Collection and Extension

[Elaine_000]

Hi

I was lucky enough to join a lesson today where the instructor asked to keep the horse collected and then to extend (in trot mostly, but another rider collected in canter before extending to jump) ... I've tried to pick up some information on collection in archived threads (to save annoying everyone with continual questions, apologies ... ) ... I think collection may involve the gorgeous outline of the horse when they are 'on-the-bit', creating impulsion in their hind-quarters and a 'springy' feeling (sounds absolutely wonderful to be honest!) ...

I think my questions are, naively , ... why doesn't the horse interpret the contact on the bit as 'stop', and how does the horse cope with the (seemingly) opposing leg aids and bit-contact ... and is this what is meant by 'holding the horse' as in 'I could hardly hold him' ...

I'm not advanced enough to be able to do this myself yet and I bet it becomes clear as soon as you have to do it ... but if anyone's passing and knows ...

thanks , Elaine

 

[horseychicnz]

HI
I am certainly no expert but from what i've learnt at my dressage lessons is that to collect your horse you have to keep your leg aid on strong and you need to keep a good rein contact as the horse will just speed up. so it should result in a collected horse with nice elevated paces!
Also alernating your legs when you give the aids (left leg- right leg- left leg...) helps the horse under stand what you are meaning and not change gaits as some horses will think that is what you are asking- I think! it works with my horse anyway, hope this helps!!

 

[Elaine_000]

thanks for the reply Hannah! that makes alot more sense (especially with the alternating leg aids ... )

 

[ros]

Hi Elaine

Yes, you can create a sort of false collection by egging the horse on with your legs and holding him back with the reins at the same time, and although to the uninitiated it may look impressive, it isn't true collection and it usually just makes the horse frustrated and cross.

What you're really aiming for is:

Your hands, via the bit/reins, ask the horse to relax his jaw. If he doesn't do this, he can't relax his neck and back muscles, and that means he can't bring his hind legs properly underneath his body to propel himself forward efficiently.

Your legs ask him to "step under" which means he propels himself forward more efficiently and covers more ground without having to break out of his natural rhythm; that's the difference between impulsion and speed.

Your seat regulates his direction (weight aids) and speed.

Of course, it isn't always as straightforward as that, and it can take a little while to educate a horse that using your leg doesn't mean "tank off", and you may also find that if he's is hell bent on doing so your seat alone isn't enough to change his mind! But those are the basic principles.

 

[Elaine_000]

thanks ros, you've hit on exactly what I meant ... it's not something I'm ready to try yet, but how does the horse know to relax his jaw?

 

[ros]

Hi Elaine

You ask him with your hands, by squeezing your fingers on the reins, on and off until he gives to you and understands. If you can't get him to understand in a snaffle bit, a curb bit like a Pelham can help because there's a reflex point in the chin groove where the curb chain sits. Heather has a little book by the old French master Beudant with a passage underlined which says that the curb bit prepares the horse for the snaffle - not the other way round as we tend to think nowadays!

Once the horse gets into the habit of going the right way, with his jaw relaxed and his back rounded and his hind legs swinging along nicely underneath him, you don't have to do much at all to keep him there - this is what's called "self-carriage". You shouldn't have to "hold him together" by strong bit contact. If you look at pictures of classically trained horses (like those at the Spanish Riding School) being ridden in collection you'll probably notice the reins are quite slack - certainly not the way a lot of dressage riders ride these days - and they can be slack because the horse has learned over a period of time to feel the tiniest vibration on the rein. You don't need the reins to be tight in order for him to feel you as some instructors would have you believe, although for him to respond in the right way is something he has to learn over a period. It doesn't come all at once.

 

[barnesp33]

Hi Elaine

You actually ask a very good question, it is not at all basic so have no apologies for asking this.

Collection is about how the horses weight is shifted back to be carried more by the hindlegs, and so therefore there are varying degrees of collection. Initially a horse wants to pull himself along with his front legs and the aim of dressage is to ask him to push himself along with his back legs. It is not about shortening the length of stride or about slowing down then speeding up.

As Ros has already said it must not be achieved through strong legs and hands, that will only lead to artificial gaits and will not serve to prolong the horses joints etc.

There are lots of things that go into asking for collection - the horse must be calm, supple, straight, balanced, listening to the rider, on the bit, forward thinking - these all play a part.

True extension comes from true collection. The collection coils the energy up like a spring that is released through into an extended pace.

Peter

 

[barnesp33]

Hi Ros

I know that Heather advocates the use of the curb bit to give this release through the curb groove which releases the whole of the body. There are two sides to this coin.

For a horse to relax into a round outline then he must be working through from behind - but to do this he must be relaxed in the jaw and poll. This is one of those questions that will always have people divided in their answer. On the one side there are those who say that you first release the poll and jaw through flexions - as thought about by a guy called Baucher. The other side says that you must not focus so intently on the head and neck and by correct riding the horse from hindlegs forward then the horse will soften his topline and relax into the hand of the rider. It is all interesting stuff

With regards to self carriage - this is a far more in depth area than mostly thought. A horse can be in a nice relaxed soft round outline, going walk trot and canter with a good elastic contact but he may still not be in self carriage.

Self carriage takes years to achieve - it means that the horse is carrying himself - not just round in the neck. He should be balanced over all four legs. Balance here means that he does not favour one way or the other, he also does not push with his hindlegs more than he carries with them. He should be straight - this means that the right hind follows the right fore, left hind to left fore; straight also means that he is using all the joints of each hindleg the same as the other. He can carry his body and the rider through all of the movements showing grace and harmony of movement. For this he needs years of gymnastic development.

Peter