining her

Free schooling is brilliant she still circles around you, as listens to my body language and voice, However it can be difficult to get her to slow because she just wants to keep going lol.

In the field i have seen her rushing around a bit, but not too much. She is always in my face when i go to get Romany in lol

I thought at first she was very senstive to my leg, So when we free schooled her for the second time we left the stirrups down, But she was not bothered by them at all. She is good with voice aids when lunging, But riding not as good, well she is but once she gets moving shes in her own world

Thanks for the advice everyone, My YO is very good with the groundwork with the horses so hopefully she will work with Libby quite a bit.

 

[wundahoss]

Thanks for the replies everyone! however i don't think she is in pain, but i will discreetly mention it to her owner (YO), because i don't want to sound rude to her or anything lol.

On the lunge she is good, i lunged her in just a headcollar yesterday and she was good but still rushes off, it was impossible to warm up propally in walk as she went straight into trot. I have not tried long reining her

Free schooling is brilliant she still circles around you, as listens to my body language and voice, However it can be difficult to get her to slow because she just wants to keep going lol.

Curious to know what makes you sure it's not pain/discomfort?

Sorry, I took it at face value when you said earlier she was great on the ground, thought it was just ridden that was a prob. But from what you write above, she sounds far from 'good' to lunge, etc. IMO you need to teach her to *yield*(respond calmly & softly with understanding) to your cues on the ground before I'd even bother starting to ask for anything while riding.

I thought at first she was very senstive to my leg, So when we free schooled her for the second time we left the stirrups down, But she was not bothered by them at all.

Just because she's not bothered by stirrups hanging at her sides doesn't mean she's not over sensitive to leg cues. I would ensure she understands how to *yield* to fingertip pressure on her sides(& elsewhere) from the ground before using your legs for similar cues when ridden.

I presume the next questions have probably been analised already, but just in case... what is her general lifestyle like? How much exercise does she get? Is she stalled? What is she fed?

 

[hannah_xx]

Curious to know what makes you sure it's not pain/discomfort?

Sorry, I took it at face value when you said earlier she was great on the ground, thought it was just ridden that was a prob. But from what you write above, she sounds far from 'good' to lunge, etc. IMO you need to teach her to *yield*(respond calmly & softly with understanding) to your cues on the ground before I'd even bother starting to ask for anything while riding.



Just because she's not bothered by stirrups hanging at her sides doesn't mean she's not over sensitive to leg cues. I would ensure she understands how to *yield* to fingertip pressure on her sides(& elsewhere) from the ground before using your legs for similar cues when ridden.


I presume the next questions have probably been analised already, but just in case... what is her general lifestyle like? How much exercise does she get? Is she stalled? What is she fed?

Thanks for all your concern, But she is good on the ground with lunging, she is still full of energy but listens well to your voice and body language, Its just coming back down to walk which can sometimes be the problem but not half as bad as riding.

Don't think she had been ridden for a while before i loaned her only went out on a few hacks i think, i have only had her about a week! rode her 3-4 times, she lives out 24/7 and she was not being fed much untill i started giving her some chaff and mix (but not much)

Anyway shes not in my hands now, her owner, YO, is doing all the work with her so im not even doing anything with her now, and she is not going to be ridden until all the groundwork is done.

 

[beki x-x]

have you tried going completely back, maybe not riding for a few weeks/a month and doing some groundwork and teaching her to stand and the aids for it through your voice, so she has good foundations to start riding again?




ETA: only just read your above post