...and in reply re: Winterwood/ the Monty Roberts post - yes, I've read a load of his books and been to demos and talks and so on (not claiming to be an expert of course, but have done a lot of research!), I can see past the join up but it is still the main part of the theory and the major way he would work with most horses. And my point was the same anyway for the pressure halter work he does with problem loaders - because that's also based on negative reinforcement, which does work very quickly but is not such a pleasant way to learn, especially for a horse in a stressful situation. The horse is just submitting to the handler in response to a horrible feeling on its head - not working with you because it actually wants to, which is what clicker training would achieve in the same situation??
i don't know, i'm not saying you're wrong, but to me personally it just seems like why use all these pressure methods when there's something so much nicer!
i don't know, i'm not saying you're wrong, but to me personally it just seems like why use all these pressure methods when there's something so much nicer!